Star Wars Wars the UOT Strikes Back and OTHER PEZ dispensers

[opticzar]

I'm sure this has been discussed to death, but I still want to know what you guys think.

Does anyone else feel like the Star Wars universe is more technologically advanced in the prequels? It's always bothered me... I'm not talking about the graphics. The tech and gadgets themselves are more advanced. Bah. It's late.

[JasonWard]

Originally Posted by opticzar

I'm sure this has been discussed to death, but I still want to know what you guys think.

Does anyone else feel like the Star Wars universe is more technologically advanced in the prequels? It's always bothered me... I'm not talking about the graphics. The tech and gadgets themselves are more advanced. Bah. It's late.

Under democracy, art flourishes. Under Imperialism, things become very streamlined and design shifts as the means of production change. That's why X-Wings looked like pieced together tools and the Naboo Starfighter looks like a piece of art. In The Clone Wars, the first clone armor set is really strong. By Revenge of the Sith's phase II armor, it isn't as good and one character named Rex is reluctant to make the change. Under these two drastically different political climates, values change. Shields are important when you value life but become totally unimportant when you do not value life and so on.

[shelldweller]

Originally Posted by opticzar

I'm sure this has been discussed to death, but I still want to know what you guys think.

Does anyone else feel like the Star Wars universe is more technologically advanced in the prequels? It's always bothered me... I'm not talking about the graphics. The tech and gadgets themselves are more advanced. Bah. It's late.

Well actually... No. Unless you consider things like Anakin´s robotic hand more advanced than Luke´s perfect prosthetic, for example. The design alone makes in perfectly believable that the Prequels take place before Episodes 4-6.

[Mavrick]

Originally Posted by opticzar

I'm sure this has been discussed to death, but I still want to know what you guys think.

Does anyone else feel like the Star Wars universe is more technologically advanced in the prequels? It's always bothered me... I'm not talking about the graphics. The tech and gadgets themselves are more advanced. Bah. It's late.

I get what you mean, it's like the way Star Trek: TOS looks way outdated compared to Star Trek: Enterprise, which is set 100 years prior.

[NYorker]

Originally Posted by opticzar

I'm sure this has been discussed to death, but I still want to know what you guys think.

Does anyone else feel like the Star Wars universe is more technologically advanced in the prequels? It's always bothered me... I'm not talking about the graphics. The tech and gadgets themselves are more advanced. Bah. It's late.

I remember GL discussing about how, in the OT, things were made to look as if they went through a "wear and tear" process, things wear/break down, etc. in contrast with the days of the republic, when everything is "spiffy."

[riverbelow]

Yeah it makes perfect sense! It is a beautiful copout to be sure, but a sensible one.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by NYorker

I remember GL discussing about how, in the OT, things were made to look as if they went through a "wear and tear" process, things wear/break down, etc. in contrast with the days of the republic, when everything is "spiffy."

Hmm was this interview Pre 1997 or post? He seems to have changed his entire tune since the PT came out.

[El_Jay]

Originally Posted by JasonWard

Under democracy, art flourishes. Under Imperialism, things become very streamlined and design shifts as the means of production change. That's why X-Wings looked like pieced together tools and the Naboo Starfighter looks like a piece of art. In The Clone Wars, the first clone armor set is really strong. By Revenge of the Sith's phase II armor, it isn't as good and one character named Rex is reluctant to make the change. Under these two drastically different political climates, values change. Shields are important when you value life but become totally unimportant when you do not value life and so on.

In my opinion...

A New Hope was made in 1977 with very limited special FX.

The Phantom Menace was made in 1997 with every possible ILM advantage and an additional 20 years of knowledge and advancements in the field of special FX.

This is why things are more technologically advanced, not because of some grand pre-destined George Lucas master plan.


Just my opinion, not looking for an argument.

[NYorker]

Originally Posted by Cowboy

Hmm was this interview Pre 1997 or post? He seems to have changed his entire tune since the PT came out.

I'm almost certain it was post '97, may have even been one of of the DVD documentaries - don't remember which, but I distinctly remember he mentioned that.

[tom pain]

Originally Posted by El_Jay

A New Hope was made in 1977 with very limited special FX.

The Phantom Menace was made in 1997 with every possible ILM advantage and an additional 20 years of knowledge and advancements in the field of special FX.

This is why things are more technologically advanced, not because of some grand pre-destined George Lucas master plan.

I think they meant in the context of the Star Wars universe, not as film releases.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by El_Jay

A New Hope was made in 1977 with very limited special FX.

The Phantom Menace was made in 1997 with every possible ILM advantage and an additional 20 years of knowledge and advancements in the field of special FX.

This is why things are more technologically advanced, not because of some grand pre-destined George Lucas master plan.

Yeah im thinking he is talking about the look inside the film, not the effects themselves.

Also Star Wars in 1975/76/77 had 350 Special Effects at the time, no other film even came close to that back then. At the time I don't think the word "limited" would have applied.

[El_Jay]

Originally Posted by tom pain

I think they meant in the context of the Star Wars universe, not as film releases.

I understand that, but it's just a way of ret-conning it to explain why the special FX are so much better in movies made 20 years later.

You'll notice the Empire isn't rolling around in luxury whips either.

We're talking a period of like, what, 20-25 years from the end of Revenge of the Sith to the beginning of A New Hope? Is that really enough time for "oppression" to wipe out every single vehicle from the Old Republic?

