Oppo BDP-83 Blu-ray Player Thread

[oppopioneer]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

I have the OPPO BDP-83 set to up convert everything to 36 bit deep color when connected to a PRO-141FD and PRO-101FD. The blacks are very deep and the overall picture quality looks excellent even though all source material on Blu-ray is native 24 bit color depth.

Also I did not try turning off 36 bit deep color to see if the glitch goes away. I am not sure if the problem started to occur after the latest 1224 firmware update or if the problem was there before.

Normally before I turn on the OPPO BDP-83, I first will switch the Pioneer display to the HDMI input that the OPPO player is connected too or switch the Pioneer A/V receiver to the HDMI input that the OPPO player is connected too. After doing that I turn on the OPPO BDP-83. [B]Doing this every time produces an excellent picture with deep black levels and excellent results with 36 bit deep color upconvert.

Ways to reproduce the gray blacks and overall lower picture quality (I am using 36 bit deep color and firmware 1224, I did not try other firmware or try turning off deep color)

Regarding 36 bit Deep Color on the Oppo, do you leave it set at 36 bit at all times and the Pio plasma at Advance in Film Mode? You said before you let the Pio do all the upconverting? I'm confused.

[HDTV1080P]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

So to easily clarity:

Turn on the tv and a/v first, set it to the HDMI input that the bd player is connect to, then turn on the Oppo last, right?

That is correct order. It does not suppose to matter what component one turns on first, but it does do to some handshaking issue with the OPPO.

[HDTV1080P]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

Just email Oppo right now and tell them this, they will update it send a firmware update out. They're excellent with quick replies to customer questions and requests. They're amazing. Make sure you use the CD or USB method to update.

I do all my firmware updates over a wired network. Connecting the OPPO directly to the Internet is the most reliable and easiest way to update firmware. I also emailed OPPO about this issue before I posted it.

[HDTV1080P]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

Regarding 36 bit Deep Color on the Oppo, do you leave it set at 36 bit at all times and the Pio plasma at Advance in Film Mode? You said before you let the Pio do all the upconverting? I'm confused.

You can still leave the OPPO on 36 bit Deep Color and use source direct on the OPPO to allow the Pioneer to do all the video processing. If you watch 100% BLU-RAY movies that are encoded at 1080P/24 all video scaling is bypassed in the OPPO and Pioneer. It is only when you are watching 480I DVD's (480i BLU-RAY extras) and 720P or 1080I BLU-RAY's that video scaling will be used in either the OPPO or Pioneer. I use to always place the OPPO BDP-83 in source direct mode and allow the Pioneer to do all the video scaling. Many of the Pioneer models also accept native PAL/SECAM signals also.

I decided to turn off the source direct feature in the OPPO since I liked the OPPO's ability to be able to automatically display 4:3 DVD's at 4:3 ratio and display 16:9 Widescreen DVD's at 16:9 ratio. It is nice to be able to throw in a DVD and not have to mess around with the ratio setting on the Pioneer. I have DVD 24P feature set to on so the OPPO automatically outputs DVD's at 1080P/24. The Pioneer is still set for Advanced so that when watching film based cable channels the image will be upconverted to 1080P/24 and displayed on the screen at 1080P/72HZ. When watching DVD's with the source direct option turned on in the OPPO it still looks slightly better using the Pioneer video processing. The main reason I leave source direct off most of the time is so that the OPPO will correctly display DVD ratios without needing to toggle the screen ratio on the Pioneer from 4:3 to 16:9. Again when watching BLU-RAY 1080P/24 movies no scaling is used at all. So the only issue in picture quality and scaling comes into play when watching non 1080P/24 material.

[oppopioneer]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

You can still leave the OPPO on 36 bit Deep Color and use source direct on the OPPO to allow the Pioneer to do all the video processing.

Does 36 bit Deep Color always work even if the Oppo is also set to Source Direct or does the Oppo have to be set at one of it's 1080p/720p/480i settings for it to do the processing to notice 36 bit Deep Color's effects on the screen?

I just get the feeling that if you set the Oppo to Source Direct it bypasses most of the Oppo's features and sends it through and let's an outboard processor do all the work. Does Source Direct effect Oppo's 36 Deep Color feature?

