Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by gotmule

I have been kicking this around for about year now, whether to get an Apple TV to start checking out some shows that have not come out on disc yet, and may never. Where I think I have landed is to wait until I retire in a couple of years, as I should in theory have more time to dig into a lot of the shows that are and will be offered. I appreciate this current debate, and like you guys, have a lot of content sitting there never played. My time away from work certainly has competing interests, as I am a sports fan, I am always working my way through a book, I listen to about two hours of music a day, I go to the gym just about every day, and lastly but most importantly, happily married for 26 years.

The other day, I counted 33 albums that have been unwrapped but have never seen my turntable. Currently, there are 9 movies and 2 TV series I have not watched yet that I own on disc.

The other aspect that nudges me towards not streaming a show is that a lot of them sound great on disc, and to stream something in a compromised quality means that I would lessening the experience. I don’t see myself watching a tv series twice with the exception of maybe a Breaking Bad, so to stream something and to say I will buy it afterwards is doesnt make sense. I have close to 200 movies that i enjoyed as a disc rental enough to buy on disc that have never been in my Oppo, so I can’t see adding whole tv shows to that growing list.

I manage about 140 people, and am always hearing about shows that are appealing, so it is tempting...but for now, not joining the streaming world is a way for me to filter out some choices, and to try and balance options competing for my attention and time.

One day however, I can see my wife and I streaming shows not in my home theater, but upstairs in the family room, as I know we would enjoy it.

I have to be certain that I really like a TV show before I will buy it on disc. Collecting multiple seasons of a TV show is both more expensive and requires more time to view making the likelihood of my revisiting most, not all, of them less likely.

Still, I do own a fair number of TV shows (644 seasons on DVD, 454 on blu, 15 on 4K), but TV shows are increasingly difficult to find on disc and if you do find them at all they might be limited to a DVD release and streaming them in HD, or even in 4K, is a higher quality experience overall even with lossy audio. Seeing as many of the TV shows that I watch are destined to be one time viewings, streaming such shows as these makes more sense to me. I have abandoned more than a few series on Netflix alone and I am very happy that these were not purchased shows.

Like with movies, I only buy TV shows on disc even if that means buying DVDs because the actual ownership issue outweighs any benefit that streaming in a higher resolution might offer.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I think calling it a "spoilt experience" is a bit hyperbolic. Streaming doesn't offer the best presentation in most cases, but it's hardly the same as watching a pan & scan VHS tape on an old tube TV, either.

Much of what I stream are titles that I wind up never seeing again, by choice, and that first experience will be the only experience. If it turns out to be something that I love, I will buy it on disc, but that is the exception not the rule. By the time that I watch it again, it will be pretty close to being like watching it for the first time.

The experience I hate is to have spent $20+ on a title and not like it and then never watch it again. Wasting my money annoys me far more than watching a movie in streaming quality ever does. Thankfully, this seldom happens as I am pretty good about only buying titles that I really do like.

It would be ‘spoilt’ in my eyes though, I have a very set way of doing things. Blu-ray and UHD brings out all kinds of details that can appear as a fudged mess streaming wise, especially in dark scenes. Look at the recent outcry with the last episode of GOT? Streaming wise, it was a total mess. Too dark, lacking detail etc.. it was a dream on disc. There is just one example where the streaming experience was spoilt. Especially if you watched every single episode and was hyped for the last show. Thankfully, I was patient and avoided spoilers. The result was a fantastic viewing experience. It’s not unrealistic to say this could apply to a great many films and tv shows.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I think calling it a "spoilt experience" is a bit hyperbolic. Streaming doesn't offer the best presentation in most cases, but it's hardly the same as watching a pan & scan VHS tape on an old tube TV, either.

Much of what I stream are titles that I wind up never seeing again, by choice, and that first experience will be the only experience. If it turns out to be something that I love, I will buy it on disc, but that is the exception not the rule. By the time that I watch it again, it will be pretty close to being like watching it for the first time.

The experience I hate is to have spent $20+ on a title and not like it and then never watch it again. Wasting my money annoys me far more than watching a movie in streaming quality ever does. Thankfully, this seldom happens as I am pretty good about only buying titles that I really do like.

