Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Gone, like so many others before them. Profit is the measure of success in business. While governments can operate in the red indefinitely, a business can not.

There will be more "shaking out" to come as the streaming market is about to get more crowded than ever before. Some are bound to fail as the supply will exceed the demand.

What about Disc, as the Market for Disc keeps going down Streaming looks even better. It looks like 4K will be the last Physical Media, and you guys say that compression is the downfall of Digital but putting 8k on that same Disc will be even worse. The "Shake Out" in Digital will be nothing like cramming content on a Physical Disc. Let's see what wins out, Physical or Digital!

[stonesfan129]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Disc will stick round long enough to be still available when Digital HD is a rotten corpse just like ITunes Music downloads imo.

I think people have been rather silly to switch from disc to a lesser format that simply hasn’t got any legs. It’s a combination of marketing and sheep like behaviour but I suppose cheap codes means financially, it’s not a disaster for some.

Of course, subscription streaming is very much a success story.

I will disagree with you on iTunes downloads. I own quite a few. Many are 'Mastered For iTunes' tagged which come from 24-bit masters and often times sound better than the available CD, even at 256kbps AAC which actually does sound pretty close to a CD even on a top notch system. I generally only want one or two songs when I buy music so it's cheaper to get it from iTunes. If I want the whole album then I usually get the CD or FLAC download and stick it on my server.

[stonesfan129]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I was reading about health insurance costs in the US (uproar in U.K. because Trump wants to get his paws on our NHS) and I see the average costs per month is $350? How the heck do you guys have any luxuries at all? Disc or otherwise. That is a ludicrous expense.

I would want specifics on where they got those numbers. I have an individual plan through my employer that runs ~$85/month and has a $2,000 deductible. Health insurance is a mess in this country. What I wish they would do here that they do under European/Canadian systems is setting up rules for what products and services cost and then basically treating it like if the doctors/pharmaceuticals/hospitals don't like it then the state brings in other providers that get the business and they can then negotiate far lower prices. I have good insurance and I want a system like that. No one should be left out simply because they cannot afford it. But as long as these people lobby our politicians to keep the status quo, nothing will change. Without veering off topic too much, just my two cents. We can continue this in a PM or in another thread if you want to.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

What about Disc, as the Market for Disc keeps going down Streaming looks even better. It looks like 4K will be the last Physical Media, and you guys say that compression is the downfall of Digital but putting 8k on that same Disc will be even worse. The "Shake Out" in Digital will be nothing like cramming content on a Physical Disc. Let's see what wins out, Physical or Digital!

I never said that compression was "the downfall" to digital nor have I ever predicted that streaming or digital would utterly fail and cease to be. I have criticized streaming for being heavily compressed and far more prone to compression artifacts, but not enough so that I do not use it.

The decline in disc sales does nothing to make streaming look better; all of streaming's many limitations remain whatever becomes of the disc market. Discs are still the dominant purchase method although the margin by which that is so is eroding. Discs are profitable, thus the reason why they are still being made and it is also why we are getting more titles released on disc each year and not less. Streaming has yet to turn a profit. Streaming is popular, and therein lies its promise, but it has yet to turn its red ink into black.

It is not important to me that discs are the primary viewing choice of the masses. I am, and I always have been, an enthusiast. Enthusiasts want the best that they can have; the masses have other priorities like economy and convenience. It is important to me that discs remain a choice for those that value real ownership, the best in quality, and independence from ever more expensive internet and streaming services. As long as my choice remains, I do not resent your choice. I do use streaming afterall, just not exclusively like you do.

If 4K is the last physical media it will also likely be the last streaming level that most will ever utilize. If better and more efficient codecs come along, both will benefit from it. There are already prototype discs that can hold 6 TB of data on a disc the same diameter as a blu-ray, but the devices that play them remain too expensive to be practical. The studios and content owners will decide if they are going to offer 8K content and beyond and at this juncture they have not shown much interest in doing so. Even commercial theaters do not present movies in 8K; most are just 2K if I recall correctly. 4K content may, or may not, be the final frontier for home video entertainment in our lifetimes. If it is, I can easily live with 4K HDR WCG quality. If something better comes about that I can actually own, I will embrace it readily.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by stonesfan129

I will disagree with you on iTunes downloads. I own quite a few. Many are 'Mastered For iTunes' tagged which come from 24-bit masters and often times sound better than the available CD, even at 256kbps AAC which actually does sound pretty close to a CD even on a top notch system. I generally only want one or two songs when I buy music so it's cheaper to get it from iTunes. If I want the whole album then I usually get the CD or FLAC download and stick it on my server.

