Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by flyry

Ironically the original War of the Worlds as well as It's a Wonderful Life recently received digital only UHD releases

Feel free to browse my collection and tell me how many titles within it are unavailable as digital purchases or even from subscription services.

We can play this game all you like, but I would wager that more of my collection is disc only than your digital library is digital only.

It's A Wonderful Life looks fine on blu-ray and its bitrate likely exceeds that of your 4K stream by almost 100%. A 4K disc release may yet happen besides.

The 1953 War Of the Worlds languishes on DVD, but that, too, will likely change someday. More catalog titles get released every month, sci-fi especially.

If neither ever get released to disc, there are others ways to acquire a physical copy. If the industry ever decides to rely upon the internet exclusively to deliver content they may just find that that very internet enables people to just help themselves. How much has the music industry lost due to their dependence upon the internet to deliver their content? Music can be acquired freely thanks to it and it is not all that hard to do the same for other types of content.

[CV19]

Originally Posted by Vilya

If neither ever get released to disc, there are others ways to acquire a physical copy. If the industry ever decides to rely upon the internet exclusively to deliver content they may just find that that very internet enables people to just help themselves. How much has the music industry lost due to their dependence upon the internet to deliver their content? Music can be acquired freely thanks to it and it is not all that hard to do the same for other types of content.

That's very true, the industry ends up shooting itself in the foot so to speak. If you can't get hold of a legitimate physical copy, there are always the bootleg copies typically available from Amazon Spain. I don't care for burnt discs generally speaking, but I'd rather have that than nothing at all.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by ZoetMB

In no way can that be considered healthy.

Do you believe the industry is jumping for joy because of the very anemic EST sales? In fact EST sales are pretty pathetic when one takes into account the number of devices capable of playing EST titles. Physical sales are down because of saturation and there are not enough new, worthy titles to be purchased to sustain YoY growth. IMHO, for a former industry executive you sure have a narrow field of view.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Do you believe the industry is jumping for joy because of the very anemic EST sales? In fact EST sales are pretty pathetic when one takes into account the number of devices capable of playing EST titles. Physical sales are down because of saturation and there are not enough new, worthy titles to be purchased to sustain YoY growth. IMHO, for a former industry executive you sure have a narrow field of view.

I managed to find plenty somehow.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by CV19

That's very true, the industry ends up shooting itself in the foot so to speak.

IMO the movie industry has ruined the value of their content by licensing the content to subscription streaming providers and providing UV/MA codes. It was a mistake that will take so doing to undo. Titles with any value have been/will be removed from subscription streaming. We will have to wait and see what happens with UV/MA codes. I have gotten a couple of titles recently that did not have UV/MA codes.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I managed to find plenty somehow.

Same here, 45 of which were titles from this year.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I managed to find plenty somehow.

28 titles for the year , 8 new releases, 20 catalog, most catalog new Blu-ray. My average for the 12 years of BD, 49 titles per year so I am down a good bit for my average. It is not a matter of money, just not enough titles of interest. I quit smoking cigarettes > 22 years ago and put that money toward media purchase.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Feel free to browse my collection and tell me how many titles within it are unavailable as digital purchases or even from subscription services.

We can play this game all you like, but I would wager that more of my collection is disc only than your digital library is digital only.

It's A Wonderful Life looks fine on blu-ray and its bitrate likely exceeds that of your 4K stream by almost 100%. A 4K disc release may yet happen besides.

The 1953 War Of the Worlds languishes on DVD, but that, too, will likely change someday. More catalog titles get released every month, sci-fi especially.

If neither ever get released to disc, there are others ways to acquire a physical copy. If the industry ever decides to rely upon the internet exclusively to deliver content they may just find that that very internet enables people to just help themselves. How much has the music industry lost due to their dependence upon the internet to deliver their content? Music can be acquired freely thanks to it and it is not all that hard to do the same for other types of content.

That narrative about the music industry is severely outdated. You sound like you have a flip phone. This isn't 2001. Most people subscribe to spotify or apple music etc to get their music.

Its just easier and convenience wins out. Read an article a few months ago saying how streaming beat piracy.

