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Old 01-03-2019, 04:08 AM   #12821
Vilya Vilya is offline
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Another year full of wonderful releases awaits us all...and on every format.
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Old 01-03-2019, 03:55 PM   #12822
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Originally Posted by Vilya View Post
Another year full of wonderful releases awaits us all...and on every format.
Happy new year everyone. Looking forward to them but also keeping a cautious eye on this interactive business. After Netflix has fired the first shot, already the talk has grown of Disney’s new streaming service having to match them in that department lest they fall behind the streaming leaders. It starts........
With that level of interaction, can younger gens go back to linear content for other stuff or will they start getting impatient wanting to control all their content? I see a dark future for our beloved films.

Remember Steedeel told you guys.

Last edited by Steedeel; 01-03-2019 at 04:19 PM.
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Old 01-03-2019, 11:02 PM   #12823
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Happy new year everyone. Looking forward to them but also keeping a cautious eye on this interactive business. After Netflix has fired the first shot, already the talk has grown of Disney’s new streaming service having to match them in that department lest they fall behind the streaming leaders. It starts........
With that level of interaction, can younger gens go back to linear content for other stuff or will they start getting impatient wanting to control all their content? I see a dark future for our beloved films.

Remember Steedeel told you guys.
Happy New Year to you as well!

I am afraid, however, that I can not remember your warnings for any duration. I only retain happy thoughts.

As an added irony, I was given Netflix gift cards for Christmas. Am I being targeted for conversion?

Actually, they were from my sister; she wants me to watch a Netflix original series called Memories of The Alhambra. It does look interesting. I may have to keep Netflix just for their original stuff.


Plus, I do want to see Roma.

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Old 01-04-2019, 10:42 PM   #12824
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Originally Posted by rocknblues81 View Post
I’ve bought the digital download to Hard Eight, Breakdown, Mousehunt, Talk Radio, Look Who’s Talking and A Simple Plan because I’m tired of waiting for these movies to get a release. Don’t get me wrong, most of my digital stuff com es from codes that have came with my discs, but I’m not denying myself the movies I want to see anymore.
This is a tough scenario I often consider as well. There are so many movies that are still sadly not on blu. And it's hard to anticipate if or when they will ever be released on blu and/or uhd. A lot of us are probably stubborn and wait years and years despite there already being digital alternatives. Some stuff I'll just go ahead and buy if it's $4.99 or less and others I have a hard time even considering if they're not d2d or sales titles. And then there's the dilemma when I d2d or buy movies and they eventually do end up on blu. Then I'm stuck with a digital stream that I no longer want and have no option of selling or trading. It'd be nice to at least have some sort of compromise such as being able to trade/sell back to the digital provider for credit towards another title. Admittingly, digital often looks pretty good to me and it may even be tough to distinguish from discs a lot of the time without when casually watching. But I like the high bitrates and lossless audio a disc can provide, in addition to extras and the tangibility of them in general. Plus, there are just too many providers and I don't like to have to jump through hoops to standardize everything.

Last edited by meremortal; 01-04-2019 at 10:56 PM.
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Old 01-04-2019, 10:49 PM   #12825
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Originally Posted by flyry View Post
So looking back I only bought 20 discs this year.(i'm counting the harry potter 4k collection as one)


11 4k
9 blu (mostly criterion arrow and shout and movies not on 4k


for digital:

42 purchases (almost all $2 d2d plus one free code from a friend)

9 UHD purchases(Some of these were codes another was free. i did usually had credits when buying them)
I bought 12 discs (17 if you count the MI set separate).

Of those, all but 3 were 4K.

Digital - I purchased 239 films. I even bought the PT AND OT Star Wars set.

Times, they are a-changing.

