Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Netflix IS a cable channel. No different to HBO for example. There original remit was replacing blockbuster stores with a online movie store. That has changed beyond recognition imo. They are now just another channel.

I am extremely confused. Why is cable good and streaming bad when they both have the same disadvantages? How can you be fearful about the future of physical media but support the only form of streaming (subscriptions) that is doing well enough to threaten it?

[avs commenter]

Netflix is not 'another cable channel' because they have content (a lot) you can't get anywhere else. They also do 4K HDR with Atmos so the quality is second to none.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

I am extremely confused. Why is cable good and streaming bad when they both have the same disadvantages? How can you be fearful about the future of physical media but support the only form of streaming (subscriptions) that is doing well enough to threaten it?

Where have I said cable is good?

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

Netflix is not 'another cable channel' because they have content (a lot) you can't get anywhere else. They also do 4K HDR with Atmos so the quality is second to none.

You mean like how HBO has content you can't get anywhere else, or Showtime has content you can't get anywhere else, or FX has content you can't get anywhere else?

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Where have I said cable is good?

You obviously think that cable/satellite are good enough to pay for. Your personal feelings about them are irrelevant as long as you continue to spend money on cable/satellite and streaming. Netflix and Sky don't care about your feelings if you continue to give them money.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

You mean like how HBO has content you can't get anywhere else, or Showtime has content you can't get anywhere else, or FX has content you can't get anywhere else?

.

Other than the few things they release on disc, you can only get Netflix original content on Netflix. I can get HBO, FX and Showtime content on Itunes and Amazon.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

Netflix is not 'another cable channel' because they have content (a lot) you can't get anywhere else. They also do 4K HDR with Atmos so the quality is second to none.

Second to disc.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

You mean like how HBO has content you can't get anywhere else, or Showtime has content you can't get anywhere else, or FX has content you can't get anywhere else?



You obviously think that cable/satellite are good enough to pay for. Your personal feelings about them are irrelevant as long as you continue to spend money on cable/satellite and streaming. Netflix and Sky don't care about your feelings if you continue to give them money.

I have had Sky for 20 years. In that time I have amassed 800 DVD’s and I’m around 750 Blurays.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I have had Sky for 20 years. In that time I have amassed 800 DVD’s and I’m around 750 Blurays.

So the thousands of pounds you're spending on cable/satellite and streaming is okay because you're also spending thousands of pounds on physical media? You are constantly talking about how streaming is going to ruin everything but you are a digital supporter in the only way that matters: money. Being a physical supporter as well doesn't prevent you from being a huge hypocrite.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

So the thousands of pounds you're spending on cable/satellite and streaming is okay because you're also spending thousands of pounds on physical media? You are constantly talking about how streaming is going to ruin everything but you are a digital supporter in the only way that matters: money. Being a physical supporter as well doesn't prevent you from being a huge hypocrite.

What do you think Sky is?

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

What do you think Sky is?

Oh! I know this one!

It's falling!

(geez, I kill me)

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

Netflix is not 'another cable channel' because they have content (a lot) you can't get anywhere else. They also do 4K HDR with Atmos so the quality is second to none.

Lots of cable channels have original content that you can't get anywhere else.

And Netflix's 4k streams are second to 4k disc and to Kaleidescape's pricey download service. Netflix 4K streams only achieve a bit rate of 16 Mbps whereas a 4k disc can reach 128 Mbps and they often hover in the 90+ Mbps range. 4K disc has a bitrate that is up to 8 times greater than that of Netflix.

Netflix's Dolby Atmos is based on Dolby Digital Plus, which is a lossy format. Dolby Atmos on 4K disc is based upon Dolby TrueHD which is a lossless format with a higher bitrate. 4K disc beats Netflix on audio as well.

I have compared a 4K stream of Hostiles to the 4K disc of Hostiles and the 4K disc is far superior. The 4k stream was very good, but it was not in the same league as the 4K disc.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

Other than the few things they release on disc, you can only get Netflix original content on Netflix. I can get HBO, FX and Showtime content on Itunes and Amazon.

Untrue.

I can buy, and I have bought, Stranger Things Seasons 1 and 2 on disc. House Of Cards is another title of theirs that I could buy on disc. The rest can be easily acquired as well if you research the matter.

