Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

No, they are not. And your repeating your baseless delusional beliefs does not make them true. You are, of course, free to believe any bat-shit nonsense you choose and you do choose to by the bucketful , but that does not change the reality at all.

The subject of human attention spans has been thoroughly studied by qualified professionals and there is no evidence that they have become shorter. The BBC reported on this matter and I previously linked to that article. I could repost that link, but it would serve no purpose as you are immune to facts when they conflict with your agenda- exactly like someone else who similarly posts absurdities in this thread. By comparison, that other poster is rational.

No one believes your predictions. No one but you. A rational person would begin to wonder if may be, just maybe, they were wrong after having been repeatedly told so by everyone countless times over, but not you. You just keep on predicting that movies and TVs are on the endangered species list every time you read something that scares you on the internet. And almost every thing you read on the internet seems to frighten you.

To summarize some of your predictions:

Vertically framed videos will kill movies.

Interactive videos will kill movies.

Microplayers viewed on mobile devices will kill movies.

Short form content optimized for mobile devices will kill movies.

Youth with allegedly compromised attention spans while also being allegedly obsessed with their phones will kill movies.

And all of the above will kill TVs.

When I read you-know-who's posts to other people, they said he was an idiot. When I read your posts to them, they say you are out of your f****** mind. You can at least teach an idiot.

You are wrong on at least one thing straight away. I don’t just read articles then become alarmed. Many things I have already gave a lot of thought too and to see someone else write the same views is the alarming bit because I share those views. My concerns go way further than some of these more recent articles, so in that sense you are wrong.

Finally, you and many others don’t agree. Fair enough. Where do you get off on calling people idiots though and ‘out of their mind’. Which is essentially what you are doing by saying ‘my friend said’. Practice what you preach because that is every bit as childish as what you accused me of doing a few days back.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You are wrong on at least one thing straight away. I don’t just read articles then become alarmed. Many things I have already gave a lot of thought too and to see someone else write the same views is the alarming bit because I share those views. My concerns go way further than some of these more recent articles, so in that sense you are wrong.

Finally, you and many others don’t agree. Fair enough. Where do you get off on calling people idiots though and ‘out of their mind’. Which is essentially what you are doing by saying ‘my friend said’. Practice what you preach because that is every bit as childish as what you accused me of doing a few days back.

Even the flat earthers can find kindred spirits online. Doesn't make the Earth flat, though. You are just spending time in an echo chamber of your own choosing.

Well, to paraphrase you from a while back: I call it as I see it. Stop pretending that you have not made similar assessments of others in this thread and stated so bluntly. There are few things worse than a hypocrite.

When a dozen people explain to someone that 2+2=4 several times each and that person still doesn't get it; labeling them an idiot fits like a glove.

When a person continually discusses their irrational and unsupported fears, no matter how many times others have attempted to reassure them that all is well, then at least part of their mental make-up comes into question. When it comes to predicting the future of home video I categorically declare your predictions as being "nucking futs"- again. I do not necessarily hold that opinion of you as an entire person due to insufficient information.

When certain people just go on and on and on and on and on repeating the same tired ridiculous crap, they become increasingly ripe for ridicule. It is more than harvest season now; reap what thou hast sown.

When I read some of the posts in this thread and elsewhere to others, I do so to see what their reactions are as a checks and balance against any personal bias of my own. If they concur as I did, even if they do so colorfully, then I at least know that my view has been further validated by people who have no history or involvement with this thread. They bring an entirely open mind to the subject.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

We will see.

I'm going to defend you here as this is the same dude who used rape as an example when discussing digital movies disappearing. Kind of hilarious they are calling you a lunatic.

While I don't agree that attention spans have shrunk as whole, I will agree that due to the constant availability of new content and social apps that people can be easily swayed from one thing to another more nowadays. It's not really an upswing in actual ADHD, but just trying to do too much all at once.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Groot

I'm going to defend you here as this is the same dude who used rape as an example when discussing digital movies disappearing. Kind of hilarious they are calling you a lunatic.

While I don't agree that attention spans have shrunk as whole, I will agree that due to the constant availability of new content and social apps that people can be easily swayed from one thing to another more nowadays. It's not really an upswing in actual ADHD, but just trying to do too much all at once.

