Official Terminator Thread

[GreenScar]

Originally Posted by DVDave

Dude I've seen it 3 times as well. Skynet even tells Marcus that he did exactly what he was supposed to do and says "It was YOU who killed John Connor." It's not my reasoning. It's the scriptwrters and it's onne of the main criticisms that's been leveled at the film for Skynet's stupid logic.

And yes I can 100% assure you that they were T-700's in the shot I am talking about. Dozens of them. I have even confirmed this with my Terminator Salvation Official Movie Guide and Art of Terminator Salvation books. They are T-700's.

Then the movie does suck. Why didn't Marcus kill Connor when he had the chance? instead of saving his life? Why did Marcus want to head North to SkyNet instead of look for the resistance when he met Reese? Why would they have power supplies for the T800s in the assembly line for the T700s?

The way I've explained it explains all of that. So I can see it your way and hate the movie for being illogical everywhere, or I could see it my way and love it.

[GreenScar]

Originally Posted by DVDave

Marcus was never programmed to kill JC (another criticism leveled at the film). Marcus was looking for the person who made him. Before he finds out he is a machine, he is heading north to where Cyberdyne was because he doesn't understand why he is still alive. All he remembers is that he donated himself to Cyberdyne systems before he was executed. He wants answers. So do we.

I've no idea about the power supplies between the T-800 and the T-700 but the other major difference between the two is that the T-700's have no white enamel on their teeth. Their teeth are all aluminum metal.

Let me just say, I'm not trying to be a wiseass to you, and I'm glad you've had patience with me.

Here's a picture from T1 (T800-101) where the skulls (at least to me) look identical to the one's on the table above. I can't see enamel on it's teeth but it does look smoother. Having worked many years ago in a metal shop, it's completely feasible that the metal could get a powder coat or a chrome coating to give it the polished look:



Could it be that the enamel is coated on the metal and when it get's burned, it melts off?

If you look at the chest plates here:



and compare it to this (which chest plates match)?



As to saying that Marcus was already programmed for his mission when he went online and that he just wasn't programmed to kill Connor...There's nothing to support this or my explanation (admittedly) but by following what your saying it creates a plot hole. By seeing it the way I do, it adds humanity to the character. I don't know, it's tough in that I still don't see concrete evidence to not believe the way I see it.

Here's an image from the Sarah Connor Chronicles which wasn't a part of the cinema canon:



I'll keep looking, because now I need to know

[Diesel]

T-700






according to the terminator wiki site, there is only one T-700 shown in the film

the difference between the 800 and the 700 isn't the chrome finish, its the size

700 is slightly larger than the 800 but less bulky than the 600

Oddly enough, despite all the merchandise present for the T-700, only a single T-700 appears in the film, peering at the camera after missing John Connor board the Transport in Skynet Central close to the end of the film.

http://terminator.wikia.com/wiki/Series_700

[Diesel]

the one he shot looked more like a 600 to me
it seems pretty big

[Diesel]

Originally Posted by DVDave

I don't understand why the T-600's are giant 10 feet tall?

They stick out like a sore thumb. No wonder Skynet retired them so fast. Man, Skynet makes a lot of stupid mistakes for an A.I. doesn't it?

well it was their first attempt at a human looking one wasn't it?
guess it didn't know what the hell is was doing

[Diesel]

Originally Posted by DVDave

Well what the heck ever gave Skynet the impression that humans were 10 feet tall?

what gave them the impression that Arnold-like terminators would blend in....

[Diesel]

Originally Posted by DVDave

They have detailed files of the Governator of Culifornyah.

Attachment 6389

speaking of Uncle Bob

i love this difference listed for the 800 vs 850

"The skin peels away more easily / is less tight fitting"

translation: arnold got older and we made up an excuse

[GreenScar]

I guess one can believe what they want. For me, since Connor say's they're 800's then they're 800s in production. Since Marcus didn't kill Connor or Reese when he had the chance, then he was acting from his human side. And I still think Reese wasn't killed because they planned on replicating him for some reason...after Marcus jumps to the production floor (where we see a T800 in the flesh with robotic arms tending to it in the background) he takes a few steps and looks down to a member of the resistance on a table similar to the one the T600(or is it a 700?) is putting Reese on when Star shows up and distracts the machine. Looks like some kind of Scanning machine.

I also believe that Marcus wanted to head north (There's someone I have to find is what I believe he said) to sync with SkyNet central. Even after Reese told him that there was nothing north but SkyNet, he yells at Star to get out of the Jeep. It's not until the Terminator scout shows up that he snaps out of it. He knew Dr Kogan was dying before and knew it was now 2018. Maybe McG will ruin it for me (or explain everything) with the directors commentary on blu

[Diesel]

Originally Posted by GreenScar

I guess one can believe what they want. For me, since Connor say's they're 800's then they're 800s in production. Since Marcus didn't kill Connor or Reese when he had the chance, then he was acting from his human side. And I still think Reese wasn't killed because they planned on replicating him for some reason...after Marcus jumps to the production floor (where we see a T800 in the flesh with robotic arms tending to it in the background) he takes a few steps and looks down to a member of the resistance on a table similar to the one the T600(or is it a 700?) is putting Reese on when Star shows up and distracts the machine. Looks like some kind of Scanning machine.