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

It is only when you are watching 480I DVD's (480i BLU-RAY extras) and 720P or 1080I BLU-RAY's that video scaling will be used in either the OPPO or Pioneer. I use to always place the OPPO BDP-83 in source direct mode and allow the Pioneer to do all the video scaling. Many of the Pioneer models also accept native PAL/SECAM signals also.

I don't know if you saw my earlier post, I contacted Oppo and they alluded to where to set the Oppo and Pio plasma when watching dvd's and blurays. I'd thought I would share in case you were interested.

Oppo's response was:

"You will want to use 1080p and have the BDP-83 do all de-interlacing and scaling of standard definition media.

You will then enable 24Hz Conversion (disable this for 24p DVD Conversion) under Video Setup. This will force the player to output 24Hz from Blu-rays, which will allow your television to do the frame conversions."

Have you ever tried that yet? I haven't.

[oppopioneer]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

I decided to turn off the source direct feature in the OPPO since I liked the OPPO's ability to be able to automatically display 4:3 DVD's at 4:3 ratio and display 16:9 Widescreen DVD's at 16:9 ratio. It is nice to be able to throw in a DVD and not have to mess around with the ratio setting on the Pioneer. I have DVD 24P feature set to on so the OPPO automatically outputs DVD's at 1080P/24. The Pioneer is still set for Advanced so that when watching film based cable channels the image will be upconverted to 1080P/24 and displayed on the screen at 1080P/72HZ. [/SIZE]When watching DVD's with the source direct option turned on in the OPPO it still looks slightly better using the Pioneer video processing. The main reason I leave source direct off most of the time is so that the OPPO will correctly display DVD ratios without needing to toggle the screen ratio on the Pioneer from 4:3 to 16:9. Again when watching BLU-RAY 1080P/24 movies no scaling is used at all. So the only issue in picture quality and scaling comes into play when watching non 1080P/24 material. [/FONT][/COLOR]

So to simplify it, that's basically what Oppo recommends too, let the Oppo to the processing for standard def dvd's, but when watching blurays let the Pio do the processing. For dvd's set the Oppo to 1080p/24. For bluray set the player to 24Hz.

But Oppo said when watching blurays to set the Oppo to 24Hz conversation, what is that and have you ever done that? Will the Pio take the 24Hz and still upconvert it to 1080p/72? If Oppo is set to Source Direct can you still select 24Hz conversation?

[oppopioneer]

I asked this on the Pio Kuro thread when this topic came up but it's more suited for this Oppo thread.

Will I notice a difference in picture quality if the bd player is set to Auto or RGB or ycbcr? Source Direct On and Off effect it? Which one should I set it to get the best PQ from my Pio plasma?

Also, does that effect the Pio's ability with it's upconverting processing of 1080p/24 sources to 1080p/72? I want to be able to watch content in 1080p/72 and get the best PQ from it.

[EWL5]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

I asked this on the Pio Kuro thread when this topic came up but it's more suited for this Oppo thread.

Will I notice a difference in picture quality if the bd player is set to Auto or RGB or ycbcr? Source Direct On and Off effect it? Which one should I set it to get the best PQ from my Pio plasma?

Also, does that effect the Pio's ability with it's upconverting processing of 1080p/24 sources to 1080p/72? I want to be able to watch content in 1080p/72 and get the best PQ from it.

Leave your player on Auto. Under "Auto" your Oppo should be sending ycbcr to your plasma. The Source Direct setting shouldn't affect it as it only cares about the "source" (DVD/BD) and not the method of transmission (your player and TV). Same goes for the video processing.

RGB is really for DVI users and PC users.

[HDTV1080P]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

Does 36 bit Deep Color always work even if the Oppo is also set to Source Direct or does the Oppo have to be set at one of it's 1080p/720p/480i settings for it to do the processing to notice 36 bit Deep Color's effects on the screen?

I just get the feeling that if you set the Oppo to Source Direct it bypasses most of the Oppo's features and sends it through and let's an outboard processor do all the work. Does Source Direct effect Oppo's 36 Deep Color feature?



I don't know if you saw my earlier post, I contacted Oppo and they alluded to where to set the Oppo and Pio plasma when watching dvd's and blurays. I'd thought I would share in case you were interested.

