Official Film Noir on Blu-ray Thread

[PowellPressburger]

Ok it is a DVD set but Amazon did a price drop to around 42.00 so I grabbed it even though I have BLUs for all the available titles this set was cheaper then me purchasing the titles I didn't own rather then buying them individually.

image.jpg

The titles I needed were The Glass Key, Phantom Lady, Criss Cross, The Big Clock, the Blue Dahlia.

[Davidian]

Yeah it's a pity The Big Clock is only available on BD as part of this set:

[St.ylo]

So this is not specifically blu-ray-relevant, but I know there are a lot of Film Noir fans here so I thought I'd ask.

For, basically, a total newcomer to the genre, what movies should I start with? I mean, I've certainly seen movies inspired by Film Noir - Dark City, probably countless others, neo-noirs, etc, but I don't think I've seen many of the movies that influenced these.

Recommendations for box sets are fine, as I know there are a lot of those on DVD (but if the films are also on blu-ray, then of course I'd go for those).

I did look at a few lists, but there are so many movies and so many different opinions on which are the best. I know of some I'd certainly like to see, like Kubrick's The Killing and Orson Welle's Touch of Evil, but they seem to be later entries and perhaps build off older ones that I should see... I'm not sure.

[PowellPressburger]

Some of my favs for classics are

Blu
Double Indemnity
Kiss Me Deadly
Out of the Past
Postman Always Rings Twice

as for DVD these come to mind

Pickup on South Street
Mildred Pierce
Dangerous Crossing
This Gun For Hire

[noirjunkie]

Originally Posted by St.ylo

So this is not specifically blu-ray-relevant, but I know there are a lot of Film Noir fans here so I thought I'd ask.

For, basically, a total newcomer to the genre, what movies should I start with? I mean, I've certainly seen movies inspired by Film Noir - Dark City, probably countless others, neo-noirs, etc, but I don't think I've seen many of the movies that influenced these.

Recommendations for box sets are fine, as I know there are a lot of those on DVD (but if the films are also on blu-ray, then of course I'd go for those).

I did look at a few lists, but there are so many movies and so many different opinions on which are the best. I know of some I'd certainly like to see, like Kubrick's The Killing and Orson Welle's Touch of Evil, but they seem to be later entries and perhaps build off older ones that I should see... I'm not sure.

I've listed the following films into groups of five for each half-decade or so. There are other good choices as well, but watching these (preferably in order) will give you a solid, canonical sampling of the genre.

1940-45

Stranger on the Third Floor (40)
The Maltese Falcon (41)
Double Indemnity (44)
Detour (45)
Scarlet Street (45)

1946-49

The Killers (46)
The Lady from Shanghai (47)
Out of the Past (47)
The Set-Up (47)
The Third Man (49)

1950-54 (had to go with six here, because all six are essential)

D.O.A. (50)
Gun Crazy (50)
Sunset Blvd. (50)
The Narrow Margin (52)
The Big Heat (53)
The Hitch-Hiker (53) - the only noir directed by a woman (Ida Lupino)

1955-1958

Kiss Me Deadly (55)
The Night of the Hunter (55)
The Killing (56)
The Sweet Smell of Success (57)
Touch of Evil (58)

Again, this list is designed to let you sample the genre from each era (early, middle, late); it's by no means comprehensive, but it should give you an entry point into understanding how the genre both stayed the same and changed over the years.

Most of these titles are on blu-ray, but for some, you'll need to watch them on DVD.

[JoeBuck]

Originally Posted by St.ylo

So this is not specifically blu-ray-relevant, but I know there are a lot of Film Noir fans here so I thought I'd ask.

For, basically, a total newcomer to the genre, what movies should I start with? I mean, I've certainly seen movies inspired by Film Noir - Dark City, probably countless others, neo-noirs, etc, but I don't think I've seen many of the movies that influenced these.

Recommendations for box sets are fine, as I know there are a lot of those on DVD (but if the films are also on blu-ray, then of course I'd go for those).

I did look at a few lists, but there are so many movies and so many different opinions on which are the best. I know of some I'd certainly like to see, like Kubrick's The Killing and Orson Welle's Touch of Evil, but they seem to be later entries and perhaps build off older ones that I should see... I'm not sure.

In addition to the ones mentioned in the posts above, I'd also throw out strong recommendations for Gilda, Nightmare Alley, Criss Cross, Kansas City Confidential and The Phantom Lady.

[Professor Echo]

Trying to be more helpful and not anal for the newcomer, but the early years prior to the postwar era are usually called "PROTO-NOIR."