And yes - I bought all of those legitimately via Vudu, iTunes or Movies Anywhere. They regularly put out discount codes or run sales. The SW set is usually $99, I got it for around $60 IIRC. Most new releases after a week - even before disc sales, drop to $9-$14

Works for me.
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Old 01-05-2019, 02:55 AM   #12826
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Originally Posted by meremortal View Post
This is a tough scenario I often consider as well. There are so many movies that are still sadly not on blu. And it's hard to anticipate if or when they will ever be released on blu and/or uhd. A lot of us are probably stubborn and wait years and years despite there already being digital alternatives. Some stuff I'll just go ahead and buy if it's $4.99 or less and others I have a hard time even considering if they're not d2d or sales titles. And then there's the dilemma when I d2d or buy movies and they eventually do end up on blu. Then I'm stuck with a digital stream that I no longer want and have no option of selling or trading. It'd be nice to at least have some sort of compromise such as being able to trade/sell back to the digital provider for credit towards another title. Admittingly, digital often looks pretty good to me and it may even be tough to distinguish from discs a lot of the time without when casually watching. But I like the high bitrates and lossless audio a disc can provide, in addition to extras and the tangibility of them in general. Plus, there are just too many providers and I don't like to have to jump through hoops to standardize everything.
That's whats great about Movies Anywhere. Especially now that they added 4K playback. I tend to watch a lot of stuff in there. Plus it ports any features from itunes or wherever into the app.
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Old 01-05-2019, 03:47 AM   #12827
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Originally Posted by flyry View Post
That's whats great about Movies Anywhere. Especially now that they added 4K playback. I tend to watch a lot of stuff in there. Plus it ports any features from itunes or wherever into the app.
Happy New Year everyone! I agree MA is the way to go, especially now that they have 4K. Everyone is cutting the cord and Streaming, and the top Providers are Amazon, Hulu, iTunes, and Netflix. Discs are fading, but they will be around for the Collectors. Movies and TV Shows will come out on Disc only if the demand is there, otherwise it will be Digital Streaming. Cord Cutting is taking over, and 75% of the people Stream mostly from Subscription. Now we have to wait for the end of year Disc Sales, but I'm sure they will be very low.
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Old 01-05-2019, 03:54 AM   #12828
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Movies Anywhere needs a few more studios involved and it'd be perfect.
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Old 01-05-2019, 08:28 AM   #12829
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Movies Anywhere needs a few more studios involved and it'd be perfect.
it also needs tv shows and we could use some decent customer service. Its kind of a cluster **** dealing with digital when you have a problem since they all just push the blame on to the other guy.

Though I haven't had to deal with digital problems as of late to much since I started using my bds more often.
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Old 01-05-2019, 02:56 PM   #12830
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Originally Posted by meremortal View Post
Then I'm stuck with a digital stream that I no longer want and have no option of selling or trading. It'd be nice to at least have some sort of compromise such as being able to trade/sell back to the digital provider for credit towards another title.
IMHO, never going to happen!!

Quote:
Admittingly, digital often looks pretty good to me and it may even be tough to distinguish from discs a lot of the time without when casually watching. But I like the high bitrates and lossless audio a disc can provide, in addition to extras and the tangibility of them in general. Plus, there are just too many providers and I don't like to have to jump through hoops to standardize everything.
Catalog DVD2HD Digital has been hit and miss, as in the HD Digital: sound track was almost mono compared to the DVD, in several cases the video was worse than the DVD, did not have the OAR, etc.

Then you have the problem of what digital provider provides HDR10, HDR10+, HLG, Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos, DTS:X and if they do provide one of the newer video/audio formats it is only available on very select hardware. As to Movies Anywhere, an article here by Media Play News.
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Old 01-05-2019, 04:53 PM   #12831
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I also think we will see far less vintage films if it ever switches to digital films.
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Old 01-05-2019, 07:04 PM   #12832
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A Best Buy near me is getting rid of CDs recently. That's what one of the workers there told me. The row of CDs is gone and the CDs that are left are in a bin now. It's too bad as I prefer to buy a CD than buy music digitally or subscribe to a music service because of the better audio quality of a CD due to higher bitrate. I don't buy digital music or subscribe to a music service and I don't intend to start.
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Old 01-05-2019, 07:38 PM   #12833
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Originally Posted by alchav21 View Post
Happy New Year everyone! I agree MA is the way to go, especially now that they have 4K. Everyone is cutting the cord and Streaming, and the top Providers are Amazon, Hulu, iTunes, and Netflix. Discs are fading, but they will be around for the Collectors. Movies and TV Shows will come out on Disc only if the demand is there, otherwise it will be Digital Streaming. Cord Cutting is taking over, and 75% of the people Stream mostly from Subscription. Now we have to wait for the end of year Disc Sales, but I'm sure they will be very low.
If you are going to state a statistic, such as "75% of the people stream mostly from subscription" you need to back that up with a citation not just make it up. The actual percentage is 69%; your guess was close, but still just a made up stat. Even I have streaming services; it does not mean it is my primary source for video entertainment.

