Saltburn (2023)

[nicwood]

Saw Saltburn and loved it! Had a wonderful time and left surprised how such a seemingly shallow, derivative, surface-level film provoked me to think in a way a seemingly dense, layered, original film like Anatomy of a Fall didn’t. My spoiler-filled thoughts below. Now I can only pray and hope that this visually and aurally gorgeous work gets its 4K UHD with Atmos as soon as possible.

[Show spoiler]
All the claims about “Saltburn” being nothing less than an empty, cheap, good-looking corpse of a film derivative of Pasolini and so many others are understandable and most likely justified. After all, we’ve been spoiled by great films which attempted to attack our firm class division system and while doing so working towards flipping everything on its head. “Parasite” obviously comes to mind, which Emerald Fennell was aware of and likely used as a reference when she shopped her second feature to buyers. Instead of the aforementioned cornerstone, Fennell had to fob herself off with moths instead, but despite the apparent difference in quality of the films, it doesn’t mean “Saltburn” is an epic disaster.

“Saltburn” is pop confection whereas “Parasite” managed the rare feat of being enjoyable as both pop AND high art (as well as acclaimed across the board by all camps of interest). We shouldn’t make it too easy on ourselves and just compare what should likely not be compared in the first place.

If we want to compare, we’d be better served with other pop confections like “Spring Breakers”, which is as unafraid as “Saltburn” to cater to our most simple desires. But it doesn’t stop there, its admirers defend and critics shrug off. Both “superficial” “pop” films actually use their fake, stylized, made-up, candy-color, prickly tasting, one frame a painting surface to tell us about what’s underneath. A deep void of nothingness, sadness and the need to escape and forget. In these cases and elsewhere like with “The Neon Demon”, the abundance of style, the total synergy of a film’s way of storytelling with its style, IS its surface. These films invite us to study the surface like the fewest do nowadays.

It’s all there if we want it. In Jacob Elordi’s perfect body, in Barry Keoghan’s eyes, in Rosamund Pike’s hilarious and deeply disturbing blabbering, in all the clothes and objects and Linus Sandgren’s colors. It’s about a young man wanting to belong and be a part of the group of people that take pride in enjoyment. Of letting go of a first chapter in life and changing characters. Every action of Oliver is understandable, throughout the entire film. The stories he makes up about his past, the difference between him pretending not to understand the things he actually understands better than anyone else. It’s a young man wanting to taste the sweet wine of success and the feeling of superiority he’s only gotten to glimpse at from a spectator’s point of view.

From another perspective, it’s someone who knows life from its most gentlemanly, tailored and normative sides. He’s educated himself about the theory of what Felix, his family and friends live.
The way the great Jacob Elordi plays Felix is that he wants to experience the exact opposite and therefore finds kinship in Oliver who, due to his upbringing and complete distancing from Felix’s class, is able to look at Felix as a human being instead of just this sexy, rich, majestic entity that longs to be devoured. Felix is totally sincere with Oliver unlike with the other people he got into contact with earlier in his life as told by other characters.

The only thing that deluded Oliver were the circumstances about Felix’s rejection of him. Felix never had to fabricate what Oliver did due to his family’s wealth, which is the reason Felix couldn’t immediately understand Oliver’s lies. The very last moment the two share in the maze before Oliver departed seems to imply that Felix sensed his reasoning, which does render their story a little more tragic.

In the end, the film leaves open whether Oliver was all about the wealth and inheritance or whether these were “just” side-effects of him racing full throttle into the abyss after actually chasing genuine human connections and being so existentially disappointed from not finding them on the surface in all the bright and shiny emptiness. Oliver departs the film as a tragic joker, dancing his way through what’s now his… or not. We’re left stunned, appalled, and on the other hand admiring while also feeling compassion. For an apparently totally surface-level film, I’d say not bad at all.

[Cremildo]

Enjoyed this a lot. A step up from her Oscar-winning debut. Fennell has a sense of wickedness that surprises me. Can't wait for whatever she's cooking up next.

[format916]

Originally Posted by Cremildo

A step up from her Oscar-winning debut..

Kinda disagree here. It’s a good movie and its own movie. But I think Promising Young Woman is a much better film overall AND has a much, much wider appeal.

[Hindustani]

Originally Posted by Foggy

Same, really struggling to get a reading on the film honestly.

Thats because you know deep down THE TALENTED MR RIPLEY was just plain better compared to this garbage.

[thenexus6]

I watched it last night and enjoyed it. I'd only seen a few clips beforehand and I had my own general idea of what the story would be - a "normal" and "boring" guy goes to his mates extravagant country manor house and things get wild.

While I did enjoy the film - great cinematography, fun music choices and the acting all round was great (Felix in particular was perfect), but

[Show spoiler]it was kind of shallow without much to say. Oliver's motivations were... just kinda nothing?

The two reveals or turning points were 1) when Ollie .... cleans up in the bath and 2) when it's clear he's been orchestrating the whole thing. I expected him to be a victim of this weird family but instead he was Mr Ripleying the whole time, just with no real reason behind it.