For all of Netflix's original content, so far the number of titles that I have found that I actually would consider owning number less than 10. Most of their content is forgettable dreck, another thing that they share in common with cable TV channels.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Lots of cable channels have original content that you can't get anywhere else.

And Netflix's 4k streams are second to 4k disc and to Kaleidescape's pricey download service. Netflix 4K streams only achieve a bit rate of 16 Mbps whereas a 4k disc can reach 128 Mbps and they often hover in the 90+ Mbps range. 4K disc has a bitrate that is up to 8 times greater than that of Netflix.

Netflix's Dolby Atmos is based on Dolby Digital Plus, which is a lossy format. Dolby Atmos on 4K disc is based upon Dolby TrueHD which is a lossless format with a higher bitrate. 4K disc beats Netflix on audio as well.

I have compared a 4K stream of Hostiles to the 4K disc of Hostiles and the 4K disc is far superior. The 4k stream was very good, but it was not in the same league as the 4K disc.

Sure, disc has a higher bit rate. But streaming 4K HDR with Atmos is still REALLY REALLY good.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

Sure, disc has a higher bit rate. But streaming 4K HDR with Atmos is still REALLY REALLY good.

I agree that Netflix's 4K streams are very good, but they are most certainly second to 4K disc and they are also second to the exorbitantly priced Kaleidescape download service. 4K disc has a MUCH higher bitrate, up to 8 times higher, and that makes a difference that you can readily appreciate.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I agree that Netflix's 4K streams are very good, but they are most certainly second to 4K disc and they are also second to the exorbitantly priced Kaleidescape download service. 4K disc has a MUCH higher bitrate, up to 8 times higher, and that makes a difference that you can readily appreciate.

I can notice the difference with audio on a 4K disc. But visually, which is more important to me, I don't see any difference between disc and 4K streaming.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

So the thousands of pounds you're spending on cable/satellite and streaming is okay because you're also spending thousands of pounds on physical media? You are constantly talking about how streaming is going to ruin everything but you are a digital supporter in the only way that matters: money. Being a physical supporter as well doesn't prevent you from being a huge hypocrite.

The "huge hypocrite" moniker is a little unfair, but engaging in hyperbole carries a price, too.

I know he states that streaming is the devil that will damn us all while enjoying the dark ritual with the rest of us, but it would be more accurate to say that he is prone to passionate exaggeration in support of purchasing content on disc over other options.

Cable TV and subscription streaming fulfill a different desire than do purchases. I do not see subscription streaming as the evil that he often characterizes it as because many of its customers are not of the mindset to buy content in the first place. Before SVOD, they just watched what cable offered them and now they watch what both offer them. They rarely bought then and they rarely buy now. Essentially, they just rent.

Those who want to purchase their content still do so and he is clearly numbered among them. A significant number of people will continue to purchase the content that they want. Naturally, I, and others, prefer those purchases to be physical media, but we only get to make that decision for ourselves.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

I can notice the difference with audio on a 4K disc. But visually, which is more important to me, I don't see any difference between disc and 4K streaming.

I am surprised that you can not see a difference. It would be more conceivable to me if you had said that the differences were there, but not all that significant to you.

You are the only person that you need to please, certainly not me or anyone else, and if you're happy with what you're doing, then who am I to argue with your happiness?

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

What do you think Sky is?

It's a pay-TV broadcaster. You mentioned you have satellite TV through them. I lump broadcast TV, cable, satellite, and streaming together and I don't understand why anyone wouldn't. They all share the same disadvantages.

[Vilya]

In another thread forum member StingingVelvet compared a 4K stream to a blu-ray disc of the same title and had this to say:

"The HDR on the stream was very nice...However the whole thing had this hazy and mushy look to it. The BD looked more crisp and detailed and it wasn't subtle."

"Even more than that the sound quality (of the 4K stream) was ABYSMAL! I'm not even an audiophile, I use studio headphones and don't expect the world, but the whole movie sounded flat and weak. Putting on the BD I was amazed at how much richer, clearer and more dynamic the sound was. It was NOT subtle at all, it was a massive difference. Like... massive."

His full post here:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...&postcount=338

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

It's a pay-TV broadcaster. You mentioned you have satellite TV through them. I lump broadcast TV, cable, satellite, and streaming together and I don't understand why anyone wouldn't. They all share the same disadvantages.

What do you do for entertainment when you are not watching films?

By the way, you are arguing against yourself. I just said Netflix was just another channel.