Oppo's response was:

"You will want to use 1080p and have the BDP-83 do all de-interlacing and scaling of standard definition media.

You will then enable 24Hz Conversion (disable this for 24p DVD Conversion) under Video Setup. This will force the player to output 24Hz from Blu-rays, which will allow your television to do the frame conversions."

Have you ever tried that yet? I haven't.

You can answer your own question by placing the OPPO on 36 bit deep color and selecting source direct. Then hit the info button on the Pioneer and it will say 36 bit. When deep color is turned off the Pioneer will inform you that it is receiving 24 bit color. The info button on the Pioneer display tells you the signal it is receiving.

If you are using source direct in the OPPO then the Pioneer does the video scaling. If you are using the OPPO for DVD scaling then the OPPO will upconvert DVD's to 1080P at 60HZ with 3:2 pulldown. The Pioneer Advanced film mode feature that does a reverse 3:2 pulldown will not work with 1080P 60HZ signals. So if you are using the OPPO for video scaling the 24P DVD feature should be turned on in the OPPO so film based DVD's are upconverted to 1080P/24 with 3:2 pulldown eliminated. The reason there is a option in the menu to turn off the 24P DVD feature in the OPPO is because once in a while the reverse 3:2 pulldown process will not work correctly if the DVD is encoded wrong. I have had some good results using 24P DVD conversion on the OPPO.

[HDTV1080P]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

So to simplify it, that's basically what Oppo recommends too, let the Oppo to the processing for standard def dvd's, but when watching blurays let the Pio do the processing. For dvd's set the Oppo to 1080p/24. For bluray set the player to 24Hz.

But Oppo said when watching blurays to set the Oppo to 24Hz conversation, what is that and have you ever done that? Will the Pio take the 24Hz and still upconvert it to 1080p/72? If Oppo is set to Source Direct can you still select 24Hz conversation?

There are 3 selections for 1080P/24 Output in the OPPO. Auto, On and off. Selecting off converts native 1080p/24 to 60HZ with 3:2 pulldown judder added. Selecting Auto and On both will output 1080P/24 if source on the disc is 1080P/24. On some displays with handshaking issues Auto will not always work. The On setting will force 1080p/24 output as long as the disc playing is native 1080p/24.

DVD 24p Conversion set to on will do a reverse 3:2 pulldown for film based 60HZ 480I DVD's and upconvert them to 1080p/24. I always leave this on when source direct is not being used. I also have Multi-system selected for TV system but that setting only works when source direct is turned on. I also use 16:9 Wide/Auto in the OPPO so that DVD's will play in their original screen ratio (Only works when source direct is off).

All of these settings are explained in detailed in the OPPO BDP-83 manual. Also the Pioneer plasma manual offers good details

OPPO BDP-83 Blu-ray Disc Player User Manual (PDF Format)

The Pioneer will receive 1080P/24 signals and do a 3:3 pulldown 72HZ.

[oppopioneer]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

You can answer your own question by placing the OPPO on 36 bit deep color and selecting source direct. Then hit the info button on the Pioneer and it will say 36 bit. When deep color is turned off the Pioneer will inform you that it is receiving 24 bit color. The info button on the Pioneer display tells you the signal it is receiving.

Gotcha

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

If you are using source direct in the OPPO then the Pioneer does the video scaling. If you are using the OPPO for DVD scaling then the OPPO will upconvert DVD's to 1080P at 60HZ with 3:2 pulldown. The Pioneer Advanced film mode feature that does a reverse 3:2 pulldown will not work with 1080P 60HZ signals. So if you are using the OPPO for video scaling the 24P DVD feature should be turned on in the OPPO so film based DVD's are upconverted to 1080P/24 with 3:2 pulldown eliminated. The reason there is a option in the menu to turn off the 24P DVD feature in the OPPO is because once in a while the reverse 3:2 pulldown process will not work correctly if the DVD is encoded wrong. I have had some good results using 24P DVD conversion on the OPPO.

For dvd viewing set the Oppo to 1080p/24 and the Pio plasma will read it as 1080p/24 and it's Advance mode will work and convert it to 1080p/72 right?