It felt sometimes just edgy for the sake of it and at the same time not weird or zany as I expected.

I still rated it 3.5/5 but I don't know. Maybe I expected too much.

[Foggy]

Originally Posted by Hindustani

Thats because you know deep down THE TALENTED MR RIPLEY was just plain better compared to this garbage.

Ok, pal.

A bit of an outdated post to quote from, I’ve seen the film since then and quite enjoyed it.

[Resettito]

Hoping this gets a physical release, which since it's under the MGM banner (which is now owned by Amazon, yes) and it got a theatrical release in some countries, makes me think it could happen.

[rooboy78]

Originally Posted by Resettito

Hoping this gets a physical release, which since it's under the MGM banner (which is now owned by Amazon, yes) and it got a theatrical release in some countries, makes me think it could happen.

I’m really hoping it gets a 4K.

[Hindustani]

Originally Posted by rooboy78

I’m really hoping it gets a 4K.

its gonna look impecable in that 1.33:1 ratio and 35mm film use.

[RevolverOcelScott]

Originally Posted by Hindustani

its gonna look impecable in that 1.33:1 ratio and 35mm film use.

Plenty of 35mm, 1:33:1 ratio (or close) films have been on the 4K format with excellent results. There have been 16mm 4K releases in that ratio (or close) with excellent results.

Care to elaborate?

[Hindustani]

Originally Posted by RevolverOcelScott

Plenty of 35mm, 1:33:1 ratio (or close) films have been on the 4K format with excellent results. There have been 16mm 4K releases in that ratio (or close) with excellent results.

Care to elaborate?

not many films recently has colors so muted on 35mm celluloid to help dark storyline of this film.

This film is going to look unique in 4K imo. hopefully they dont upscale 2K scan.

in so many words, This film will look more picturisque and timeless than What PARASITE should've looked like. and later is superior movie too.

[El Rey]

saw this last night and while I did enjoy it, i agree with nexus assessment in regards to

[Show spoiler]Ollie's motivations. I read an interview with Fennell and she said in Ollie's ideal world, he and Felix end up married but since that couldn't happen, this was his alternative. It shouldn't have taken an interview with the director to explain this, the film should have done it's job of doing this.

In regards to the infamous scenes - bathtub, encounter, grave and final scene - they all felt provocative for the sake of it, no real merit otherwise. I get the final scene was a reverse of Felix walkthrough into Saltburn and that it was now Ollie's and he was going to live it up in there how he saw fit, but again, him being nude felt provocative for the sake of it - or I dunno swingin' his big d-ck around?

other questions - maybe i misread or it escaped me - Ollie lied about his parents to have a story to standout and keep Felix attention?

yes, Elspeth was an awful person, but this was reason to kill her? or was it simply a mean to an end - Ollie getting Saltburn?

is Duncan still around?

[spanky87]

Speaking of things Emerald Fennell has said, she also said this about the ending which I think the film fails to achieve since I didn’t feel that way at all:

[Show spoiler]

“A walkthrough didn’t have that post-coital triumph. If we all did our job correctly, you are on Oliver’s side,” Fennell said in the interview published in November. “You don’t care what he does, you want him to do it. You are both completely repulsed and sort of on his side. It’s that kind of dance with the devil. It’s like, ‘F***. Okay, let’s go.’ And so at the end, it needed to have a triumph, a post-coital win, a desecration.”

The poll options don’t provide enough nuance for me to vote here. I previously said it was entertaining, but that the first half is great while the second half doesn’t land for me. It’s both predictable and executed in a very unconvincing way. And the more I think of it the more stupid and pointless the film becomes. I don’t like it enough to go out of my way to recommend it, but I wouldn’t discourage someone from seeing it either. Maybe I’m overthinking the poll though.

[filmbuffTX]

Originally Posted by El Rey

saw this last night and while I did enjoy it, i agree with nexus assessment in regards to

[Show spoiler]Ollie's motivations. I read an interview with Fennell and she said in Ollie's ideal world, he and Felix end up married but since that couldn't happen, this was his alternative. It shouldn't have taken an interview with the director to explain this, the film should have done it's job of doing this.

In regards to the infamous scenes - bathtub, encounter, grave and final scene - they all felt provocative for the sake of it, no real merit otherwise. I get the final scene was a reverse of Felix walkthrough into Saltburn and that it was now Ollie's and he was going to live it up in there how he saw fit, but again, him being nude felt provocative for the sake of it - or I dunno swingin' his big d-ck around?

other questions - maybe i misread or it escaped me - Ollie lied about his parents to have a story to standout and keep Felix attention?

yes, Elspeth was an awful person, but this was reason to kill her? or was it simply a mean to an end - Ollie getting Saltburn?

is Duncan still around?

I thought that was all made obvious by what is shown in the film.