https://www.leichtmanresearch.com/69...-svod-service/

As of mid November blu-ray sales were down just 2.5% for the year, actually up 3.6% since July. As of the end of the 3rd quarter 4K discs sales were up 87% for the year. These are not made up stats, but actual verified facts. So much for your predictions.

https://www.degonline.org/wp-content...ver-Note-1.pdf

If you read the sales data chart at the bottom of the above linked article you will also readily see that when it comes to purchases, discs still outsell digital. Discs sold $2.79 billion while digital (EST) sold $1.8 billion. That's nearly a billion dollar difference in favor of discs.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...postcount=1011

Even though you think the idea of discs fading, or even failing entirely, is "cool", it is still unrealistic. Many people still enjoy physical media, in part or in whole, and your actively wishing for its demise is simply mean spirited, but thankfully ineffectual and as misinformed as ever.

Once again, a disc combo pack gives you a movie on two disc formats plus the digital code for very little extra money compared to the code alone. You get two hard copies, both in higher quality than their streaming counterparts AND that you actually own, plus a digital copy that you can access from anywhere that the internet permits. It is the best overall value and it offers all of the benefits of both disc and digital.

Cord cutting refers to cancelling cable or satellite TV service. Internet service, whose monthly costs rise as regularly as that of any cable TV service, is very much dependent upon cords especially for those obsessed with wired home networks like yourself. There is no cutting of cords; we simply bind ourselves with the cords of our own choosing.

Last edited by Vilya; 01-05-2019 at 09:21 PM.
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Old 01-05-2019, 11:40 PM   #12834
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Originally Posted by PCFan View Post
A Best Buy near me is getting rid of CDs recently. That's what one of the workers there told me. The row of CDs is gone and the CDs that are left are in a bin now. It's too bad as I prefer to buy a CD than buy music digitally or subscribe to a music service because of the better audio quality of a CD due to higher bitrate. I don't buy digital music or subscribe to a music service and I don't intend to start.
I think you said that about films?
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Old 01-06-2019, 03:11 AM   #12835
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Originally Posted by PCFan View Post
A Best Buy near me is getting rid of CDs recently.
Best Buy announced that March 2018, supposed to have been removed by July. Much easier to order online (Amazon, Best Buy, Target, Walmart and several others) than try to find in the B&M's.
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Old 01-06-2019, 05:52 AM   #12836
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Do whatever makes you happy, but discs are not going anywhere. You will have the option to vacillate for years to come. I have been listening to this claptrap nonsense about their "huge decline" and imminent death for 4 years now and they are just as readily available as ever with dozens of new titles released on disc every single week of the year. That's just for blu-ray and 4K, too; I do not track DVD releases. I can dredge up posts from 2015 that insisted that discs were certainly doomed way back then and here they still are with a new disc format in addition. These armchair prophets can't predict rainfall in a rain forest much less the future of physical media.

Somehow despite all of these ignorant predictions, renewed by the perennially clueless every year, I found 362 titles on disc to buy this year. I averaged nearly one disc a day in 2018. They are that plentiful and they are that easy to find.

The 4K disc format is up 87% according to 3rd quarter results and no movie studio is going to drop discs in the foreseeable future with results that strong. Blu-rays have done better this year than in the past two years and might end the year with sales being either flat or just down slightly.

"UHD Blu-ray sales up 68% in Q3 and up 87% for the year."