Is it wasting money though? No one complains when they see a naff film at the cinema. They just accept it as one of of those things. A good night out still. Now, the cost of a film on disc is cheaper than the cinema when you can factor in drinks and food. Even if you think the film is just ‘ok’, it’s not a huge amount of money. People happily waste money going to bars, spending £60-£70 for a night they can’t remember. Now THAT is a waste of money. My weekend entertainment cost me just £15 plus takeaway.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

It would be ‘spoilt’ in my eyes though, I have a very set way of doing things. Blu-ray and UHD brings out all kinds of details that can appear as a fudged mess streaming wise, especially in dark scenes. Look at the recent outcry with the last episode of GOT? Streaming wise, it was a total mess. Too dark, lacking detail etc.. it was a dream on disc. There is just one example where the streaming experience was spoilt. Especially if you watched every single episode and was hyped for the last show. Thankfully, I was patient and avoided spoilers. The result was a fantastic viewing experience. It’s not unrealistic to say this could apply to a great many films and tv shows.

Well, Game Of Thrones was a guaranteed purchase from the outset when I first watched the series premiere on HBO via cable TV. I still gotta start my complete series viewing marathon as I stopped in season 3 or 4.

But there are not many shows that rise to the level of a Game Of Thrones and these lesser shows are well suited to be viewed via streaming just like such shows were relegated to watching on cable TV before streaming. A show has to be something special for me to buy it and something that I know that I will want to revisit.

I also need to know that a TV show wasn't cancelled abruptly leaving viewers hanging. I absolutely hate it when a show just suddenly ends without any logic or closure to it and especially so if it is a show that I had been buying in season installments.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Well, Game Of Thrones was a guaranteed purchase from the outset when I first watched the series premiere on HBO via cable TV. I still gotta start my complete series viewing marathon as I stopped in season 3 or 4.

But there are not many shows that rise to the level of a Game Of Thrones and these lesser shows are well suited to be viewed via streaming just like such shows were relegated to watching on cable TV before streaming. A show has to be something special for me to buy it and something that I know that I will want to revisit.

I also need to know that a TV show wasn't cancelled abruptly leaving viewers hanging. I absolutely hate it when a show just suddenly ends without any logic or closure to it and especially so if it is a show that I had been buying in season installments.

You must hold the world record for most purchased but Unwatched discs.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Is it wasting money though? No one complains when they see a naff film at the cinema. They just accept it as one of of those things. A good night out still. Now, the cost of a film on disc is cheaper than the cinema when you can factor in drinks and food. Even if you think the film is just ‘ok’, it’s not a huge amount of money. People happily waste money going to bars, spending £60-£70 for a night they can’t remember. Now THAT is a waste of money. My weekend entertainment cost me just £15 plus takeaway.

Spending money on something that I dislike is wasting money in almost every analysis. Of course I enjoy the evening out with friends, but I would have enjoyed it more if the movie wasn't a stinker.

Before I retired I was much more cavalier about which movies and TV shows I bought, but since retiring I have to be more selective. My retirement income is one-third of what it was and that necessitates making changes.

I have no regrets because what I gained was becoming the absolute master of my time and it was infinitely worth it. Now I have the time to actually watch all of this stuff, to read my books, to listen to my music, to play my games, to do whatever I want whenever I want for as long as I want.

When I was working those 60-80 hour weeks I had plenty of money to spend, but I had no time to enjoy what I was buying. Sacrificing that job income for abundant free time is among the best decisions that I have ever made.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You must hold the world record for most purchased but Unwatched discs.

I have watched more than you think that I have. Never underestimate what you can get done with 365 paid days off a year.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Spending money on something that I dislike is wasting money in almost every analysis. Of course I enjoy the evening out with friends, but I would have enjoyed it more if the movie wasn't a stinker.

Before I retired I was much more cavalier about which movies and TV shows I bought, but since retiring I have to be more selective. My retirement income is one-third of what it was and that necessitates making changes.

I have no regrets because what I gained was becoming the absolute master of my time and it was infinitely worth it. Now I have the time to actually watch all of this stuff, to read my books, to listen to my music, to play my games, to do whatever I want whenever I want for as long as I want.

