Dark Force Entertainment Discussion Thread

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by Fiocca_Cola

If you've never known a vendor banned by Paypal or known someone who worked for a bank, in my case Chase, then I can understand why you wouldn't know about Paypal's guidelines for chargebacks and banning vendors or about banks (backing the credit cards) having a similar process for red-flagging and then banning. You may want to look into it, though, as there is a similar process for purchasers who file too many chargebacks.

Originally Posted by DaveyJoe

Pre-orders have been satisfactory for customers and successful for labels such as: Vinegar Syndrome, Mondo Macabro, Arrow Video, Scream Factory, Criterion Collection, Blue Underground, Kino Lorber, Severin Films, Vestron Video, and others. If preorders don't work for a specific label for reasons, what is the outlying variable?

Trolls. Right now, there are so many people who seem to just be hanging around to screw with Dark Force, more specifically with David, and those are the people who could make trouble for the company were they to offer pre-orders. Now, if they wanted to offer pre-orders with a vetting process, such as pre-orders to pre-existing customers or a subscription service, something of that nature, that would weed out most if not all of the Facebook trolls.

Originally Posted by DaveyJoe

I was disappointed that Zombie Nightmare wasn't available. Dave had mentioned they found a bunch of copies recently. I wanted to pair it with Dead Pit to qualify for free shipping. As of now I haven't purchased yet

They found a bunch up in Washington, where Bill is. They haven't sent them down yet or, if they have, they haven't arrived. He was going to ask for some, but that was just a couple of weeks ago or so.

[FN2190]

Originally Posted by miribeau

If you've never known a vendor banned by Paypal or known someone who worked for a bank, in my case Chase, then I can understand why you wouldn't know about Paypal's guidelines for chargebacks and banning vendors or about banks (backing the credit cards) having a similar process for red-flagging and then banning. You may want to look into it, though, as there is a similar process for purchasers who file too many chargebacks.

Trolls. Right now, there are so many people who seem to just be hanging around to screw with Dark Force, more specifically with David, and those are the people who could make trouble for the company were they to offer pre-orders. Now, if they wanted to offer pre-orders with a vetting process, such as pre-orders to pre-existing customers or a subscription service, something of that nature, that would weed out most if not all of the Facebook trolls.

They found a bunch up in Washington, where Bill is. They haven't sent them down yet or, if they have, they haven't arrived. He was going to ask for some, but that was just a couple of weeks ago or so.

Why would a vetting process be needed? Again it’s not difficult. If you know you’re pressing 1k open up preorders a month or two in advance. 1 copy per customer. It’s plain and simple. All of the BS time spent on dual identities, threats and allowing scalpers to integrate themselves into the buying process makes it difficult for true collectors to have an opportunity at a successful score.

[DaveyJoe]

Every opening paragraph is passive aggressively insulting. Very polite on the surface but there's always some element about how you are ignorant about something. Or you're too young to understand how life works. It's very tiresome.

[bigdaddyhorse]

Originally Posted by FN2190

Why would a vetting process be needed? Again it’s not difficult. If you know you’re pressing 1k open up preorders a month or two in advance. 1 copy per customer. It’s plain and simple. All of the BS time spent on dual identities, threats and allowing scalpers to integrate themselves into the buying process makes it difficult for true collectors to have an opportunity at a successful score.

Just be patient, none of these discs ever really go out of print, there's always more "found" just in time to see who hasn't completely given up on logging into whatever site is selling them.

Thankfully I didn't care enough for Dead Pit to upgrade to blu, I will avoid as many of these releases as I possibly can due to the BS way of running their "business", only top wants make me jump through Code Red hoops.

The funny thing is, they ****ing know it. Fans have asked about this, cried about this, sent death treats about this, and offered simple solutions for the last 5+ years and yet it never changes. That means Bill and whoever else doesn't want it to change, probably so they can double the price on the "last 100 remaining copies" for a month or 2 before miraculously "finding" more, or doing a new run with a slipcover and some features. How ****ing hard can it be to keep up with 1000 copies? 20 boxes of 50 right? Simple ****ing math you don't an app for, you could do it on a napkin if you wanted to!

End of rant, awaiting suspension. Maybe the site will be nice and just delete this post like any other time I've let my feelings about Code Red and Bill be known. I just don't care anymore and so sick of seeing the dog and pony show, now with another sale site acting using their practices.

[1234567?]

Originally Posted by miribeau

If you've never known a vendor banned by Paypal or known someone who worked for a bank, in my case Chase, then I can understand why you wouldn't know about Paypal's guidelines for chargebacks and banning vendors or about banks (backing the credit cards) having a similar process for red-flagging and then banning. You may want to look into it, though, as there is a similar process for purchasers who file too many chargebacks.