Then you have what is generally regarded as the classic "NOIR" period from about 1945 to 1958, with everything after TOUCH OF EVIL being considered "NEO-NOIR."

Some have also applied a "MODERN NOIR" designation to more recent offerings, but I'm not sure where that's supposed to start or if it's even a generally accepted term amongst the genre experts.

Not everyone subscribes to these ideas or agrees on their delineations, but I think it puts the entire spectrum into a proper historical perspective. Even such well known experts as Eddie Mueller are fond of stretching the boundaries for all of it, often for commercial purposes, and I think he in particular goes way too far in other directions, but I'm kind of a noir traditionalist.

[Vlad Draculi]

Originally Posted by St.ylo

So this is not specifically blu-ray-relevant, but I know there are a lot of Film Noir fans here so I thought I'd ask.

For, basically, a total newcomer to the genre, what movies should I start with? I mean, I've certainly seen movies inspired by Film Noir - Dark City, probably countless others, neo-noirs, etc, but I don't think I've seen many of the movies that influenced these.

The Maltese Falcon, Double Indemnity, A Touch of Evil, and The Killing are by far my favorites that I have seen.

Three of those I watched for the first time last year and instantly fell in love with them.

[noirjunkie]

Originally Posted by Professor Echo

Trying to be more helpful and not anal for the newcomer, but the early years prior to the postwar era are usually called "PROTO-NOIR."

Then you have what is generally regarded as the classic "NOIR" period from about 1945 to 1958, with everything after TOUCH OF EVIL being considered "NEO-NOIR."

Some have also applied a "MODERN NOIR" designation to more recent offerings, but I'm not sure where that's supposed to start or if it's even a generally accepted term amongst the genre experts.

Not everyone subscribes to these ideas or agrees on their delineations, but I think it puts the entire spectrum into a proper historical perspective. Even such well known experts as Eddie Mueller are fond of stretching the boundaries for all of it, often for commercial purposes, and I think he in particular goes way too far in other directions, but I'm kind of a noir traditionalist.

I'm in the "disagree" camp regarding the "proto-noir" label. In the research I've done, proto-noir is typically ascribed to pre-1940 films, not pre-1945 films. If everything pre-1945 fell under this categorization, then films like The Maltese Falcon, This Gun for Hire, Double Indemnity, Laura, and Murder, My Sweet would all be considered proto-noirs. Relatively few people have made this claim (with a handful of allowances for Falcon).

It is true that the number of noir films released in the late-40s post-war era vastly outnumbered those from 1940-44. Nonetheless, that doesn't make the films that came out in 40-44 any less "noir" than the ones that followed.

(I also think the genre didn't completely die out until 1965, and that Point Blank [1967] is the first true neo-noir.)

Anyway, if it fails to do anything else, at least our amicable disagreement illustrates that people will never stop debating about what does and does not constitute noir.

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by noirjunkie

I'm in the "disagree" camp regarding the "proto-noir" label. In the research I've done, proto-noir is typically ascribed to pre-1940 films, not pre-1945 films. If everything pre-1945 fell under this categorization, then films like The Maltese Falcon, This Gun for Hire, Double Indemnity, Laura, and Murder, My Sweet would all be considered proto-noirs. Relatively few people have made this claim (with a handful of allowances for Falcon).

It is true that the number of noir films released in the late-40s post-war era vastly outnumbered those from 1940-44. Nonetheless, that doesn't make the films that came out in 40-44 any less "noir" than the ones that followed.

(I also think the genre didn't completely die out until 1965, and that Point Blank [1967] is the first true neo-noir.)

Anyway, if it fails to do anything else, at least our amicable disagreement illustrates that people will never stop debating about what does and does not constitute noir.

You're right, of course, and I should have been more clear in my post as the pre-1945 titles you mention are all genuine Noirs except for FALCON which I would still categorize as proto. I also think I WAKE UP SCREAMING and STRANGER ON THE THIRD FLOOR are proto-Noirs. But it's a slippery slope trying to narrow these designations down to an exact science. It can't be done. That's why I should have posted that there are exceptions to all of this.

There are crossovers between the periods, no doubt, but I should have indicated that the RECOGNITION of the classic NOIR era (even though it didn't yet have that name) did not become established until post-war, not that the films themselves all belonged to that time.

I've often wondered why the advent of the police procedural Noirs in the late 40's-50's don't constitute yet another demarcation point as they often differ greatly from the classic Noirs of the rest of the 40's.

Regardless, it's a great subject and I love discussing it.

[St.ylo]

Originally Posted by noirjunkie

I've listed the following films into groups of five for each half-decade or so. There are other good choices as well, but watching these (preferably in order) will give you a solid, canonical sampling of the genre.