There is no "they." One specific person alone used that unfortunate analogy. I spoke out about it at the time.

Regardless, that has nothing to do with the validity of the predictions being made over and over and over and over again. They are completely baseless and entirely bizarre. The repetition of them alone is enough to make one wonder about the mental state of their author. The predictions ARE crazy, or, to be more precise, nucking futs, whatever the poster making them may, or may not, be.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

It was meant as an extreme comparison. So you aren't even really agreeing with him, you are just defending him on an arbitrary basis that has nothing to do with the insane points he is making (which he actually believes will come true and doesn't mean that as an intentionally unlikely extreme hypothetical).

Try using some real reasoning skills next time.

I'm defending him because he's a good guy, I personally find you to be a jerk. He's over the top, but he's never outright spiteful, mean and demoralizing the way you are.

Nah.

Originally Posted by Vilya

There is no "they." One specific person alone used that unfortunate analogy. I spoke out about it at the time.

Regardless, that has nothing to do with the validity of the predictions being made over and over and over and over again. They are completely baseless and entirely bizarre. The repetition of them alone is enough to make one wonder about the mental state of their author. The predictions ARE crazy, or, to be more precise, nucking futs, whatever the poster making them may, or may not, be.

Did I even mention you? They = a person of an unspecified gender.

And? I don't agree with them, he knows this. My issue is that you guys are berating the shit out of him all the time now. Instead of trying to have a dialogue, like what I did with him, it's just now pure spiteful mockery. I find that unnecessary.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Groot

Did I even mention you? They = a person of an unspecified gender.

And? I don't agree with them, he knows this. My issue is that you guys are berating the shit out of him all the time now. Instead of trying to have a dialogue, like what I did with him, it's just now pure spiteful mockery. I find that unnecessary.

"They" can also be plural and as "we" have spoken to the questionable sanity of these predictions, the usage seemed to be inclusive of the two of us.

Suppose I made a prediction that all music albums were doomed, that people only had the inclination and attention spans for short 2-3 minute long singles.

Suppose I went on to say that home audio systems would cease to be sold as everyone would be listening to their hit singles through earbuds connected to their smartphone . No need for expensive speakers and receivers: phones and earbuds- that's the future.

All with no evidence, naturally, to support any of it.

And suppose after receiving numerous rebuttals, some laced with sarcasm, that I reasserted my prediction a second time. And then a third. And then a tenth. And to infinity and beyond. Would the rebuttals continue to be as "diplomatic" as they were the first time, or even the second time?

I really doubt it.

Patience is not an unlimited commodity. Saying the same identical stupid shite repeatedly becomes annoying. You might even say it is what a troll, an idiot, the crazy, or even all of the preceding would do?

If it brings out the "sarcastic ass" in me, oh well.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Vilya

"They" can also be plural and as "we" have spoken to the questionable sanity of these predictions, the usage seemed to be inclusive of the two of us.

Suppose I made a prediction that all music albums were doomed, that people only had the inclination and attention spans for short 2-3 minute long singles.

Suppose I went on to say that home audio systems would cease to be sold as everyone would be listening to their hit singles through earbuds connected to their smartphone . No need for expensive speakers and receivers: phones and earbuds- that's the future.

All with no evidence, naturally, to support any of it.

And suppose after receiving numerous rebuttals, some laced with sarcasm, that I reasserted my prediction a second time. And then a third. And then a tenth. And to infinity and beyond. Would the rebuttals continue to be as "diplomatic" as they were the first time, or even the second time?

I really doubt it.

Patience is not an unlimited commodity. Saying the same identical stupid shite repeatedly becomes annoying. You might even say it is what a troll, an idiot, the crazy, or even all of the preceding would do?

If it brings out the "sarcastic ass" in me, oh well.

It was pretty clear who I was referring to in my post. You're better than that.

My issue is that the thread has turned into "Digital vs Physical & Who can bash Steedeel The Most Discussion Thread". If you don't like his predictions or can't share something of value back, there's no reason to continually berate him. Even if he's dismissive or furthers the debate, there's no need for the lack of civility that this thread has dived into the last month. It's pretty damn disgusting and basically cyber-bullying.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Groot

It was pretty clear who I was referring to in my post. You're better than that.