Depends on who is doing the chargeback. Paypal can be done threw email, banks usually require paperwork. Also how many charge backs are allowed. All insured and gov backed financial institutes allow one charge back, after that is becomes a different process ie (I.D. theft). Otherwise they can consider it a gross chargeback on the filer. I also don't buy this chargeback nonsense either, if a charge back is done on a pre-order there is no exchange of goods between the parties, IE the seller has not lost anything out of pocket at this point. It just means the seller is now up an additional unit. I have been threw the process rather recently. I had a double charge and I paid cash. I was able to get everything settled after a bit of a process and me getting vary angry at them lol, long story on that. I just can't imagine there would be that many haters out there that would be willing to go threw all of that. Also what the hell about paypal anyway's Miri, they don't have to use paypal anyways as a payment for pre-order. They can do credit or debit only, I imagine paypal is the source of the supposed chargebacks?

Every opening paragraph is passive aggressively insulting. Very polite on the surface but there's always some element about how you are ignorant about something. Or you're too young to understand how life works. It's very tiresome.

ha ha, I noticed that too.

[AKNewbie]

Does vetting involve wrassling the Demon, or something?

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by FN2190

Why would a vetting process be needed? Again it’s not difficult. If you know you’re pressing 1k open up preorders a month or two in advance. 1 copy per customer. It’s plain and simple. All of the BS time spent on dual identities, threats and allowing scalpers to integrate themselves into the buying process makes it difficult for true collectors to have an opportunity at a successful score.

FN2190,

The vetting process would be needed to weed out those who would be placing orders specifically for the purpose of filing a chargeback a couple of weeks later. Keep in mind, some of the people who have posted in the last few months on Facebook seem genuinely deranged in their level of animosity for a business owner they have never met. Most people wouldn't waste their time going out of their way to file a chargeback against a company in an attempt to harm that company. Unfortunately, crazy people do crazy things.

When an acquaintance of mine, maybe six years ago, was banned from receiving payments via paypal, after specifically taking orders on items they were supposed to deliver at a later date, they had to change the name of the business, get a new business address, officially name someone else as owner, have someone else act as the representative of the company, all in order to set up a new payment structure so that they would be allowed to use Paypal again. They stopped selling anything that would take too long to get in and stopped selling to people in Alaska and Hawaii and Canada. This saved their business but only worked because they were married with different last names and two home addresses. How many people have that kind of set up, so they can get a second bite at the Paypal apple?

Originally Posted by DaveyJoe

Every opening paragraph is passive aggressively insulting. Very polite on the surface but there's always some element about how you are ignorant about something. Or you're too young to understand how life works. It's very tiresome.

DaveyJoe,

My response to Fiocca was specifically for Fiocca, because of the statement made, that claimed what I was saying about Paypal and CC operating banks was wrong. Anyone with experience of red-flagging and banning in the financial world would not have responded with disbelief to something they already knew to be true, so I responded to inform a person who did not know about this, not to talk down to or insult people who did know about it.

As to ignorance, there is nothing wrong with or bad about not knowing some fact that has never been revealed to you. We are all ignorant of many things, thankfully, or life would be very boring. My explaining this issue was not intended as an insult to anyone, including you DaveyJoe, and I am sorry to have caused you hurt feelings. I will try to remember to include a salutation to indicate the person to whom I am talking, in the future, to avoid doing this to you again.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by 1234567?

1 Depends on who is doing the chargeback. Paypal can be done threw email, banks usually require paperwork. 2 Also how many charge backs are allowed. All insured and gov backed financial institutes allow one charge back, after that is becomes a different process ie (I.D. theft). Otherwise they can consider it a gross chargeback on the filer. I also don't buy this chargeback nonsense either, if a charge back is done on a pre-order there is no exchange of goods between the parties, IE the seller has not lost anything out of pocket at this point. 3 It just means the seller is now up an additional unit. I have been threw the process rather recently. I had a double charge and I paid cash. I was able to get everything settled after a bit of a process and me getting vary angry at them lol, long story on that. I just can't imagine there would be that many haters out there that would be willing to go threw all of that. 4 Also what the hell about paypal anyway's Miri, they don't have to use paypal anyways as a payment for pre-order. They can do credit or debit only, I imagine paypal is the source of the supposed chargebacks?

1234567?,

1) It doesn't depend on who is doing the chargeback, any longer, unless that person has been red-flagged as an abuser of that process. Banking laws were changed during the last administration, thousands and thousands of new pages of regulations, and they can no longer consider who a person is, in any way, except if they have been previously identified as an abuser of the chargeback process.

2) Different numbers of chargebacks are allowed for different financial institutions, as to customers, before red-flagging occurs. As to vendors, Chase is one of the largest banks and they have a process for a first-flagging after only one chargeback, that goes into the record of the vendor from the get-go. As to red-flagging or banning, I don't know the number they use. I know that around a dozen chargebacks in the first month, for items ordered in advance, with email confirmation of a delivery date two-months out, got a friend banned from Paypal forever, such that they had to put everything in someone else's name to start over.