1940-45

Stranger on the Third Floor (40)
The Maltese Falcon (41)
Double Indemnity (44)
Detour (45)
Scarlet Street (45)

1946-49

The Killers (46)
The Lady from Shanghai (47)
Out of the Past (47)
The Set-Up (47)
The Third Man (49)

1950-54 (had to go with six here, because all six are essential)

D.O.A. (50)
Gun Crazy (50)
Sunset Blvd. (50)
The Narrow Margin (52)
The Big Heat (53)
The Hitch-Hiker (53) - the only noir directed by a woman (Ida Lupino)

1955-1958

Kiss Me Deadly (55)
The Night of the Hunter (55)
The Killing (56)
The Sweet Smell of Success (57)
Touch of Evil (58)

Again, this list is designed to let you sample the genre from each era (early, middle, late); it's by no means comprehensive, but it should give you an entry point into understanding how the genre both stayed the same and changed over the years.

Most of these titles are on blu-ray, but for some, you'll need to watch them on DVD.

Thanks! (And thanks to the others who replied, too.)

Some of these that have been recommended, like Detour, D.O.A., Kansas City Confidential, are always showing up on public domain DVDs in what I can assume is subpar quality, making it a pain to search for a proper copy. Would anyone have recommendations for the best DVD editions of these and other films that are in the same situation (preferably not OOP ones)?
EDIT: Or, if there are actually decent PD prints for some available online, that'd be fine too, although it seems unlikely. :P

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by St.ylo

Thanks! (And thanks to the others who replied, too.)

Some of these that have been recommended, like Detour, D.O.A., Kansas City Confidential, are always showing up on public domain DVDs in what I can assume is subpar quality, making it a pain to search for a proper copy. Would anyone have recommendations for the best DVD editions of these and other films that are in the same situation (preferably not OOP ones)?
EDIT: Or, if there are actually decent PD prints for some available online, that'd be fine too, although it seems unlikely. :P

The MGM release of KANSAS CITY CONFIDENTIAL is the best DVD. It's also out on Blu Ray, but there is criticism of it having too much DNR.

I believe the best version of DOA is the Roan release from Troma as it includes a very good introduction by Beverly Garland and a good, though not stellar, transfer.

DETOUR from the Wade Williams Collection, released by Image Entertainment, is the best version to ever come out.

However, please note that both Troma and Image are now releasing burned DVD-Rs of their catalog titles. If you want pressed copies you will probably have to buy them used rather than new, but that's still no guarantee. Neither company identifies which are burned and which are pressed.

[PowellPressburger]

Today's haul with some noir titles

image.jpg

a double life had been getting high prices lately on Amazon probably due to low stock but a 3rd party seller posted a copy the other day at about 15.00 so I grabbed it along with some other BLUs and DVDs

[editor*by*night88]

HERE IS A FEW LESSER KNOW FILM NOIR .MAYBE SOME OF YOU WANT TO CHECK IT OUT!
TIMETABLE
ONE WAY STREET
THE MAN WHO CHEATED HIMSELF
THE SCAR aka HOLLOW TRIUMPH

[noirjunkie]

Originally Posted by Professor Echo

The MGM release of KANSAS CITY CONFIDENTIAL is the best DVD. It's also out on Blu Ray, but there is criticism of it having too much DNR.

I believe the best version of DOA is the Roan release from Troma as it includes a very good introduction by Beverly Garland and a good, though not stellar, transfer.

DETOUR from the Wade Williams Collection, released by Image Entertainment, is the best version to ever come out.

For KCC and Detour, those are definitely the best versions. Having seen both, either the Roan release of D.O.A. or the disc put out by Image work well; the picture quality on both is almost identical (with perhaps a slight edge to Image), but the Roan release has the extra you mentioned -- and, to the best of my knowledge, they still press their discs.

The other two films on my list in the public domain are Scarlet Street and The Hitch-Hiker, and for both of those, you'll want the Kino blu-rays, as Kino has done a great job with both.

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by noirjunkie

For KCC and Detour, those are definitely the best versions. Having seen both, either the Roan release of D.O.A. or the disc put out by Image work well; the picture quality on both is almost identical (with perhaps a slight edge to Image), but the Roan release has the extra you mentioned -- and, to the best of my knowledge, they still press their discs.

Unfortunately, Troma has rereleased many of their Roan discs as burnt DVD-Rs. Not sure about D. O. A., but a sure sign of a burnt copy from either Troma or Image is if you see one of their older releases described as brand new, still sealed for a pretty cheap price from a mega-seller.