My issue is that the thread has turned into "Digital vs Physical & Who can bash Steedeel The Most Discussion Thread". If you don't like his predictions or can't share something of value back, there's no reason to continually berate him. Even if he's dismissive or furthers the debate, there's no need for the lack of civility that this thread has dived into the last month. It's pretty damn disgusting and basically cyber-bullying.

Value, like beauty, is oft in the eyes of the beholder.

I refuted a number of his core contentions, such as the imagined shortening of human attention spans and his claim that TV sales were in decline. Neither of these were true. I listed an abbreviated history of both short and long form content coexisting for 130 years and counting. I pointed out that there is no evidence showing any decline in movie popularity.

He is not "furthering" any debate, no evidence is ever offered, so much as he is simply repeating himself.

I will ponder your claim that he is being treated too harshly. I do not see how any of this reaches the level of cyber bullying; how is he being threatened or intimidated? Just the same, I will refrain, for a time, from responding to his posts while I consider your point of view.

[The_Donster]

So let me get this straight. We can call bullshit as long as it isn’t someone we don’t like or agree with? I’m sorry, but that’s not how opinions or discussions work. Let alone the original intent of this thread was. You can’t talk shit if you can’t eat shit occasionally. Which is Steedeel’s (and a few others) problem in a nutshell. We’re treating him as he treats everyone else in the thread who disagrees with him.

[Groot]

Dynamo - That long winded garbage is another example of my general disdain towards you. Keep writing those books no one wants to read.

Donster - You’ve spoken to me enough that you know what isn’t the case. Ribbing on him every so often is fine and usually deserved. This entire thread the last bit is nothing but going at him. I think it’s starting to be a little much. I dislike Dynamo and Wendell but don’t make it a point to reply to their posts every time and point out why I disagree with them or they’re wrong from my perspective. Every single time I’ve read the thread lately it’s bashing him or poking the bear to bash him some more.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Groot

Dynamo - That long winded garbage is another example of my general disdain towards you. Keep writing those books no one wants to read.

So now it's about length and not content? Almost half of the post are your quotes anyway. If you look at only what I wrote minus the quotes, it's really not THAT long (and if you really want to get into who writes more than the other, compare our respective join dates and total post counts - you type WAY more than me). I just pointed out a ton of ridiculous hypocrisy on your part. With the main exception of general average post length, you've been guilty of many of the vary things that you have "disdain" towards me over. Since you are clearly unable to effectively refute any of that, all you have left to fall back on is post-length. Great job grasping at straws.

Feel free to continue being a hypocrite.

Originally Posted by Groot

I dislike Dynamo and Wendell but don’t make it a point to reply to their posts every time and point out why I disagree with them or they’re wrong from my perspective.

Well, you seem to base right and wrong around nice and not nice (while not being very nice, yourself), rather than on facts, reasoning and logic, so that's a huge part of the problem with your perspective right there.

[Vilya]

I do not feel he has been treated anywhere near as badly as has been suggested, but I recognize that could be due to my own personal blindspot. It can be hard to see fault in one's self.

I will agree that I have said enough in response to his predictions. Saying more would only exacerbate things and accomplish nothing of value, so I will simply stop.

Maybe not forever, but for a nice long breather at least.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

So now it's about length and not content? Almost half of the post are your quotes anyway. If you look at only what I wrote minus the quotes, it's really not THAT long (and if you really want to get into who writes more than the other, compare our respective join dates and total post counts - you type WAY more than me). I just pointed out a ton of ridiculous hypocrisy on your part. With the main exception of general average post length, you've been guilty of many of the vary things that you have "disdain" towards me over. Since you are clearly unable to effectively refute any of that, all you have left to fall back on is post-length. Great job grasping at straws.

Feel free to continue being a hypocrite.



Well, you seem to base right and wrong around nice and not nice (while not being very nice, yourself), rather than on facts, reasoning and logic, so that's a huge part of the problem with your perspective right there.

Me and him having words while also having a general friendly accord vs being a complete dick every other post to berate someone are two different things.

