Movies - The Case for Violence, Sex, Gore, and other things In Your Movies

[ITDEFX101]

Since we are on the topic of violence........ what do you think about violence between CGI characters and or real humans hurting/killing CG creatures? For example, the upcoming War for the Planet of the Apes. The last two movies...my wife did NOT want to watch them and refuses to go see the 3rd one and even declined to see KONG:SI

I kept on telling her, it's not real, it is computer animation......yet CG animals have come a LONG way over the years and Andy Serkis has done an amazing job making any of his CG characters so believable (I skipped the entire LOTR saga). Chapie was kinda brutal and my wife almost walked out of that one saying "This movie is rebellious"
Sometimes I just can't win unless I go alone :|

[ITDEFX101]

Originally Posted by shinobipopcorn

I had to explain to several of my Japanese students that "that word" is not one they should use, and just because they hear it in music doesn't make it okay to say. It was awkward because how do you explain racism to a bunch of 9th graders who just listen to American music because it's cool?

As a fellow teacher I keep on hearing from other teachers or even reading about it that M&M won't even let his kids listen to his music..............I call that BS!!!

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by ITDEFX101

Die Hard 3.......yeah I remembered the sign was digital altered from I hate N***** to I hate everybody.

The Blu-Ray version has the original sign. The scene helped explain that racism is not unique to any one skin tone; in fact, the character of Zeus Carver has many moments where he brings it up with McClane. I think the writers were very smart with that kind of commentary, and Sam Jackson made a brave choice by playing against the stereotype.

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by ITDEFX101

As a fellow teacher I keep on hearing from other teachers or even reading about it that M&M won't even let his kids listen to his music..............I call that BS!!!

I call that very irresponsible parenting. Making a career out of foul-mouthed lyrics, and hoping your kids aren't exposed to it, is purely idiotic. The better choice would be for him to simply quit cussing in his music; that way his kids could look up to him as a role model. Too many parents in this world act like complete morons, then act surprised when their kids follow their lead. News flash, parents - its your job to lead by example!!!

[Head bugs]

Originally Posted by ITDEFX101

What do you guys think about those parents who took their kids to see Logan (under 10 years old)? That movie was just brutal on a both an emotional and visual level.

I grew up watching adult movies, I don't mean porn obviously. My mother was the one who always told me no, but any chance I had, my father said go for it. It's impossible to predict a child's understanding of adult themes, until the parents expose him/her to it, and Logan it tame by comparison to the films I grew up with. Especially in this day and age where anything a kid can dream up, is just a click away. Think about when you were young, all the things you tried to get away with, and all the things you thought you got away with, but later found out your parents knew, they just let you have that one. Same principle imo.

[shinobipopcorn]

This discussion actually reminds me, I bought Stand By Me out of the grocery store bin about a month ago, and was surprised when the register asked for my ID. At first I thought it was a glitch, but then I remembered the rating. Why the devil is that movie rated R? I first saw that one when I was about the same age as the actors!

Carrie deserves to be rated R; it has abundant nudity in the opening, violence in the climax, domestic violence, and depending on your view of the religious theme, sacrilege. Stand By Me has swearing and vomiting. Oooh.

[Head bugs]

Great thread btw, just realized there is no way to rate a thread, unless I'm not seeing the option.

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by Head bugs

I grew up watching adult movies, I don't mean porn obviously. My mother was the one who always told me no, but any chance I had, my father said go for it. It's impossible to predict a child's understanding of adult themes, until the parents expose him/her to it, and Logan it tame by comparison to the films I grew up with. Especially in this day and age where anything a kid can dream up, is just a click away. Think about when you were young, all the things you tried to get away with, and all the things you thought you got away with, but later found out your parents knew, they just let you have that one. Same principle imo.

I was far too scared to try getting away with most things. I had no father growing up, and most men in my family were either crass or condemning. My mother was far better, but there were still certain things I was too embarrassed to discuss with her. In retrospect, facing that fear would've kept me away from lots of mental, emotional, and spiritual pain.

[Head bugs]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

I was far too scared to try getting away with most things. I had no father growing up, and most men in my family were either crass or condemning. My mother was far better, but there were still certain things I was too embarrassed to discuss with her. In retrospect, facing that fear would've kept me away from lots of mental, emotional, and spiritual pain.