For bluray viewing set the Oppo to Source Direct and the Pio's Advance will convert it to 1080p/72?

[oppopioneer]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

There are 3 selections for 1080P/24 Output in the OPPO. Auto, On and off. Selecting off converts native 1080p/24 to 60HZ with 3:2 pulldown judder added. Selecting Auto and On both will output 1080P/24 if source on the disc is 1080P/24. On some displays with handshaking issues Auto will not always work. The On setting will force 1080p/24 output as long as the disc playing is native 1080p/24.

Are dvd's native 1080p/24?

[gonk]

[QUOTE=oppopioneer;3030986]For dvd viewing set the Oppo to 1080p/24 and the Pio plasma will read it as 1080p/24 and it's Advance mode will work and convert it to 1080p/72 right?
Yes. However, it's not unheard of for DVD's to have mastering issues that make accurate 24p conversion difficult, even with the ABT2010 processor. You may want to compare results with DVD 24p turned on and turned off. Also, you will need to have 24p output (Blu-ray) enabled in order to turn the DVD 24p output on.

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

For bluray viewing set the Oppo to Source Direct and the Pio's Advance will convert it to 1080p/72?

If the player is set to Source Direct, 24p Blu-ray discs will be output at 1080p/24 and the Pioneer can show each frame three times for 1080p/72. However, at that point you will not be using the ABT2010 at all - no scaling, no deinterlacing, no zoom controls, etc. If you instead set the BDP-83 to output 1080p and enable 24p output, any 1080p/24 Blu-ray will be output at 1080p/24 (as will any 1080i/24 discs, in theory, although most of the 1080i content on the market is video that is 30fps natively and should not be converted to 24). You can then also experiment with DVD 24p output as discussed above.

[oppopioneer]

When it comes to Source Direct in bluray players connected to a Pio plasma, does it matter how good the upconverting technology is in the bd player if it's just going to be passed untouched to the Pio plasma and the Pio's good processing will convert it?

For example, will a $120 dollar Samsung bd player at Walmart set to Source Direct produce the same image on my Pio plasma as a $1000 dollar bd player would set to Source Direct since both will be letting the Pio's processor do all the work?

I would think that most people who buy bd players and care about picture quality don't have Pio plasma's and don't have an excellent outboard processor doing the converting, they want the bd player doing it.

[oppopioneer]

Originally Posted by gonk

Also, you will need to have 24p output (Blu-ray) enabled in order to turn the DVD 24p output on.

Does the Oppo have a seperate 1080p/24 section dedicated to blurays and another seperate dedicated dvd section for 1080p/24, or is it one setting of 1080p/24 that effects both dvd and bd? The way you phrased it sounds like there are two seperate dedicated 1080p/24 sections for both dvd and bd.

Originally Posted by gonk

If the player is set to Source Direct, 24p Blu-ray discs will be output at 1080p/24 and the Pioneer can show each frame three times for 1080p/72. However, at that point you will not be using the ABT2010 at all - no scaling, no deinterlacing, no zoom controls, etc. If you instead set the BDP-83 to output 1080p and enable 24p output, any 1080p/24 Blu-ray will be output at 1080p/24 (as will any 1080i/24 discs, in theory, although most of the 1080i content on the market is video that is 30fps natively and should not be converted to 24). You can then also experiment with DVD 24p output as discussed above.

Which do you think produces a better picture between letting the Oppo do the converting or setting it to Source Direct?

[gonk]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

When it comes to Source Direct in bluray players connected to a Pio plasma, does it matter how good the upconverting technology is in the bd player if it's just going to be passed untouched to the Pio plasma and the Pio's good processing will convert it?

For example, will a $120 dollar Samsung bd player at Walmart set to Source Direct produce the same image on my Pio plasma as a $1000 dollar bd player would set to Source Direct since both will be letting the Pio's processor do all the work?

I would think that most people who buy bd players and care about picture quality don't have Pio plasma's and don't have an excellent outboard processor doing the converting, they want the bd player doing it.

Source direct by definition bypasses the player's video processing. However, "source direct" is not a standard feature on all players - a $120 Samsung may very well not offer any such mode. Also, video processing in a player is going to be a much more important feature for DVD. Blu-ray is already 1080p, so the main goal of the player is to decode without screwing anything up. Differences in BD performance should be pretty subtle between players, no matter what the price tag.