The point is, they are old hat now and the numbers are with streaming. I’m sure people still have music on their hard drive or storage device but they will be just sitting there, unused by the masses.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by stonesfan129

I will disagree with you on iTunes downloads. I own quite a few. Many are 'Mastered For iTunes' tagged which come from 24-bit masters and often times sound better than the available CD, even at 256kbps AAC which actually does sound pretty close to a CD even on a top notch system. I generally only want one or two songs when I buy music so it's cheaper to get it from iTunes. If I want the whole album then I usually get the CD or FLAC download and stick it on my server.

I own a few myself but in my opinion, the audio is a little flat and lacks feeling.

I still prefer CD and Vinyl.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Things shake out and only the strong survive, but Streaming is Streaming.

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

You make a door knob look smart.

There are people that I deal with from time to time that refer to themselves as being “simple people.” They have no problem understanding the concept of ownership, subscription and rental.

In reference to you Dynamo insulted door knobs .

[Wendell R. Breland]

Snapshot (here) of this site today at 0915 EDT:

Blu-ray Movies - North America (738 Viewing)
Blu-ray Movies - International (532 Viewing)
Blu-ray SteelBooks (142 Viewing)
Digital Movies (61 Viewing)
Ultra HD Blu-ray and 4K Movies (460 Viewing)

I check this from time to time and it is quite clear that by a very wide margin readers are interested in Blu-ray and UHD Blu-ray disc.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Snapshot (here) of this site today at 0915 EDT:

Blu-ray Movies - North America (738 Viewing)
Blu-ray Movies - International (532 Viewing)
Blu-ray SteelBooks (142 Viewing)
Digital Movies (61 Viewing)
Ultra HD Blu-ray and 4K Movies (460 Viewing)

I check this from time to time and it is quite clear that by a very wide margin readers are interested in Blu-ray and UHD Blu-ray disc.

I wouldn't put much stock in that, other than the Steebook forum. The rest are for mainly discussing individual films. For example, The Avengers Engame topic on the UHD forum includes discussion of the digital version.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

I wouldn't put much stock in that, other than the Steebook forum. The rest are for mainly discussing individual films. For example, The Avengers Engame topic on the UHD forum includes discussion of the digital version.

You wouldn’t put much stock in anything that contradicts your digital bias.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

I wouldn't put much stock in that, other than the Steebook forum.

I could care less if you put 0 or 1e15 stock in the data, it is what it is and your views will have zero effect on the numbers.

I assume you mean SteelBook? There are more than twice the number of readers interested in SteelBook BD & UHD BD than streaming. Which is quite to me.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You wouldn’t put much stock in anything that contradicts your digital bias.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

I could care less if you put 0 or 1e15 stock in the data, it is what it is and your views will have zero effect on the numbers.

I assume you mean SteelBook? There are more than twice the number of readers interested in SteelBook BD & UHD BD than streaming. Which is quite to me.

Whatever helps you sleep at night Wendy

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

Search your feelings, you know it to be true.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Search your feelings, you know it to be true.

hi pot, meet kettle


I defend digital. I wouldn't say I'm biased. I continue to use and enjoy both formats

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

hi pot, meet kettle


I defend digital. I wouldn't say I'm biased. I continue to use and enjoy both formats

You wouldn’t say it, but I did!

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You wouldn’t say it, but I did!

Hard to argue that. You are the most level-headed poster here

[flyry]

Originally Posted by cpr3584

My Best Buy still has 4-5 isles of movies. I was there a couple days ago and quite a few people were buying movies . Some of the 4K titles only had 1 copy left , some were sold out .

I've rarely seen more than 3 4k copies of a catalog movie on a shelf at BB so that's not saying much

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Best Buy CinemaNow, Flixster, Paramount Store, Sony Pictures Store, Target Ticket and the studios (UltraViolet) thought the same thing. But, like you, they were wrong. So some are going back to a newer version of pay TV, as in direct SVOD. Disney has already said that they estimate to be profitable by 2024. AFAIK, Warner (at&t) and Universal has not made any predictions.

You and stee routinely confuse or try to compare methods of digital purchase (like iTunes) with subscription streaming services. It's a bad comparison.

Idc if digital purchases are niche i will continue to do so. Getting UHD john wick 3 tomorrow. They won't take away that revenue stream even if most casuals don't want to own anything

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by flyry

You and stee routinely confuse or try to compare methods of digital purchase (like iTunes) with subscription streaming services. It's a bad comparison.

Idc if digital purchases are niche i will continue to do so. Getting UHD john wick 3 tomorrow. They won't take away that revenue stream even if most casuals don't want to own anything

We compare what is hugely popular, Digital HD isn’t, subscription is! If you are buying UHD digital, you are accepting inferior quality. What is the point?