Sorta strengthens my argument: the more open we are as kids with our parents/parent, the better prepared we may be for life. There's a whole other argument to be made here for parents teaching their kids about adult life -vs- allowing the school, to do so. But that's way too political for random discussion?

[RockyIII]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

"There is no immortality...to a tree's love..."

I think any parent who would let a child see things like that, needs their priorities refocused. Kids are like sponges, absorbing everything with no context and then emulating it. Its a very sad reality that a lot of parents don't bother to check their kids' entertainment choices.

It starts with the parents. I wouldn't expect a child not to use profanity when the parents cuss like a sailor all the time. I personally wouldn't watch a movie I didnt want my child to watch. Children observ and mimic what we do

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[BagheeraMcGee]

Originally Posted by shinobipopcorn

This discussion actually reminds me, I bought Stand By Me out of the grocery store bin about a month ago, and was surprised when the register asked for my ID. At first I thought it was a glitch, but then I remembered the rating. Why the devil is that movie rated R? I first saw that one when I was about the same age as the actors!

Carrie deserves to be rated R; it has abundant nudity in the opening, violence in the climax, domestic violence, and depending on your view of the religious theme, sacrilege. Stand By Me has swearing and vomiting. Oooh.

Agree completely. When it comes to language in movies, I do think context carries a lot of weight. Stand By Me, Planes, Trains & Automobiles & The Breakfast Club are all movies I personally would give a PG-13 to if I was in the MPAA, although with "TBC" there is the scene of the kids blazing up in the library, so maybe that contributed to the R rating as well. Without the car rental agent scene in "PT&A" (Martin's tirade uses the f-word profusely, but it's not in a sexual context), that film is an easy PG.

But with a movie like Clerks, where the language is often in a sexual context, I think the R rating is earned. I thought the film originally getting an NC-17 just on that basis was utterly ridiculous, but I'm sure Harvey Weinstein enjoyed milking the publicity from it.

[AaronJ]

As others have pointed out, it is all about context and content. Movies like Fight Club or Spring Breakers just could not be toned down for PG-13. Logan is another good example. I mean, I love X2 too. But Logan is a harder, darker story. I can't even imagine what a PG-13 version would look like. And I almost always just write off horror films that are PG-13. Though there have been some decent ones.

OTOH, something like Wonder Woman was fantastic, and it mostly took place in a war setting without going overboard with the violence.

As for sex, I'm with Foggy on this one: I don't get some people's obsession with not seeing nudity or sexual activity. For one thing, they wouldn't even be here to complain if someone hadn't had sex in the first place. That being said, not everything needs to be like Blue is the Warmest Color, which to be frank borders on porn. It's certainly not for everyone, but I think it's a really well made, engrossing and moving film.

Oh, and a comedy like Clerks has to be R. Because let's face it, if you met two guys like Dante and Randall in real life that's exactly how they'd talk.

EDIT: I see I was just beaten to the punch on the Clerks comment.

[Phobics]

More often then not I prefer violence and sex in films but it depends on the film

[BagheeraMcGee]

Originally Posted by AaronJ

As others have pointed out, it is all about context and content. Movies like Fight Club or Spring Breakers just could not be toned down for PG-13. Logan is another good example. I mean, I love X2 too. But Logan is a harder, darker story. I can't even imagine what a PG-13 version would look like. And I almost always just write off horror films that are PG-13. Though there have been some decent ones.

OTOH, something like Wonder Woman was fantastic, and it mostly took place in a war setting without going overboard with the violence.

As for sex, I'm with Foggy on this one: I don't get some people's obsession with not seeing nudity or sexual activity. For one thing, they wouldn't even be here to complain if someone hadn't had sex in the first place. That being said, not everything needs to be like Blue is the Warmest Color, which to be frank borders on porn. It's certainly not for everyone, but I think it's a really well made, engrossing and moving film.

Oh, and a comedy like Clerks has to be R. Because let's face it, if you met two guys like Dante and Randall in real life that's exactly how they'd talk.

EDIT: I see I was just beaten to the punch on the Clerks comment.

I'm in yours and Foggy's camp regarding sex and nudity. I personally have no problem with either whatsoever. On through the '70s, the '80s and most of the '90s, movies reveled in how much they could get away with sexually ("what did they have to cut to get the R?", "were they doing it for real?"), and it was done to try to drive up ticket sales.