I'll be nice when someone deserves that level of respect back. I haven't found it with you, I personally do not like you and I'm sure the feeling is mutual and that's fine. I don't go out of my way to agree or disagree with your posts, I simply ignore them most of the time. I'm just fed up seeing someone who is relatively harmless and seems to be a decent dude getting shit for multiple pages the last few weeks. Most of his predictions and views are completely against what I believe, but I'm not gonna sit here and go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on every god damn day mocking him for it.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Groot

Me and him having words while also having a general friendly accord vs being a complete dick every other post to berate someone are two different things.

Was this supposed to be an example of you being friendly to him?...

Originally Posted by Groot

Well I’m not going to deny being a smartass, but the point is to show it’s hypocritical. You’re generally bent out of a shape over digital movies but give no shit about games. That’s hilarious when the exact same scenario of ownership can apply on both sides.

I'll be nice when someone deserves that level of respect back. I haven't found it with you, I personally do not like you and I'm sure the feeling is mutual and that's fine.

While I can be hotheaded, I can also be respectful. I think you are having selective memory (probably focusing on the one post that you can't let go of that I've admitted was in poor taste) as you and I have actually had at least a small handful of relatively cordial exchanges in the past. I'll admit, you are not my favorite person on these forums, but you are far from being among my most disliked. If I happen to be among your most disliked, so be it. That wasn't my intention, and I can see where a couple of our exchanges in the past may have pushed that over the edge, but I do think that you are selectively focusing on some past interactions while (be it intentionally or unintentionally) forgetting about others.

At any rate, I just see a lot of hypocrisy in what you are going on about, as you have frequently behaved in a manner contrary to that which you are now saying everyone else should.

I don't go out of my way to agree or disagree with your posts, I simply ignore them most of the time.

Well, I tend to post in "bursts." Meaning that, as has been the case the past few days, largely on this current back and forth with Steedeel, I've been active. But I go long periods of time without posting much if at all, so I haven't even emassed half the posts that you have despite being a member here 3 to 4 times longer. So there are times where there isn't much that you would be able to respond to anyway even if you wanted to. When I do post, sometimes it will be at length if I don't think a few short sentences gets the point across as effectively. If that means fewer people read it or give a crap, so be it.

And when I do post, you are free to post disagreements. You don't have to, but you choosing not to engage in discussion doesn't mean that everyone else has to do things as you do. This is a DISCUSSION FORUM after all. It is kind of the point. How and when you choose to engage in conversation should not necessarily be the basis for how everyone else chooses to do so. And frankly, with all due respect, I think a big part of why you don't engage at times is because you don't have decent counterpoints to valid arguments that I make on these matters. You just don't like me and/or what I say for whatever reason, but often can't really come up with a solid refute to my points, so the result is this resentment that you have.

I'm just fed up seeing someone who is relatively harmless and seems to be a decent dude getting shit for multiple pages the last few weeks.

While I know that you are not stating that I'm the only one doing this, of note is the fact that I've only really been heavily replying for the last few days or so, and most of what has been happening for the past few weeks was with little to no participation on my part.

Again, him being nice or harmless is neither here nor there. I don't think that he's otherwise a bad person. But even if he was, it wouldn't make his points that he posts here any more or less deserving of ridicule. While I understand being more interested in interacting with people that you find to be nice, you continuing to insinuate that how nice they are or are not has any bearing on whether or not any crazy, out-there statements on their deserve replies and ridicule is ridiculous. If a nice, smart rocket scientist said 1 + 1 = 11, he would be wrong, and would be deserving of ridicule for getting such a simple math problem wrong, especially if he continued to defend it after the error being pointed out. If a really mean mass-murder, terrible of a person as he would be, said 1+1=2, then he would be right, and the kind of person he is or the things he has done would not dictate whether or not that answer is correct.

Most of his predictions and views are completely against what I believe, but I'm not gonna sit here and go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on every god damn day mocking him for it.

A big part of why I got as harsh with him as I recently did is because he's going on and on about the "abuse" that he claims to receive, wouldn't let that go for a time, and then once he does move on, proceeds to immediately double down once again on some of his most "out there" concerns and predictions, takes them to an all time level of absurdness, and proceeds to wonder why he gets the replies that he does, and you proceed to blame everyone else, despite you replying in similar manners to him in the past, even if not at the same volume.