3) It doesn't just result in the seller being up one of whatever they were selling. The record the chargeback follows the seller, depending on the banking institution. Paypal keeps records from the first one and they do not delete those records. Chase bank keeps records from the first one and they do not delete those records. The first chargeback against a vendor filed in either location follows that vendor as part of their permanent record with that financial institution. Just because they haven't sent out the item so they didn't lose out on the ability to sell it again doesn't mean they didn't get a strike against them.

4) You are correct that no vendor is required to use Paypal, however, it is still the most common credit-card-masking intermediary in use for online payments to independent vendors. Amazon Payments is far less tolerant than Paypal, when it comes to chargebacks and, owing to ebay, Paypal is something that nearly everyone has the ability to use. As to the most common source of chargebacks, no, Paypal is just an intermediary for credit cards to be used to pay without entering it at a vendor's site. Chargebacks go through the card company, specifically their sponsoring financial institution, and some of those are very unforgiving when it comes to a vendor with repeated chargebacks for non-delivery of goods, which is what Dark Force would be dealing with if they offered pre-orders.

That being said, they could offer a subscription service where a person signs up to be notified, with a code, via email, and then logs into the site to complete an order already set up by Dark Force, allowing Dark Force to collect payment right before they ship, cutting off some of the opportunity to abuse the system. I have to say, VS is really lucky that people who buy from them are so nice and trustworthy. Their customers, including many on this board, are good people and would never do anything like this. Unfortunately, not all who have discovered Dark Force are so decent.




If you guys, this is to everyone, have ideas as to what they could do to improve, you can always spitball and post here. They listened when we all said we wanted them to have a newsletter like VS and Ronin, to make these release announcements, and they are setting that up.

[cloudnine]

Originally Posted by miribeau

1234567?,

1) It doesn't depend on who is doing the chargeback, any longer, unless that person has been red-flagged as an abuser of that process. Banking laws were changed during the last administration, thousands and thousands of new pages of regulations, and they can no longer consider who a person is, in any way, except if they have been previously identified as an abuser of the chargeback process.

2) Different numbers of chargebacks are allowed for different financial institutions, as to customers, before red-flagging occurs. As to vendors, Chase is one of the largest banks and they have a process for a first-flagging after only one chargeback, that goes into the record of the vendor from the get-go. As to red-flagging or banning, I don't know the number they use. I know that around a dozen chargebacks in the first month, for items ordered in advance, with email confirmation of a delivery date two-months out, got a friend banned from Paypal forever, such that they had to put everything in someone else's name to start over.

3) It doesn't just result in the seller being up one of whatever they were selling. The record the chargeback follows the seller, depending on the banking institution. Paypal keeps records from the first one and they do not delete those records. Chase bank keeps records from the first one and they do not delete those records. The first chargeback against a vendor filed in either location follows that vendor as part of their permanent record with that financial institution. Just because they haven't sent out the item so they didn't lose out on the ability to sell it again doesn't mean they didn't get a strike against them.

4) You are correct that no vendor is required to use Paypal, however, it is still the most common credit-card-masking intermediary in use for online payments to independent vendors. Amazon Payments is far less tolerant than Paypal, when it comes to chargebacks and, owing to ebay, Paypal is something that nearly everyone has the ability to use. As to the most common source of chargebacks, no, Paypal is just an intermediary for credit cards to be used to pay without entering it at a vendor's site. Chargebacks go through the card company, specifically their sponsoring financial institution, and some of those are very unforgiving when it comes to a vendor with repeated chargebacks for non-delivery of goods, which is what Dark Force would be dealing with if they offered pre-orders.

That being said, they could offer a subscription service where a person signs up to be notified, with a code, via email, and then logs into the site to complete an order already set up by Dark Force, allowing Dark Force to collect payment right before they ship, cutting off some of the opportunity to abuse the system. I have to say, VS is really lucky that people who buy from them are so nice and trustworthy. Their customers, including many on this board, are good people and would never do anything like this. Unfortunately, not all who have discovered Dark Force are so decent.




If you guys, this is to everyone, have ideas as to what they could do to improve, you can always spitball and post here. They listened when we all said we wanted them to have a newsletter like VS and Ronin, to make these release announcements, and they are setting that up.

Miribeau, why do you have to defend every possible thing concerning Dark Force with all this babble? They are big boys and don't need your help. Even Ruined has dropped out of the constant Dark Force defense, maybe because he doesn't want to compete with you or is just bored with it.