I'm sure it's been beaten into the ground already, but I believe the easy access to porn on the internet helped change the way movies are made. No one goes to the movies to be titillated anymore.

[Phobics]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

I call that very irresponsible parenting. Making a career out of foul-mouthed lyrics, and hoping your kids aren't exposed to it, is purely idiotic. The better choice would be for him to simply quit cussing in his music; that way his kids could look up to him as a role model. Too many parents in this world act like complete morons, then act surprised when their kids follow their lead. News flash, parents - its your job to lead by example!!!

So basically if you have kids you have to be a PC ninny and only do kid friendly things, even for work... I've seen a lot of people do this like Eddie Murphy but it is really a sham imo. I understand doing different things but to say parents are bad parents because they don't is just wrong. Words are words and sex is sex. Sheltering kids from these things doesn't work and creates a lack of trust and companionship. Would you have the same strong stance on a parent who's job deals with violence such as a cop or in the military? Violence and killing people is much worse of an example to set than words or sex imo.

[RockyIII]

Originally Posted by Phobics

So basically if you have kids you have to be a PC ninny and only do kid friendly things, even for work... I've seen a lot of people do this like Eddie Murphy but it is really a sham imo. I understand doing different things but to say parents are bad parents because they don't is just wrong. Words are words and sex is sex. Sheltering kids from these things doesn't work and creates a lack of trust and companionship. Would you have the same strong stance on a parent who's job deals with violence such as a cop or in the military? Violence and killing people is much worse of an example to set than words or sex imo.

Cops or military dont do their job for entertainment purposes, big difference

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[AaronJ]

Originally Posted by Phobics

So basically if you have kids you have to be a PC ninny and only do kid friendly things, even for work... I've seen a lot of people do this like Eddie Murphy but it is really a sham imo. I understand doing different things but to say parents are bad parents because they don't is just wrong. Words are words and sex is sex. Sheltering kids from these things doesn't work and creates a lack of trust and companionship. Would you have the same strong stance on a parent who's job deals with violence such as a cop or in the military? Violence and killing people is much worse of an example to set than words or sex imo.

Not to mention the number of porn stars who have children. It's not like they let them watch their work, or even explain to them what exactly it is they do. I mean, heck, Alexis Texas has a kid, and she's been in so many scenes and movies it's beyond counting at this point. BTW, she also has a college degree, and worked as a therapist of some sort in a nursing home before she decided on her current career path.

I think it's very presumptuous to assume that her kid will somehow turn out badly just because she had sex on camera for a living.

[ITDEFX101]

Originally Posted by AaronJ

Not to mention the number of porn stars who have children. It's not like they let them watch their work, or even explain to them what exactly it is they do. I mean, heck, Alexis Texas has a kid, and she's been in so many scenes and movies it's beyond counting at this point. BTW, she also has a college degree, and worked as a therapist of some sort in a nursing home before she decided on her current career path.

I think it's very presumptuous to assume that her kid will somehow turn out badly just because she had sex on camera for a living.

Oh geez, in that situation, I could hear the "Who's your daddy? jokes...

[Creed]

Personally, I don't mind sex scenes. Some can be pointless, but titillation is the only goal for it (I don't mind, like Blue Is The Warmest Colour)

The MPAA are dumb bastards, that's all.

[AaronJ]

Originally Posted by ITDEFX101

Oh geez, in that situation, I could hear the "Who's your daddy? jokes...

Honestly, every adult star I can think of who has children is married.

Originally Posted by creed123

Personally, I don't mind sex scenes. Some can be pointless, but titillation is the only goal for it (I don't mind, like Blue Is The Warmest Colour)

The MPAA are dumb bastards, that's all.

I would argue that the only goal is titillation. It certainly wasn't in Blue is the Warmest Color, or Mulholland Dr., or Blue Valentine. I could think of others, but off the top of my head those are what come to mind.

Take Blue Valentine for instance: It's hardly titillating in the first place. Whenever they have sex it ends some ugly argument or someone just being pissed off. I love the film and think it's some of Gosling and Williams best work. But I never was "turned on" by the sexual content -- it's disturbing.