I guess it's up to each individual person whether they buy it, but all I see is ret-con, that's all I've ever seen. This is actually the first time I've heard someone try and explain it in terms of the SW universe.

We have Anakin in Pod Races on Tatooine with ridiculously complex, beautiful, aerodynamic, streamlined vehicles, then 20 years later we have clunky land speeders on the same planet with no sign of the technology that had previously existed? Not just on a superficial level either.

[Torgon]

Originally Posted by tom pain

I think they meant in the context of the Star Wars universe, not as film releases.

Exactly.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by El_Jay

I understand that, but it's just a way of ret-conning it to explain why the special FX are so much better in movies made 20 years later.

You'll notice the Empire isn't rolling around in luxury whips either.

We're talking a period of like, what, 20-25 years from the end of Revenge of the Sith to the beginning of A New Hope? Is that really enough time for "oppression" to wipe out every single vehicle from the Old Republic?

I guess it's up to each individual person whether they buy it, but all I see is ret-con, that's all I've ever seen. This is actually the first time I've heard someone try and explain it in terms of the SW universe.

We have Anakin in Pod Races on Tatooine with ridiculously complex, beautiful, aerodynamic, streamlined vehicles, then 20 years later we have clunky land speeders on the same planet with no sign of the technology that had previously existed? Not just on a superficial level either.

That's part of the reason that these two trilogies (IMHO) can never and will never be cohesive because you can't fill that 20 year gap....

[El_Jay]

Originally Posted by Cowboy

That's part of the reason that these two trilogies (IMHO) can never and will never be cohesive because you can't fill that 20 year gap....

I like to think that they could easily have made things look consistent, but it wouldn't have looked new/flashy and spruced up for a new generation.

[shelldweller]

Originally Posted by El_Jay

I understand that, but it's just a way of ret-conning it to explain why the special FX are so much better in movies made 20 years later.

You'll notice the Empire isn't rolling around in luxury whips either.

We're talking a period of like, what, 20-25 years from the end of Revenge of the Sith to the beginning of A New Hope? Is that really enough time for "oppression" to wipe out every single vehicle from the Old Republic?

I guess it's up to each individual person whether they buy it, but all I see is ret-con, that's all I've ever seen. This is actually the first time I've heard someone try and explain it in terms of the SW universe.

We have Anakin in Pod Races on Tatooine with ridiculously complex, beautiful, aerodynamic, streamlined vehicles, then 20 years later we have clunky land speeders on the same planet with no sign of the technology that had previously existed? Not just on a superficial level either.

I don´t see how the Pod Racers are more advanced than Luke´s landspeeder.
Of course the effects in the Prequels are better than in the Original Trilogy but I really don´t see how the immanent technology in the Prequels is more advanved. Landspeeders exist in the Prequels as well as the Java Sandcrawlers and so on. On the other hand... Clones are an advancement over Battle Droids, the Death Star is the biggest Battle Station ever constructed, Anakin´s Robo-hand is less advanced than Luke´s etc etc ...

The overall design evolvement clearly follows the progression of our art history... I think it´s done perfectly without the trap of having more effect-possibilities at their disposal.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by El_Jay

I like to think that they could easily have made things look consistent, but it wouldn't have looked new/flashy and spruced up for a new generation.

Well that goes back to what I have always said. They should have fit the new films around the old ones not vice versa! These films are so outta whack with the OT even Stevie Wonder could spot the problems.

[El_Jay]

Originally Posted by shelldweller

I don´t see how the Pod Racers are more advanced than Luke´s landspeeder.
Of course the effects in the Prequels are better than in the Original Trilogy but I really don´t see how the immanent technology in the Prequels is more advanved. Landspeeders exist in the Prequels as well as the Java Sandcrawlers and so on. On the other hand... Clones are an advancement over Battle Droids, the Death Star is the biggest Battle Station ever constructed, Anakin´s Robo-hand is less advanced than Luke´s etc etc ...

The overall design evolvement clearly follows the progression of our art history... I think it´s done perfectly without the trap of having more effect-possibilities at their disposal.

Were Storm Troopers ever called Clones in the OT? I have a feeling that's another thing that was ret-conned in by the PT.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by El_Jay

Were Storm Troopers ever called Clones in the OT? I have a feeling that's another thing that was ret-conned in by the PT.

They were never clones back then....the clone wars was not explained for 20 years. All we heard was Obi Wan throwing out the phrase "The Clone Wars". As far was we knew Stormtroopers were just regular people. But then the whole idea of the "force" has changed as well since the advent of the PT.

[Shaft Windu]

Originally Posted by Cowboy

That's part of the reason that these two trilogies (IMHO) can never and will never be cohesive because you can't fill that 20 year gap....

They ARE cohesive. That's the beauty of the story-structure. The first three Episodes mostly take place in civilized cities with high culture and history because the main-characters live in that arena. The final three Episodes take place mostly on Battleships, Spacecrafts, scarce bunkers and remote unpopulatet planets because the main characters are on the run, in the trenches or in hiding. That's one of the reasons why Lucas had to wait such a long time so he could pull off the Prequels convincingly - and he suceeded! He achieved that the richer, more layered and complex look of the Prequels and the simpler, used look of OT is rootet in the very heart of the story.