I also believe that Marcus wanted to head north (There's someone I have to find is what I believe he said) to sync with SkyNet central. Even after Reese told him that there was nothing north but SkyNet, he yells at Star to get out of the Jeep. It's not until the Terminator scout shows up that he snaps out of it. He knew Dr Kogan was dying before and knew it was now 2018. Maybe McG will ruin it for me (or explain everything) with the directors commentary on blu

i still haven't seen the T-800 you're referring to
i missed it the second time around
thats one of the reasons i need to see it again to see that

it was a 600 not a 700
because remember Connor says to cut the thing behind their head and it messes up the aiming system shortly, which is exactly what they do
so its definitely a 600

[Diesel]

correction to my earlier statement, the T-600 was not the first humanoid form
the T-70 was

http://terminator.wikia.com/wiki/Series_T-70

its from that T2: 3D battle across time thing cameron and them did for Universal (so i guess its considered a cannon model)

[GreenScar]

Don't you think a better infiltrator unit would look like this?



Sorry, just wanted to post the pic

[Diesel]

Originally Posted by DVDave

Marcus knew that his answers were at Cyberdyne. He must have known Dr. Kogan had died already from cancer. He still thinks he is human and has free will at this point. He DOES scratch the back of his head at the base of his spine indicating where the CPU was implanted in his head.

It still goes back to my biggest complaint: How does Skynet know that Kyle Reese is John's father? What possible significance does Kyle Reese have to be #1 on the kill list? None of this makes any sense whatsoever and McG and the writers had better do some serious explaining in the next film because the plot holes are bigger than a black hole.

you know the first time i never noticed that once
the second time i noticed it alot
its so subtle
i'm glad they had him do that

Originally Posted by GreenScar

Don't you think a better infiltrator unit would look like this?

-awesome picture here-

Sorry, just wanted to post the pic

MUCH better infiltrator than marcus or uncle bob

[Diesel]

i terminator wiki'd the T-600

In this timeline, the Series 600 concept has been revised into a hulking behemoth in excess of 8 feet tall, armed with a vulcan cannon hardmounted to the right arm. However, it is still based on the human skeleton. This does not necessarily preclude an infiltration role as there would likely be variants of the T-600 for different functions, which would naturally be made in appropriate sizes. Also, a seven to eight foot tall Terminator mocked-up as a human would only need to disguise itself well enough to get within firing range of a human camp, as it is very difficult to judge size from a distance. [citation needed] Preview images have shown their faces partially covered in obvious rubber skin and their eyes fully exposed.

http://terminator.wikia.com/wiki/T-600

[GreenScar]

Originally Posted by DVDave

It still goes back to my biggest complaint: How does Skynet know that Kyle Reese is John's father? What possible significance does Kyle Reese have to be #1 on the kill list? None of this makes any sense whatsoever and McG and the writers had better do some serious explaining in the next film because the plot holes are bigger than a black hole.

I know it's stretching, but the list may not be a kill list at all (the resistance calls it a kill list). It may be people of importance for one reason or another. I think that they don't know that he's the father but that he is the one that travels back in time to stop the first Terminator. I think the machine they were strapping him onto was to create a Reese Terminator so the first Terminator would succeed. Given what McG says here:

McG: Skynet is aware of the alternate futures, and the way that we play it is in the spirit of parallel worlds, as theorized by Einstein. We try to pay attention to that approach to a fundamentally theoretical construct. So yes, they are aware of the other attempts on the life of John Connor, and they've always subscribed to a bigger-gun philosophy, from the T-800 to the T-1000 to the TX. Now they've decided to bring in a machine with enough humanity in it to properly infiltrate the Resistance and lure John Connor to their lair. That's why Serena speaks of thinking differently, thinking radically.

It's possible SkyNet knows Reese was sent back and so they are planning something we weren't aware of. But like you said, hopefully it's explained either in the blu or in the sequels

[Diesel]

Originally Posted by DVDave

Marcus is the FIRST Infiltrator unit prototype or T-RIP (Resistance Infiltrator Prototype). Obviously the 600 series weren't meant to infiltrate but their mimicry of humans is laughable.

well like it says, it only would have to get within firing range
which i'm sure it could, as proven by marcus who thought it was a person until it shot at him

the T-600 is clearly not meant to actually get within the human camps like the 800

[Diesel]

Originally Posted by GreenScar

I know it's stretching, but the list may not be a kill list at all (the resistance calls it a kill list). It may be people of importance for one reason or another. I think that they don't know that he's the father but that he is the one that travels back in time to stop the first Terminator. I think the machine they were strapping him onto was to create a Reese Terminator so the first Terminator would succeed. Given what McG says here:It's possible SkyNet knows Reese was sent back and so they are planning something we weren't aware of. But like you said, hopefully it's explained either in the blu or in the sequels

you know i never thought about them knowing of kyle going back to stop the T-800 and NOT knowing of him being connors father
that would be a good explanation as to why he was #1, since THAT is on file that he was in 1984 while him being johns father wasn't (besides sarah's record kept by Dr. Silberman that is)

[GreenScar]

I just want another 40 minutes added to the movie!

Of good stuff!

[GreenScar]

But what about what McG refers to? Still in this time line Reese was giving his Name to the video monitor. ((What your telling me, admittedly, may be flying right over my head ))

[Diesel]

Originally Posted by DVDave

But to start jumping into alternate timelines would violate the Predestination Paradox of the first film. Skynet has no foreknowledge of time travel at this point because it hasn't developed it yet. As for Connor's line "This isn't the future my mother warned me about" is directly referring to Marcus as a human terminator that even his mother could not have known about because it occurs in her future after her death. There was no way for her to have known everything that was going to happen in John's future, only what snippets of information she had disseminated from Kyle.

well you also have to take into account that its a movie
and the movie universe makes its own rules and is not definitely bound by our "real" rules for time travel even though most of it holds up well.

the terminator universe could have a totally different set of rules for time travel

[GreenScar]

A T600 right?