After three quarters of 2018, disc sales brought in $2.79 billion dollars while digital copies tallied $1.8 billion dollars. When it comes to purchases, disc still outsells digital even now in 2018. No studio is going to forego their share of that $2.79 billion in disc sales.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...postcount=1002

As of mid November blu-ray sales were only down 2.5% for the year. Nowhere near constituting a "huge decline."

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...postcount=1011

Streaming bitrates have been unchanged for three years now, stuck at 15-16 Mbps for 4K streams, and there are no indicators that is about to change nor has any new magical codec come along to make such anemic bitrates look better. A 4K disc can produce bitrates as high as 128 Mbps with 80-90 Mbps being very common. A 4K disc has a bitrate 5 to 8 times higher than that of a 4K stream and you are not going to be streaming at that level anytime soon and even if you could, your data consumption would explode and your internet bill would rise accordingly assuming your ISP even offers enough bandwidth in the first place.

It is perfectly permissible to have a collection comprised of both digital and disc; many of our members do exactly that. There is no penalty for alternating between them, either. Use some logic already: a digital collection doesn't go bad because you buy a disc nor does your disc collection fail because you buy a digital movie. Most disc purchases of new titles include the digital copy as well; buy the combo pack and you get it all. Both work whatever ratio of the two you have in your library. You do not lose anything from either one if you switch your purchases back and forth between them for whatever reason.

For very little extra money compared to a code alone, a disc combo back gives you two copies of the movie on disc plus a digital code for three ways to watch total. You get everything that disc and digital have to offer plus you have two back-ups besides. The value is very obvious.
My pizza consumption was up 300% this year. Last year I had one slice. When you start from a very small base, percentages can be deceiving.

The benefits of disc are not the point. The benefits are clear. The market doesn't always choose correctly and it has always chosen convenience over quality.

In 2018, the average share of the UHD titles with the largest share each week was 31.49%. The average share of the top 20 UHD titles with the largest shares was just 10.64%. The UHD shares of the top-50 titles typically average 5 to 7%. UHD is not exactly blowing it away.

In 2018, Blu-ray sales weren't terrible as compared to 2017. Revenue was down 1.94% and units were down 3.2%. But Blu still only has a 30% overall unit share and a 45% revenue share. And the total North American disc business was $4.1 billion in 2018 as compared to almost $11 billion in 2009. In no way can that be considered healthy.

It doesn't mean that discs disappear. But it does mean fewer releases, fewer restorations, fewer fancy boxed sets, etc. Just as in music audio, the world is moving to streaming for better or worse.
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Old 01-06-2019, 06:08 AM   #12837
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I also think we will see far less vintage films if it ever switches to digital films.
Ironically the original War of the Worlds as well as It's a Wonderful Life recently received digital only UHD releases
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Old 01-06-2019, 09:57 AM   #12838
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Originally Posted by ZoetMB View Post
My pizza consumption was up 300% this year. Last year I had one slice. When you start from a very small base, percentages can be deceiving.

The benefits of disc are not the point. The benefits are clear. The market doesn't always choose correctly and it has always chosen convenience over quality.

In 2018, the average share of the UHD titles with the largest share each week was 31.49%. The average share of the top 20 UHD titles with the largest shares was just 10.64%. The UHD shares of the top-50 titles typically average 5 to 7%. UHD is not exactly blowing it away.

In 2018, Blu-ray sales weren't terrible as compared to 2017. Revenue was down 1.94% and units were down 3.2%. But Blu still only has a 30% overall unit share and a 45% revenue share. And the total North American disc business was $4.1 billion in 2018 as compared to almost $11 billion in 2009. In no way can that be considered healthy.

It doesn't mean that discs disappear. But it does mean fewer releases, fewer restorations, fewer fancy boxed sets, etc. Just as in music audio, the world is moving to streaming for better or worse.
Just my opinion, but you have been spouting this stuff since 2011. You had the format doomed (imo) but here we are well over the ten year life span. I find it fascinating that you never comment on Digital HD, a format that is absolutely nowhere near where it needs to be to be a thriving, industry reviving hit. Subscription sure, but EST? I can’t take you seriously when you only focus on one side.