When I was working those 60-80 hour weeks I had plenty of money to spend, but I had no time to enjoy what I was buying. Sacrificing that job income for abundant free time is among the best decisions that I have ever made.

We know, lucky *******!

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

You must watch a heck of a lot of TV shows if the 1,098 seasons you own are just the special shows that you want to revisit.

As I said, before I retired I was more likely to buy anything and everything, but now I am much more selective about what I buy. A 67% reduction in income kinda mandated that change.

Revisiting a show can mean anything from rewatching the whole series from start to finish to just watching a few select episodes; the latter being more common with sitcoms than with any other genre.

Also, many of the shows that I bought were shows that I had already seen on TV, so playing them even once constituted a revisit.

Lastly, try to imagine what you could have got done over the last 14 years if you had had every single one of those 5113 days to do as you pleased.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

As I said, before I retired I was more likely to buy anything and everything, but now I am much more selective about what I buy. A 67% reduction in income kinda mandated that change.

Revisiting a show can mean anything from rewatching the whole series from start to finish to just watching a few select episodes; the latter being more common with sitcoms than with any other genre.

Also, many of the shows that I bought were shows that I have already seen on TV, so playing them even once constitutes a rewatch.

Lastly, try to imagine what you could have got done over the last 14 years if you had had every single one of those 5113 days off.

Just not being exhausted at the end of the week would do for me.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Just not being exhausted at the end of the week would do for me.

It has been so long since I have had to set my alarm clock that I don't even remember how!

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Which means that you've reduced your support for the type of physical media that needs the most support. Your retirement must be why so many shows have stopped having physical releases in recent years.

I retired in 2006 and physical media was doing just fine then.

As much as I love physical media, I am not returning to the work force. I am much too spoiled to ever work again.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

I'm certainly not saying that you should, I would never advocate that anyone should work harder to make more money if they are happy with what they have.

My point is that you've apparently continued to buy lots of movies at release for full price while neglecting to buy TV shows. TV shows need more support on physical media, movies are doing just fine.

I don't have the money to buy everything at full price either (my job is low pay and low hours and I wouldn't want it any other way) so I choose to focus my spending on the type of physical media that needs the most support.

Just from scanning my Amazon orders for 2019, I bought 12 seasons of TV shows last year just from them. I still buy TV shows, but movies have always taken precedence for me.

I may rebuy Game Of Thrones if it gets the rumored complete series release on 4K. TV shows on 4K is really a rare duck.

I have been debating on whether or not to buy Grimm and The Last Ship complete series on blu-ray; I have only seen a little of each, so I am undecided.

There are other series that I continue to buy as each new season comes out, such as The Walking Dead and its spinoff Fear The Walking Dead, Better Call Saul, Supernatural, The Simpsons, South Park, Family Guy, just to name a few off the cuff. I buy old vintage shows, too, such as The Beverly Hillbillies, Dennis The Menace, Father Knows Best, etc.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I retired in 2006 and physical media was doing just fine then.

As much as I love physical media, I am not returning to the work force. I am much too spoiled to ever work again.

I don’t blame you, I’m very jealous.

[Boccaccio]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

It would be ‘spoilt’ in my eyes though, I have a very set way of doing things. Blu-ray and UHD brings out all kinds of details that can appear as a fudged mess streaming wise, especially in dark scenes. Look at the recent outcry with the last episode of GOT? Streaming wise, it was a total mess. Too dark, lacking detail etc.. it was a dream on disc. There is just one example where the streaming experience was spoilt. Especially if you watched every single episode and was hyped for the last show. Thankfully, I was patient and avoided spoilers. The result was a fantastic viewing experience. It’s not unrealistic to say this could apply to a great many films and tv shows.