I think Netflix and the like were kind of doing the same for movies but now with so many upcoming providers and digital Exclusives many fear it will drive people back to piracy

[CV19]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

We will have to wait and see what happens with UV/MA codes. I have gotten a couple of titles recently that did not have UV/MA codes.

Yes, same with me. In fact very few new titles I've bought recently have included UV/MA codes, and as for back-catalogue titles - none of them whatsoever included the codes. These were UK purchases by the way.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by flyry

That narrative about the music industry is severely outdated. You sound like you have a flip phone. This isn't 2001. Most people subscribe to spotify or apple music etc to get their music.

Its just easier and convenience wins out. Read an article a few months ago saying how streaming beat piracy.

I think Netflix and the like were kind of doing the same for movies but now with so many upcoming providers and digital Exclusives many fear it will drive people back to piracy

All the subscription services will just offer another tier with free content (if they lose subscribers by the hundreds of thousands) but with ads inserted at the start and maybe in the middle of content. They will have thought of the scenario you describe.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by flyry

That narrative about the music industry is severely outdated. You sound like you have a flip phone. This isn't 2001. Most people subscribe to spotify or apple music etc to get their music.

Its just easier and convenience wins out. Read an article a few months ago saying how streaming beat piracy.

I think Netflix and the like were kind of doing the same for movies but now with so many upcoming providers and digital Exclusives many fear it will drive people back to piracy

My phone may as well be a flip phone. I still use a Samsung Note 3.

From what I have heard, flip phones are cool again and are enjoying a small resurgence.

The "music narrative" is oft stated, but hardly outdated and it remains true. Digitally accessed music, whether streamed or downloaded, has failed to kill the compact disc, the LP, or even the cassette tape. The internet has made paying for music essentially optional, too. Convenience cuts both ways; a person can make recurring payments for ad free music streaming or they can simply take what they want and pay no one. Quite a few choose the latter.

I have read several accounts of how many members of the younger generation think that paying for any music or video content is stupid. They just take it and the internet has made all of it low hanging fruit.

Not everyone streams their music. I don't and most of my old fogey friends don't. We relics from the past resist yet. I still buy a cd when I want the entire album and I download when I just want a single song.

The larger point is that if the content owners want to force everyone to access their properties via the internet, they will pay a price for it. Putting all of their content on the internet makes simply taking it easy- very, very easy.

With music files it is especially so as they are tiny, but even the largest video files are easy, too, as they are no worse than downloading a video game. The ever increasing bandwidth that gamers and streamers love make piracy of larger files ever easier to do. Once downloaded bootleggers can burn discs or they can simply transfer the file online. The irony is that the industry itself makes this possible.

Those two digital only titles that you trot out every chance you get can be easily obtained through alternative means. Any exclusive online content is subject to being taken and that same exclusivity even encourages it. My little wager still stands, too, regarding how many of my disc titles are disc only versus how many of your digital titles are digital only.

Song Of The South says hello, by the way. Disney stopped distributing it decades ago, but the internet sure hasn't.

I buy officially licensed product by the armful and I always will, but I am also not getting any younger and I will not wait forever to see what I want to see. Thanks to their preferred business model, I don't have to, either.

[veritas]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

IMO the movie industry has ruined the value of their content by licensing the content to subscription streaming providers and providing UV/MA codes. It was a mistake that will take so doing to undo. Titles with any value have been/will be removed from subscription streaming. We will have to wait and see what happens with UV/MA codes. I have gotten a couple of titles recently that did not have UV/MA codes.

I think streaming mostly ruined the value of cable and satellite as that was the big shift in consumer spending.

I think competition in general has ruined the value of tv shows and movies. More and more content keeps getting produced and most entertainment is pretty interchangeable.

The other thing that is probably killing a movies value is the cost of seeing a movie in theaters. They now charge enough that I don't really see movies in theaters which effectively means they can only sell movies to me at blind buy prices or after its been on netflix. This is more a personal thing but i have found in general studios don't drop prices at a fast enough rate. The longer a show has been out the less I will be willing to pay and studios tend to drop the price on stuff slower then the rate I would be willing to pay for stuff. I feel like I see a movie I want and they say $25 and I'm like damn I would have payed 15 day one and when it gets to 15 I go ya but its a year old now I will only pay 5 or 10 .