UHD wil be fine also, healthy growth is healthy growth.

Blu-ray survived 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 and it will still be here in 2020 and beyond.

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Old 01-06-2019, 09:58 AM   #12839
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Ironically the original War of the Worlds as well as It's a Wonderful Life recently received digital only UHD releases
Oh sure, you can cherry pick titles but there are hundreds of thousands of titles out there. Once we get to exclusives, that will be all she wrote also.
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Old 01-06-2019, 11:56 AM   #12840
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Originally Posted by ZoetMB View Post
My pizza consumption was up 300% this year. Last year I had one slice. When you start from a very small base, percentages can be deceiving.

The benefits of disc are not the point. The benefits are clear. The market doesn't always choose correctly and it has always chosen convenience over quality.

In 2018, the average share of the UHD titles with the largest share each week was 31.49%. The average share of the top 20 UHD titles with the largest shares was just 10.64%. The UHD shares of the top-50 titles typically average 5 to 7%. UHD is not exactly blowing it away.

In 2018, Blu-ray sales weren't terrible as compared to 2017. Revenue was down 1.94% and units were down 3.2%. But Blu still only has a 30% overall unit share and a 45% revenue share. And the total North American disc business was $4.1 billion in 2018 as compared to almost $11 billion in 2009. In no way can that be considered healthy.

It doesn't mean that discs disappear. But it does mean fewer releases, fewer restorations, fewer fancy boxed sets, etc. Just as in music audio, the world is moving to streaming for better or worse.
Your myopia seems rather deliberate. Your pizza analogy only serves to make me hungry and unlike that analogy, we have actual sales data and dollar amounts to measure the true performance of discs. A multi-billion dollar physical media industry and its market performance is a tad more significant than fluctuations in your pizza consumption.

4K UHD is still a young format that nearly doubles from one year to the next. While it will likely never be a mainstream format, it has shown sustained and robust growth. Such meteoric growth more than proves that the format has strong support.

As someone who bought 362 titles on disc last year and who monitors each week's releases, I can tell you that there have not been fewer releases nor fewer restorations. I seldom pay attention to the collector box sets as I do not particularly desire all of the trinkets they contain. Most weeks see over 60 titles released on blu-ray and 4K, even more when you add in DVDs. Some weeks last year had over 90 titles come out in a single week. All of this indicates that the market for disc is more than healthy enough to sustain itself.

No one refutes the growth of streaming, but the vast, vast majority of that lies with all you can eat buffet subscription streaming, not with digital purchases.

When it comes to purchases, physical media still outsells digital. The reverse may happen someday, but that day has not yet arrived. After 3 quarters of 2018, disc sales have brought in $2.79 billion. No industry is going to abandon that much money.

Digital purchases brought in considerably less at $1.8 billion, so those who purchase still buy disc more than they buy digital. Spin that anyway you like, but the numbers do not lie.

Contrasting 2011 disc sales to 2018 is an inapt comparison. There are more options for consumers now and that naturally dilutes the market share that disc purchases hold today. In 2011, discs had little competition so of course they had higher sales numbers then. The real barometer for purchases is the year over year data and that data still shows discs outselling digital copies every single year that both have been available. Digital purchases may overtake discs someday, but even if it does, it does not automatically spell trouble for discs. The purchase market isn't the movie Highlander, there can be more than one.

All purchases across all formats are down over that time period due to that same buggaboo creature that is subscription streaming. Thanks to it, many former purchasers of video content no longer do so, or not as frequently, but it would be absurd to suggest that purchases are mortally wounded. The market has changed since 2011, but it is more than large enough to accommodate every type of consumer.

Digital music has not been able to kill either the nearly 37 year-old compact disc nor the vinyl record, and digital streamed video content will not kill discs. I have been reading these predictions year after year that discs are doomed and yet they remain AND with an exciting and explosively growing new format on top of it. Does it not get tiring for these self-imagined clairvoyants to be perennially wrong? I guess if they predict the end of something long enough, they may be right eventually, but if it takes a decade or longer for their annually renewed predictions to come to pass, you'll have to excuse me for not taking them seriously.

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