Star Wars: Episode VII - The Force Awakens (USE SPOILER TAGS!)

[toddly6666]

Does anyone think the ghosts will show up? I hope not if that means the Hayden one has to show up.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by toddly6666

Does anyone think the ghosts will show up? I hope not if that means the Hayden one has to show up.

I think the only ghost we'll get is that of Luke Skywalker.

[Falaskan]

Originally Posted by rickah88

I think the only ghost we'll get is that of Luke Skywalker.

I doubt Luke or Leia will die. It'll be Han. Since Leia (better) be a Jedi, she might be tempted to turn to the dark side to bring Han back. if she believe it's possible that Darth Plageius could do it. Gosh I really wish I was a screenwriter in this! lol

[Kaiju]

dat speculation...

[Agent Bond]

Sheamus O'Shaunessy rumored to play Darth Vader and all I can think is:

[CinemaBlu]

Originally Posted by Falaskan

I doubt Luke or Leia will die. It'll be Han. Since Leia (better) be a Jedi, she might be tempted to turn to the dark side to bring Han back. if she believe it's possible that Darth Plageius could do it. Gosh I really wish I was a screenwriter in this! lol

If Leia's a Jedi in this, then Luke is a moron for training her. Leia would turn to the dark side in a second. She has too many attachments to be trained.

[EddieWilson1983]

Originally Posted by toddly6666

Does anyone think the ghosts will show up? I hope not if that means the Hayden one has to show up.

I actually liked Hayden as Anakin for the most part, because it gave the character humanity instead of relying on the "eternal badass with no faults" stereotype. To this day, I still don't see where the purists got that notion in the first place. I'd love to see a scene between Carrie Fisher and Hayden, where Anakin's ghost appears to Leia.

[EddieWilson1983]

Originally Posted by CinemaBlu

If Leia's a Jedi in this, then Luke is a moron for training her. Leia would turn to the dark side in a second. She has too many attachments to be trained.

Avoiding attachments is one of several reasons why the Jedi failed during the Dark Times. They were too isolated from everyone else, falsely believing all intense emotion would lead to the Dark Side.

[MCT]

Originally Posted by EddieWilson1983

I actually liked Hayden as Anakin for the most part, because it gave the character humanity instead of relying on the "eternal badass with no faults" stereotype. To this day, I still don't see where the purists got that notion in the first place. I'd love to see a scene between Carrie Fisher and Hayden, where Anakin's ghost appears to Leia.

Stop posting. Please.

[CinemaBlu]

Originally Posted by EddieWilson1983

Avoiding attachments is one of several reasons why the Jedi failed during the Dark Times. They were too isolated from everyone else, falsely believing all intense emotion would lead to the Dark Side.

That's not why they failed. Attachment and intense emotion is what made Anakin so vulnerable and led to him being seduced to the dark side.

And the Jedi weren't isolated. The Jedi Temple was in Coruscant, the most populated planet in the galaxy. In fact their main job is society was to maintain peaceful communication

[EddieWilson1983]

Originally Posted by CinemaBlu

That's not why they failed. Attachment and intense emotion is what made Anakin so vulnerable and led to him being seduced to the dark side.

No, what led him to the Dark Side was being forced to choose between true intimacy and blindly following orders. He was trained to always fight intense emotion, instead of finding healthy ways to release it. The more he resisted, the more conflicted he became, and Mace attempting to kill someone he thought could save Padme' was the last straw.

And the Jedi weren't isolated. The Jedi Temple was in Coruscant, the most populated planet in the galaxy. In fact their main job is society was to maintain peaceful communication

Its perfectly possible to be around tons of people, and still be internally isolated. When they weren't hopping between solar systems solving galactic problems, the Jedi stayed put in their temple, keeping solely to themselves. They were never shown socializing with anyone outside of a mission, and their code prevented them from loving anybody because they saw exclusive intimacy as a threat. That's why I like Yoda's lamenting in the "Sith" novel, where he says the Jedi failed to change because he wouldn't let them.

[blonde_devil]

Originally Posted by EddieWilson1983

I actually liked Hayden as Anakin for the most part, because it gave the character humanity instead of relying on the "eternal badass with no faults" stereotype. To this day, I still don't see where the purists got that notion in the first place. I'd love to see a scene between Carrie Fisher and Hayden, where Anakin's ghost appears to Leia.

I liked what they were trying to do but he just didn't pull it off. Too much of it came across as soap opera acting - usually way over the top. There are a few spots here and there where it works but for the most part, it is just bad.

[EddieWilson1983]

Originally Posted by blonde_devil

I liked what they were trying to do but he just didn't pull it off. Too much of it came across as soap opera acting - usually way over the top. There are a few spots here and there where it works but for the most part, it is just bad.

I blame Lucas more for the acting in the prequels, because he's said himself many times that filming is his least favored part of the process. He only directed them to avoid having to deal with too many "cooks" in the creative "kitchen". As for it resembling a soap opera, where do you think he got the phrase "space opera" from? Just sayin'...

[CinemaBlu]

Originally Posted by EddieWilson1983

No, what led him to the Dark Side was being forced to choose between true intimacy and blindly following orders. He was trained to always fight intense emotion, instead of finding healthy ways to release it. The more he resisted, the more conflicted he became, and Mace attempting to kill someone he thought could save Padme' was the last straw.

Its perfectly possible to be around tons of people, and still be internally isolated. When they weren't hopping between solar systems solving galactic problems, the Jedi stayed put in their temple, keeping solely to themselves. They were never shown socializing with anyone outside of a mission, and their code prevented them from loving anybody because they saw exclusive intimacy as a threat. That's why I like Yoda's lamenting in the "Sith" novel, where he says the Jedi failed to change because he wouldn't let them.