Expecting anyone to come into this thread, post stuff akin to what he does, and expecting not to get the kind of replies that follows is like someone joining Fight Club and then proceeding to complain when they get punched.

And he doesn't understand people not empathizing with his concerns despite blatant hypocrisy on his part (i.e. the previous conversations on gaming and digital distribution).

[Steedeel]

It’s just opinions about tech and the future (included in the heading of this thread) it’s not s crime to have what others consider far out opinions.

Do me a favour guys, never go on jury duty.

Finally, thanks Groot. There’s a difference between sarcasm and (imo) vindictiveness. These guys will probably choose to not see that though.

[Ender14]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

That’s the new name for it. It was going under that name until last week I believe. This will undoubtably be competition for Netflix as it takes eyeballs away from them despite being designed for mobile. I expect Netflix to respond with more shorts and everyone else for that matter.
In fact, I think Netflix may go the route of having two different apps for tv and mobile. They already mentioned they considered editing shows for mobile so that they are cropped and we get more close ups I believe. They may chop up some episodes into bite size chunks or even develop new content.

Regardless of the arguments in here, attention spans are getting shorter.

Ah, I wasn't aware they were one in the same. Thank you for the clarification.

[Truewitt]

Originally Posted by Vilya

"They" can also be plural and as "we" have spoken to the questionable sanity of these predictions, the usage seemed to be inclusive of the two of us.

Suppose I made a prediction that all music albums were doomed, that people only had the inclination and attention spans for short 2-3 minute long singles.

Suppose I went on to say that home audio systems would cease to be sold as everyone would be listening to their hit singles through earbuds connected to their smartphone . No need for expensive speakers and receivers: phones and earbuds- that's the future.

All with no evidence, naturally, to support any of it.

And suppose after receiving numerous rebuttals, some laced with sarcasm, that I reasserted my prediction a second time. And then a third. And then a tenth. And to infinity and beyond. Would the rebuttals continue to be as "diplomatic" as they were the first time, or even the second time?

I really doubt it.

Patience is not an unlimited commodity. Saying the same identical stupid shite repeatedly becomes annoying. You might even say it is what a troll, an idiot, the crazy, or even all of the preceding would do?

If it brings out the "sarcastic ass" in me, oh well.

I have no dog in this one, but it's funny you say the bolded above because that is exactly what is happening there.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Truewitt

I have no dog in this one, but it's funny you say the bolded above because that is exactly what is happening there.

Depends, started doing albums and 45's (singles) in the 60's. IMO, most pop albums had one or two good songs on them and the rest was just filler. The Greatest Hits albums were/are the exception. I find the same true today for many albums that I am interested in so I just purchase the MP3 of the single of interest.

For most, not all, New Age I buy the entire album (CD). Same for Classical music. Jazz and Country is a mix of albums and singles.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Finally, thanks Groot. There’s a difference between sarcasm and (imo) vindictiveness. These guys will probably choose to not see that though.

Given how much complaining and whining you've done about other people's use of sarcasm (example below, ironically you complaining to Groot about her use of it towards you - I like the seemingly pretend "buddy, buddy" thing the two of you suddenly have out of nowhere when up until very recently, it wasn't like that at all), it seems that you don't interpret it much differently than vindictiveness in the first place.

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Groot, sarcasm pisses me off but you still do it.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Given how much complaining and whining you've done about other people's use of sarcasm (example below, ironically you complaining to Groot about her use of it towards you - I like the seemingly pretend "buddy, buddy" thing the two of you suddenly have out of nowhere when up until very recently, it wasn't like that at all), it seems that you don't interpret it much differently than vindictiveness in the first place.

No, Groot knows how I feel about sarcasm. I don’t like it and Groot made mention of that a little earlier if you would read posts rather than jumping in. There is a world of difference between sarcasm though and (imo) downright nastiness and vindictiveness. Sarcasm (despite annoying me) isn’t intended to hurt someone.

Also, Groot voices her views and we will at times clash, but she doesn’t hold grudges and she has the good grace to address me with the respect I deserve as aforum member and human being. I post across the entire forum and you will rarely find anyone with anything negative to say about me outside of this thread. That includes the film section, VR section, 3D section etc..