[Show spoiler]Ollie lies and manipulates to get close to Felix. He's obviously attracted to him on multiple levels and wants to be in his orbit. His not just attracted to Felix, but also his lifestyle. When Felix uncovers Ollie's deceit and rejects him it crushes Ollie. We see scenes of him crying and bawling in bed. He tries multiple times to plead for Felix's forgiveness, but Felix completely shuts him down. The friendship is over. That is when his motivations and feelings shifted from adoration to resentment and animosity (for the whole family). Him humping the fresh grave shows how he's conflicted and still loves/adores Felix. He says something to this effect on the voiceover narration too (Love/Hate). It's not like his plan from the beginning was to get their estate. It just evolved into that based on the circumstances.

The final scene is a victory dance. Like an NFL player dancing in the end zone after they score a touchdown.

[El Rey]

Originally Posted by filmbuffTX

I thought that was all made obvious by what is shown in the film.

[Show spoiler]Ollie lies and manipulates to get close to Felix. He's obviously attracted to him on multiple levels and wants to be in his orbit. His not just attracted to Felix, but also his lifestyle. When Felix uncovers Ollie's deceit and rejects him it crushes Ollie. We see scenes of him crying and bawling in bed. He tries multiple times to plead for Felix's forgiveness, but Felix completely shuts him down. The friendship is over. That is when his motivations and feelings shifted from adoration to resentment and animosity (for the whole family). Him humping the fresh grave shows how he's conflicted and still loves/adores Felix. He says something to this effect on the voiceover narration too (Love/Hate). It's not like his plan from the beginning was to get their estate. It just evolved into that based on the circumstances.

The final scene is a victory dance. Like an NFL player dancing in the end zone after they score a touchdown.

yes I understood and processed all of that and Fennell states that in interviews however again it felt like the more provocative scenes were for the sake of it, no matter how they are framed (voiceover love/hate) - they just didn't land any other way for me.
in regards to why

[Show spoiler]Ollie lied about his family, I guess I just feel like that aspect wasn't as fleshed out as it should/could have been, just a bit quickly glossed over

[filmbuffTX]

Originally Posted by El Rey

yes I understood and processed all of that and Fennell states that in interviews however again it felt like the more provocative scenes were for the sake of it, no matter how they are framed (voiceover love/hate) - they just didn't land any other way for me.
in regards to why

[Show spoiler]Ollie lied about his family, I guess I just feel like that aspect wasn't as fleshed out as it should/could have been, just a bit quickly glossed over

The provocative scenes are partly there for entertainment. They add sizzle, intrigue, and humor. Those scenes got strong reactions in my screening and are a big part of why this film has so much buzz surrounding it. They also have a narrative purpose.

[Show spoiler]The scene with Ollie submerging his face in Felix's bath water was to show his attraction and infatuation with him. The scene with the sister was him trying to get close to her and by proxy get more ingratiated into the family. They all seem within the realm of possibility for this character to engage in. Including the scene where he confronts Farleigh in bed.

As far as his family goes, he lied because it made him seem more sympathetic. It was to manipulate Felix. The scene where Felix drives Ollie to his parent's house without his knowledge and the scenes at the house are decently lengthy. I felt it was adequate to establish what kind of parents and home life he had and how it would be a shocking revelation to Felix based on how Ollie described his family to him. The scene also established that Ollie was lying to his parents as well.

[eas8]

Originally Posted by spanky87

Speaking of things Emerald Fennell has said, she also said this about the ending which I think the film fails to achieve since I didn’t feel that way at all:

[Show spoiler]

The poll options don’t provide enough nuance for me to vote here. I previously said it was entertaining, but that the first half is great while the second half doesn’t land for me. It’s both predictable and executed in a very unconvincing way. And the more I think of it the more stupid and pointless the film becomes. I don’t like it enough to go out of my way to recommend it, but I wouldn’t discourage someone from seeing it either. Maybe I’m overthinking the poll though.

[Show spoiler]I agree I really wasn't rooting for anyone, I think to some extent they were equally bad

[El Rey]

Originally Posted by filmbuffTX

The provocative scenes are partly there for entertainment. They add sizzle, intrigue, and humor. Those scenes got strong reactions in my screening and are a big part of why this film has so much buzz surrounding it. They also have a narrative purpose.

[Show spoiler]The scene with Ollie submerging his face in Felix's bath water was to show his attraction and infatuation with him. The scene with the sister was him trying to get close to her and by proxy get more ingratiated into the family. They all seem within the realm of possibility for this character to engage in. Including the scene where he confronts Farleigh in bed.

As far as his family goes, he lied because it made him seem more sympathetic. It was to manipulate Felix. The scene where Felix drives Ollie to his parent's house without his knowledge and the scenes at the house are decently lengthy. I felt it was adequate to establish what kind of parents and home life he had and how it would be a shocking revelation to Felix based on how Ollie described his family to him. The scene also established that Ollie was lying to his parents as well.

yes, again, i get all of that, but those scenes just didn't work for me from an artistic or narrative standpoint. I am by no means a prude so its not that. I just don't think they were necessary. I mean they certainly have people talking but I think the film works without them, which leads me back to it feeling like they were provocative for the sake of it.

[By_His_Strypes]

I had to shut this off after 20min... it wasn't my cup of tea.

[wonderer99]

Not sure whether I loved this or hated it. Clever or forced? I don't think I have ever seen a film in which literally every character is unlikeable.