Spears & Munsil 4K UHD HDR Benchmark (Test Discs) May 15, 2023

[mrtickleuk]

Originally Posted by aboulfad69

Thanks, given that the same identical DV settings are used on the TV for both devices, it seems to indicate there’s something funky being done in the Apple TV that I don’t think we (end users) may have control over.

I still watch physical movies using my UDP-203 at least once, and then for convenience occasionally use ATV/Infuse with my ripped BD.

Indeed, well if you do want that convenience you'll have to accept all the bugs and problems caused by Apple TV and forget about picture quality.

If you care about the best in picture quality (to the point that you're comparing test patterns in fine detail), then any convenience has to go out of the window and you should only ever watch a disc played back on a player.

[Sledgehamma]

Originally Posted by mrtickleuk

(my emphasis above)
You aren't supposed to use the test patterns as "training" to give you the ability to always be able to see these tiny things in real content. That would drive you mad, and you'd never enjoy anything!

I knew I was doing something wrong

[aboulfad69]

Originally Posted by mrtickleuk

Indeed, well if you do want that convenience you'll have to accept all the bugs and problems caused by Apple TV and forget about picture quality…

Agreed. My question though wasn’t clear, I wanted to learn or understand what aspect of picture quality is being impacted while watching a DV movie through the ATV given what that test pattern showed. I understand test patterns are meant to help in calibration but surely also to expose some non conformance to some part of a video standard.

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

Streaming and digital downloads are lower quality unless they are bit for bit 4K Blu-ray images. Only the Kaleidescape system is capable of downloading 100GB 4K Blu-ray images that are bit for bit the same as the optical disc. But the download would need to be three separate files of 2 BD-100’s and 1 BD-66. Maybe one day Spears and Munsil will be offered on the Kaleidescape system. But personally I prefer the 4K Blu-ray disc version since there exists over 100 million Blu-ray devices if one counts 4K videogame consoles versus maybe only under 100,000 Kaleidescape systems (perhaps under 10,000 since the company has not released the numbers). But the problem is the Kaleidescape system does not support Dolby Vision HDR or HDR10+ on their current models (maybe that will change with a firmware update or new hardware).

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=345757

KScape doesn't use ISO Blu-ray copies, they encode their own HDR10 HEVC files from studio provided consumer Pro Res mezzanine masters that disc and streaming distributors use. However, they tend to be similar in size to Blu-ray discs... unless they are extra long movies that were squeezed onto a BD66 disc and so the KScape file may be a little less compressed.

Even if KScape updated their hardware with DV chips, they would have to go back and redo their library with studio created Dolby Vision mezzanine files. I doubt they would want to go to the expense... even though their gear and video files can be quite expensive.

KScape does use the exact same lossless audio files that are destined for Blu-ray discs.

[B0rnGamer]

Originally Posted by Stacey Spears

Yes.

If you want to reproduce this.
1. Load the disc and go to Video Setup -> Color Space Eval.
2. Look at the EOTF tracking at the top. The lower levels should blend correctly.
3. Switch to HDR10. They should still blend. (Note that DV uses the 10,000 version while default HDR10 is 1000, so you may want to switch to 10K HDR10 for an apples-to-apples comparison.) Only the lowest levels will blend. Basically anything below the point where tone mapping begins. On a C9, that is around 300-350 cd/m².
4. Switch back to DV. They no longer blend as the levels have been altered. I believe if you let the pattern play for one minute, where it loops, it may correct itself. Or you may have to eject the disc. I forget. Because of this, the HFR never blend. And of course, the HD version won't blend because you are scaling the image. Scaling in perceptual / gamma space will break single pixel checkerboards. Scaling in linear light would most likely work, but no one does that.

This does not occur on the Sony 800 MK2. I mention this because they use the same MediaTek decoder, which handles the DV processing, I believe. This suggests a newer FW in the Sony. This is just an educated guess.

For the blending to work, you need to be in 1:1 mode on the display. If you are using a Sony display, this may not work at all because they are always processing the pixels. It was mentioned in the Classy interview that graphics mode may solve this, but I have not tested myself. My Dolby Vision testing has been primarily on LG. (C9 and CX)

Hello, was there ever a workaround discovered for the DV bug on Oppo 203? I also use a C9 myself.

Thanks!

[batman2000]

What’s the difference between the first and second edition?

[HeavyHitter]

Where can I order the latest edition? It seems to be hard to find.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

Where can I order the latest edition? It seems to be hard to find.

Try Robert at Value Electronics (here) or Medialight here.

[HeavyHitter]

Ended up getting this and going through some of the demo sequences. Great stuff.

I wanted to torture test my Envy's tone mapping ability (JVC NP5 at 98 nits).

10,000 nit horse sequence.

The magenta and discolorization blotches are caused from the compression I needed to do to the image for it to upload to the site. Taken with an older Galaxy phone so this is not exactly what I see on the screen, but close in terms of detail exposed.

Curious how it would like on a 10K nit reference monitor.

horsestonemapped.jpg

[David M]

Originally Posted by batman2000

What’s the difference between the first and second edition?

Second version has a lot more stuff on it, including Dolby Vision and HDR10+ on all the patterns.
Plus tests for Dolby Atmos, DTS:X etc.

[Geoff D]

Very nice HH! My TV can do the 1000-nit HDR10 horsies no problem, 2000 nits it's starting to clip the brightest spots but is most of the way there, and the 10000 nit horsies are an absolute mess. (This is because the ZD9 doesn't tone map, it just displays the content 'natively' along its own brightness curve, which is about 1800 nits peak when calibrated. GREAT for the vast majority of HDR content, but for Light Cannon™️ stuff I need help from a higher power...enter Dobly Vision.)

Given all the stuff said about the low latency DV mode, how it clips and whatnot, I was fearful of what I was gonna see with the DV horsies ...but with my current DV settings it resolves the 10k-nit horsies perfickly! Huzzah!

[DisplayCalNoob]

I stayed away from touching Tint like it is the measles. I was going through the other disc and surprised by the number of tint/color patterns.I did a A I search on Tint and what it affects, and learned that when it comes to HDR a proper adjustment is important to the accuracy of color. Three ticks to the right and now I see what is impressive about Aliens and what's not.