It should also be noted that VCI also sells burnt DVDs (not Blus) and often without notification. If you place your order on the phone with them and specifically say you only want pressed copies, they will tell you right away if the titles you want are burned or pressed.

Buyer beware on these if you don't like burnt discs and not getting the original inserts/liner notes.

[tallrichard]

Originally Posted by noirjunkie

I've listed the following films into groups of five for each half-decade or so. There are other good choices as well, but watching these (preferably in order) will give you a solid, canonical sampling of the genre.

1940-45

Stranger on the Third Floor (40)
The Maltese Falcon (41)
Double Indemnity (44)
Detour (45)
Scarlet Street (45)

1946-49

The Killers (46)
The Lady from Shanghai (47)
Out of the Past (47)
The Set-Up (47)
The Third Man (49)

1950-54 (had to go with six here, because all six are essential)

D.O.A. (50)
Gun Crazy (50)
Sunset Blvd. (50)
The Narrow Margin (52)
The Big Heat (53)
The Hitch-Hiker (53) - the only noir directed by a woman (Ida Lupino)

1955-1958

Kiss Me Deadly (55)
The Night of the Hunter (55)
The Killing (56)
The Sweet Smell of Success (57)
Touch of Evil (58)

Again, this list is designed to let you sample the genre from each era (early, middle, late); it's by no means comprehensive, but it should give you an entry point into understanding how the genre both stayed the same and changed over the years.

Most of these titles are on blu-ray, but for some, you'll need to watch them on DVD.

I would also add Kiss of Death from 1947.

Richard Widmark's character Tommy Udo was genre defining....

[dougotte]

Originally Posted by PowellPressburger

Today's haul with some noir titles

Attachment 115741

a double life had been getting high prices lately on Amazon probably due to low stock but a 3rd party seller posted a copy the other day at about 15.00 so I grabbed it along with some other BLUs and DVDs

Fallen Angel is one of my favorites. I think I'll watch it again! I wish we had a BD available.

[MifuneFan]

I just got this email from TCM, and I think it's a very cool opportunity. They're offering a free online course about Film Noir taught by noir expert Richard Edwards

TCM Presents Into the Darkness: Investigating Film Noir

Jun 1 - Aug 4, 2015

Cost per enrollment: Free

Ball State University with Turner Classic Movies
Starts June 1, 2015

Summer is cooler in the shadows.

We invite movie fans from around the world to join us for a flexible, multimedia investigation and celebration of film noir.

In this nine-week course, we’ll go back in film history to investigate the "The Case of Film Noir"—the means, motives, and opportunities that led Hollywood studios to make these hard-boiled crime dramas, arguably their greatest contribution to American culture.

This course will run concurrently with the Turner Classic Movies "Summer of Darkness” programming event, airing 24 hours of films noir every Friday in June and July 2015. This is the deepest catalog of film noir ever presented by the network (and perhaps any network), and provides an unprecedented opportunity for those interested in learning more to watch over 100 classic movies as they investigate “The Case of Film Noir.”

Both the course and the associated films will enrich your understanding of the film noir phenomenon—from the earliest noir precursors to recent experiments in neo-noir. You will be able to share thoughts online and test your movie knowledge with a worldwide community of film noir students and fans.

Course Outcomes

Students will

• gain a deeper appreciation of classic Hollywood movies
• be able to identify the characteristics of a film noir
• able to explain the origins and history of film noir
• be able to perform close analyses of films noir

Topics include

• What is Film Noir?
• Film Noir and Its Influences
• Film Noir in the Studio System
• Film Noir Themes and Characters
• Film Noir in the Postwar Period

Frequently Asked Questions

Do I need access to TCM to participate in this course?
No. For non-TCM subscribers, we will have free links to online public domain films noir, so anyone can participate fully in this course.

How long is this course?
Nine weeks, since it is designed to run in conjunction with TCM's "Summer of Darkness."

Will this course offer a certificate of completion?
Yes.

What kind of time commitment may I expect?
For students who seek to complete the course, it will take between two and four hours each week, not including additional time to watch a few films noir each week on your own or on TCM. For students who wish to participate but are not interested in a certificate of completion, we still want you to be involved. This course is flexible in its design, and you may choose to do as much or as little as you have time for each week.

Are there any synchronous or live events in this course?
Yes. The course will use social media and Google Hangouts on Air to have a few live events. But in case you are not available when an event is occurring, an archived video copy will be available for later viewing.

Will the instructor be involved in the course?
Yes.

Enroll Now

[jetthead]

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

I just got this email from TCM, and I think it's a very cool opportunity. They're offering a free online course about Film Noir taught by noir expert Richard Edwards

Yeah I got that as well. Sounds very interesting.