First of all, the Sith novel isn't canon. Don't quote it.

Second, Anakin rarely followed the Council's orders. He didn't start blindly following orders until he turned to the dark side. And the Jedi are encouraged to trust their own instincts. That's why the Council allowed Obi Wan to train Anakin despite not believing it was a good idea.

And third, the Jedi DID socialize. Remember in "Attack of the Clones" when Obi-Wan meets his "old buddy" at the diner. How much socializing did the Sith do? And the Jedi code encouraged them to be compassionate, meaning, love everybody unconditionally but without attachment. And intimacy isn't forbidden either. George Lucas himself has said that the Jedi aren't celibate.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by EddieWilson1983

No, what led him to the Dark Side was being forced to choose between true intimacy and blindly following orders. He was trained to always fight intense emotion, instead of finding healthy ways to release it. The more he resisted, the more conflicted he became, and Mace attempting to kill someone he thought could save Padme' was the last straw.

Its perfectly possible to be around tons of people, and still be internally isolated. When they weren't hopping between solar systems solving galactic problems, the Jedi stayed put in their temple, keeping solely to themselves. They were never shown socializing with anyone outside of a mission, and their code prevented them from loving anybody because they saw exclusive intimacy as a threat. That's why I like Yoda's lamenting in the "Sith" novel, where he says the Jedi failed to change because he wouldn't let them.

Exactly. The Jedi were so entrenched in their millennia-old dogma that they simply couldn't help Anakin manage his conflicted feelings (much less realise that he'd married in secret), which is what left him open to Palpatine's scheming ways when the old goat told Anakin exactly what he wanted to hear. And the punchline is delivered quite deliberately in ROTJ: it's Luke's unconditional love for his father which is what turns Anakin back to the good side and makes him sacrifice his life to save Luke. After all the bullshit that the Jedi came out with about having no attachments (which includes Yoda in Empire, to some extent), it's love which saves the galaxy in the end. Awwwwwwwwwww.

And thus Anakin fulfils the prophecy of balancing the Force: he destroyed the old ways of the Jedi and the evil ways of the Sith, leaving the path clear for Force users to choose their own destiny.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by MCT

Stop posting. Please.

Censorship! It's what's for dinner.

[thegoat]

Originally Posted by CinemaBlu

First of all, the Sith novel isn't canon. Don't quote it.

Second, Anakin rarely followed the Council's orders. He didn't start blindly following orders until he turned to the dark side. And the Jedi are encouraged to trust their own instincts. That's why the Council allowed Obi Wan to train Anakin despite not believing it was a good idea.

And third, the Jedi DID socialize. Remember in "Attack of the Clones" when Obi-Wan meets his "old buddy" at the diner. How much socializing did the Sith do? And the Jedi code encouraged them to be compassionate, meaning, love everybody unconditionally but without attachment. And intimacy isn't forbidden either. George Lucas himself has said that the Jedi aren't celibate.

The novel is based on the movie, so it can offer some insight. Nothing in the movie contradicts that line, so what's the problem?

Nobody's arguing that the Sith were good guys and that Anakin made the right choice. But if the Jedi had offered him more advice than "try not to let it get to you" regarding Padme's death, he would not have been looking for other solutions. I also disagree that he was blindly following orders until he lost everything at the end. His plan was clearly stated that he was going to overthrow Palpatine as soon as he got what he needed. Basically, Anakin went rogue, attempting to betray both sides, neither of which he trusted, and losing out on all fronts.

Obi-wan having one buddy that he worked with from time to time does not mean the Jedi were social. Keep in mind too that he was trained by Qui-gon, who was defiant against the council and ultimately embodied the example what he Jedi should have been.

[Lord Method Man]

Originally Posted by EddieWilson1983

I actually liked Hayden as Anakin for the most part, because it gave the character humanity instead of relying on the "eternal badass with no faults" stereotype. To this day, I still don't see where the purists got that notion in the first place. I'd love to see a scene between Carrie Fisher and Hayden, where Anakin's ghost appears to Leia.

Struggling to see how a sheet of plywood painted to look like an actor could give humanity to anything.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by thegoat

Obi-wan having one buddy that he worked with from time to time does not mean the Jedi were social. Keep in mind too that he was trained by Qui-gon, who was defiant against the council and ultimately embodied the example what he Jedi should have been.

Yeah, Obi-Wan wasn't paying Dex a social call, I get the feeling that he usually goes to Dex when he needs some info from 'between the lines'. And that's a great point about Qui-Gon; his maverick nature (part of which is that he actually cares about people!) is precisely what prompted him to free Anakin to begin with, and if he'd trained Anakin then there probably would've been no Darth Vader. Unfortunately he didn't pass on enough of his knowledge to Obi-Wan before he was killed, imparting his impudence but not his wisdom.

[blonde_devil]

Originally Posted by Lord Method Man

Struggling to see how a sheet of plywood painted to look like an actor could give humanity to anything.

snap

Given that he is not a part of the guild, it makes you wonder why he didn't get someone to co-direct with him to handle the actors. I think a better director could have gotten better performances out of all of them, or at least been there in the casting sessions to help them cast the right person. All these movies really did do was show his weaknesses as a director, not his strengths.

As for the Jedi socializing, am I the only one who thinks they all go off to a "convention" once a year to some stripper planet to socialize? Even Vulcans get lucky once every 7 years.