[veritas]

IMO the number of really good movies put out each year as been rather low for the last few years also. You have a few blockbusters that are sequels and you have a few remakes but not to many good high quality new original films. I feel like I could count on one hand the number of films I would rate as good each year for the last 5 years.

[Steedeel]

Very surprising news just in, ITunes (and presumably the tv app) will be available on 2019 Samsung TVs.

Update: Also on 2018 models via a firmware update.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Very surprising news just in, ITunes (and presumably the tv app) will be available on 2019 Samsung TVs.

Update: Also on 2018 models via a firmware update.

Apple just sees Streaming taking over, and wants to open it up a little from their closed Ecosystem!

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Apple just sees Streaming taking over, and wants to open it up a little from their closed Ecosystem!

But, but Apple would never do that! . Are you switching to disc if Apple takes over the digital scene Alchav?

[Vilya]

Apple does not sell TVs, so I am not surprised that they would want their app included with them. It makes perfect business sense for them to widen the availability of their app to at least smart TVs as people are quite fond of streaming to them. As smart TVs already include a wide array of apps, expecting people to then go and buy an Apple 4K TV device just to access their store, which has essentially nothing unique about it, was arbitrarily limiting their business. The money is made in the app store where people make repeated transactions, not in the one time purchase of a proprietary streaming device that is unnecessary with a smart TV.

Now if their app ever appears in the Android store, that will surprise me.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

IMO the movie industry has ruined the value of their content by licensing the content to subscription streaming providers and providing UV/MA codes. It was a mistake that will take so doing to undo. Titles with any value have been/will be removed from subscription streaming. We will have to wait and see what happens with UV/MA codes. I have gotten a couple of titles recently that did not have UV/MA codes.

Originally Posted by veritas

The other thing that is probably killing a movies value is the cost of seeing a movie in theaters. They now charge enough that I don't really see movies in theaters which effectively means they can only sell movies to me at blind buy prices or after its been on netflix. This is more a personal thing but i have found in general studios don't drop prices at a fast enough rate. The longer a show has been out the less I will be willing to pay and studios tend to drop the price on stuff slower then the rate I would be willing to pay for stuff. I feel like I see a movie I want and they say $25 and I'm like damn I would have payed 15 day one and when it gets to 15 I go ya but its a year old now I will only pay 5 or 10 .

You guys have hit on some good points, the cost of Movies. The Studios just want to sell, and the Movie Buyers just want the best price. Codes made a secondary market that Movie Buyers could use to reduce their cost on Movie purchases. Many Movies on Discs are not coming out with Codes, or only on iTunes. I have also seen that the price of Movies are not coming down like in the past, and I think that has to do with the Distributors that control their prices. Studios just want to sell their Movies, and people just want the best price to see those Movies. So it all comes down to Supplies, Demand, and Marketing. Disc or Digital is irrelevant, the Average Person just wants to see that Movie!

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Just my opinion, but you have been spouting this stuff since 2011. You had the format doomed (imo) but here we are well over the ten year life span.

Don't you hate those doomsayers who just bang on and on about how dark and gloomy the future is going to be?

What a depressing lot they are.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Apple does not sell TVs, so I am not surprised that they would want their app included with them. It makes perfect business sense for them to widen the availability of their app to at least smart TVs as people are quite fond of streaming to them. As smart TVs already include a wide array of apps, expecting people to then go and buy an Apple 4K TV device just to access their store, which has essentially nothing unique about it, was arbitrarily limiting their business. The money is made in the app store where people make repeated transactions, not in the one time purchase of a proprietary streaming device that is unnecessary with a smart TV.

Now if their app ever appears in the Android store, that will surprise me.

The only issue being that streaming sticks and boxes (generally) are more reliable than built in apps. Which is why I think we will see a Apple streaming stick soon.