[babybreese]

Just a Disco Ball spinning and nothing else - YouTube

Stop feeding the troll fur chrissakes.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by cloudnine

Miribeau, why do you have to defend every possible thing concerning Dark Force with all this babble? They are big boys and don't need your help. Even Ruined has dropped out of the constant Dark Force defense, maybe because he doesn't want to compete with you or is just bored with it.

I've noticed that some of the people here, including the above, have a rather bizarre attitude toward label owners, specifically that the behaviours of label owners are to be judged, good or bad, by you, and then discussed, within that framework. I have defended label owners, multiple label owners, on occasion, when the pile-on was severe enough to warrant it, however, I have rarely seen them as personally needing a defense, as I don't see what they do through the endlessly judgmental lens which appears to be employed by many of you. David doesn't require defending. He is providing a service, to be taken or left as each individual chooses. I take what he has to offer, as I take what Bill has to offer, as I take what Walt has to offer, as I take what Steven has to offer, and so on and so forth, on down the line. Complaining went out of fashion on the way to Jerusalem, still, into every generation, millions are born to continue that particular crusade. Whine on my friends, whine on....

[jcs913]

I love how Tom signs his name and full title after every post so we know it's really him. Nice touch and man is that convincing...
Anyways, what is the typical turn around time on these babies. I heard DF used to have quick shipment, or has that changed???

[tardif]

Originally Posted by DaveyJoe

Every opening paragraph is passive aggressively insulting. Very polite on the surface but there's always some element about how you are ignorant about something. Or you're too young to understand how life works. It's very tiresome.

Originally Posted by miribeau

Complaining went out of fashion on the way to Jerusalem, still, into every generation, millions are born to continue that particular crusade. Whine on my friends, whine on....

Get with the times DaveyJoe! Don’t you know complaining went out of fashion on the way to Jerusalem? You are obviously far too young to understand that

[Jope]

just ban it already. it’s already been warned several times about its long, rambling, monopolizing posts.

and yet, it persisted.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by jcs913

I love how Tom signs his name and full title after every post so we know it's really him. Nice touch and man is that convincing...
Anyways, what is the typical turn around time on these babies. I heard DF used to have quick shipment, or has that changed???

They began shipping immediately but, given there are hundreds of orders, it could be a week before they get it all shipped out. Last time they had this many orders I think it was around five days before the largest group of people stopped complaining about Paypal not having tracking yet and about three or so before the smaller group of people stopped complaining about how much faster they could have shipped it all and all the different methods they would have utilized in creating the shipping labels. Plus I imagine David is still a little ticked, as he has a right to be, so I'd say give it a week.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by tardif

Get with the times DaveyJoe! Don’t you know complaining went out of fashion on the way to Jerusalem? You are obviously far too young to understand that

Dude, you basically just accused the man of not being able to read, given that little piece of information is taught to kids in picture books with ten words a page. I get that you were joking but that's taking it a bit far, don't you think? If he were illiterate, he wouldn't be here, most certainly not on subtitle-complaint days.... At least Jope limits his hatred of me to dehumanizing me by referring to me as an object while, simultaneously, acknowledging my abilities to both read and write.

[indravayu]

It should be clear to everyone by now that there is something seriously wrong with mirifaux. A toxic combination of passive agressivism and autism.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by indravayu

It should be clear to everyone by now that there is something seriously wrong with mirifaux. A toxic combination of passive agressivism and autism.

I'm not aware of being passive aggressive, as that is never my intent, but I have been told I come off that way at times, due to the "Pollyannaness" that some in my family and inner circle find, well, let's say irritating, as one of several dominant traits in my personality.

As to the other, I've never heard anyone refer to autism as toxic before, at least not to my recollection, so I couldn't comment on your personal reasons for seeing it that way. Don't get me wrong, it is hardly a gift, but it isn't the toxic horror you make it out to be either. Autistics are different but we are people, just the same, different and still just like the rest of you. It is more likely that I just rub you the wrong way, not that autism or autistics are somehow toxic to you.

Although, come to think of it, isn't Ruined also a high functioning autistic? You can't stand him.... Okay, so it is possible that you really just don't like autistic people.

[bipbop13]

Originally Posted by Jope

just ban it already. it’s already been warned several times about its long, rambling, monopolizing posts.

and yet, it persisted.

The strange thing is that people get banned for arguing with it (I know). If it was banned permanently, many users would come back to post without fear of 1/2 a page of comma filled drama replies. Beginning to wonder if it's a moderator sock puppet account messing with us. If this were most of us doing this, we'd have been removed long ago.

[Thomas Irwin]

Originally Posted by miribeau

My explaining this issue was not intended as an insult to anyone, including you DaveyJoe, and I am sorry to have caused you hurt feelings. I will try to remember to include a salutation to indicate the person to whom I am talking, in the future, to avoid doing this to you again.

I think she just called you a snowflake.