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

Does the Oppo have a seperate 1080p/24 section dedicated to blurays and another seperate dedicated dvd section for 1080p/24, or is it one setting of 1080p/24 that effects both dvd and bd? The way you phrased it sounds like there are two seperate dedicated 1080p/24 sections for both dvd and bd.

Yes, there are two separate settings in the BDP-83's video setup menu. One enabled 24p output for Blu-ray discs. This is because the BD format has support for 24p output built into the standard. DVD does not, and producing a 24p signal from DVD's is a different process with some separate challenges. The BDP-83 is capable of it (note that the BDP-80 is not). Because it is not always beneficial, however, there is a separate setting available to allow you to get 24p from BD's while choosing separately whether or not to get it from DVD's. I've used both, and settled on leaving DVD 24p disabled while enabling BD 24p.

I don't know if you've done this yet, but I'd suggest going to OPPO's site and downloading the manual. It is well written and quite informative - not your typical player manual.

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

Which do you think produces a better picture between letting the Oppo do the converting or setting it to Source Direct?

This depends entirely on the rest of the signal path. I will say that the BDP-83 is the best scaling and deinterlacing solution I own. I prefer it to the Reon in my Onkyo 885 and to the built-in processing of my Sony KDL-40W4100. It's quite good, so you'll need to have something even better elsewhere in the signal path to give better results using Source Direct.

[oppopioneer]

Originally Posted by gonk

Yes, there are two separate settings in the BDP-83's video setup menu. One enabled 24p output for Blu-ray discs. This is because the BD format has support for 24p output built into the standard. DVD does not, and producing a 24p signal from DVD's is a different process with some separate challenges. The BDP-83 is capable of it (note that the BDP-80 is not). Because it is not always beneficial, however, there is a separate setting available to allow you to get 24p from BD's while choosing separately whether or not to get it from DVD's. I've used both, and settled on leaving DVD 24p disabled while enabling BD 24p.

If you have both 1080p/24 enabled for bd and 1080p/24 enabled for dvd at the same time in the settings will it effect the image of the specific disc being played?

[gonk]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

If you have both 1080p/24 enabled for bd and 1080p/24 enabled for dvd at the same time in the settings will it effect the image of the specific disc being played?

What kind of disc?

If "1080p24 Output" is set to "Off" in the Video Setup menu, then no discs will be output at 24p and any such content will go through a 3:2 pulldown process to achieve 1080p/60. This is what we've been doing with DVD's for 13 years now.

If "1080p24 Output" is set to "Auto" in the Video Setup menu and the display reports to the player that it can accept a 1080p/24 signal or if "1080p24 Output" is set to "On," then Blu-ray discs that contain 1080p/24 content will be output that way. That means there won't be a 3:2 pulldown process applied, which will affect the video quality (making it smoother, more fluid). DVD's will not be affected, and any with 24fps content will get 3:2 pulldown applied.

If 1080p/24 output is enabled ("On" or "Auto" with a compatible display), you will also be able to turn on "DVD 24p Conversion" in that same menu. This is where the results are less predictable. A properly-authored DVD can benefit from this just the same as a Blu-ray, but even the best of 24p processing techniques can be stymied by bad encoding. Because DVD was developed with the intent of always relying on 3:2 pulldown (years before anybody thought consumer displays would be able to handle 24p content natively), a lot of discs weren't authored in a way to facilitate 24p output.

Of course, all of this 24p output is only going to be of benefit the display properly handles the signal as well - some displays accept 1080p/24 but then do their own 3:2 pulldown, which frankly defeats the purpose. Your Kuro's 72Hz mode would avoid this process.

[oppopioneer]

Very informative! Thank you very much.

[Wileyman]

Hey fellas,

I currently own a BDP-83 and am looking into a Marantz receiver, particularly the SR6004. This will be my first experience with HDMI audio and I was curious; can the BDP-83 bitstream dvd-a over hdmi and if so would the marantz be able to decode it?

Sorry, but my salesman couldn't really answer any of my questions regarding dvd-a and sacd. Any help would be much appreciated!