I really understand what you mean. I have a subscription with Play more which is a streaming service from our internet provider and the quality is abysmal.
It's some crappy wannabe 720p HD stream and if the movie is well known you get DD 5.1 @ 384 kb/s. If it's not a well known movie you get 192 kb/s.
It's all a compressed mess.If I like the movie and buy it on Blu ray later it's like you say "a totally different experience". Sometimes it even feels like watching a different movie.
Like the windows have been cleaned and earplugs have been removed.
It even goes to the point that if I think I will like the movie I just blind buy it just not to watch it on Play first.
Some people may think I'm crazy but if the videostore around the corner would reopen I would happily go back to renting Blu ray's.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Boccaccio

I really understand what you mean. I have a subscription with Play more which is a streaming service from our internet provider and the quality is abysmal.
It's some crappy wannabe 720p HD stream and if the movie is well known you get DD 5.1 @ 384 kb/s. If it's not a well known movie you get 192 kb/s.
It's all a compressed mess.If I like the movie and buy it on Blu ray later it's like you say "a totally different experience". Sometimes it even feels like watching a different movie.
Like the windows have been cleaned and earplugs have been removed.
It even goes to the point that if I think I will like the movie I just blind buy it just not to watch it on Play first.
Some people may think I'm crazy but if the videostore around the corner would reopen I would happily go back to renting Blu ray's.

Nothing crazy about it, you just appreciate quality.

Meanwhile, apparently Netflix and Apple are in talks to buy MGM. More than ever, it seems like streaming is winning. We are the rearguard, defenders of the crown.

[Boccaccio]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

I'd rather ignore content that I can't own rather then have to pay for a subscription every time I want to watch it or even worse be unable to watch it at all later because it has been removed from all streaming services. I don't want there to ever be any content that I love that I am unable to watch and as long I only watch content on physical media that will never be the case. [Insert streaming exclusive movie or TV show here] may or may not be great, but I'll never know.

I don't want anyone else to ever be unable to access content that they love either. That's why I think it's important that everyone supports physical media: control over availability is in the hands of every single person who owns a physical copy. More support means more titles and more copies of everything, that's great for everyone.

This 100 %. If I can't own the content then I'd rather not watch it.
Because then you fallen into the trap of paying monthly to keep access to it.
I made one exception when I went to see The Irishman in cinemas because I absolutely wanted to see the new Scorsese.
But when I left the theatre I really thought I was never going to see that movie again. It would be an empty space in my collection.
I'm really glad Netflix now has a deal with Criterion and starts releasing movies on disc. They may even earn my respect soon.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

How many TV shows did you watch last year from other sources?

I buy every TV show I'm interested in primarily because I want to support TV shows on physical media. I could easily get most of them for free from my local library but I choose to buy them because I want TV shows to continue to have physical releases for years to come.

It's not something that I keep track of, but as for actual TV viewing with only my antenna, I mostly just watch documentaries on PBS. I often wind up buying them even though many of these documentaries are only available on DVD. Doing so supports both discs and PBS and I'm happy to do it.

I streamed some of Netflix's so called original series and I found most to be mediocre and some were so bad that I baled on them. Netflix abruptly cancels so many of their series after just a couple of seasons, too, making the time investment to watch them even less worthwhile as these shows never get a proper ending.

A couple of their series were good, but not good enough for me to want to own them. I do own the first two seasons of Stranger Things on 4K disc, but I found season 3 to be a bit of a disappointment and even annoying much of the time. I will still buy it when it is offered on disc, but only for continuity's sake.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Boccaccio

This 100 %. If I can't own the content then I'd rather not watch it.
Because then you fallen into the trap of paying monthly to keep access to it.
I made one exception when I went to see The Irishman in cinemas because I absolutely wanted to see the new Scorsese.
But when I left the theatre I really thought I was never going to see that movie again. It would be an empty space in my collection.
I'm really glad Netflix now has a deal with Criterion and starts releasing movies on disc. They may even earn my respect soon.

I am happy to see Netflix release some of their titles on disc, too. Not surprising seeing as they need money so badly; their debt is staggering.

Paying monthly for access to streaming is no different than paying monthly for access to cable TV except that streaming is much cheaper, often in better quality, and it is very easy to change and cancel services. Cancelling cable TV service is meant to be difficult on purpose. Streaming is no more of a trap than is cable TV; it is even less of one when you compare its cost and its ease of changing/cancelling service.

I'm not one to normally bring up the issue of storage space, but if I owned a physical copy of everything that I have ever chosen to watch I would need a warehouse and a forklift. I have no desire to revisit much of this content and owning all of it would be expensive, ridiculous, and result in my being diagnosed as a hoarder combined with the impracticality of storing this massive amount of content.

My goal has been to build a library of titles on physical media that I really like and that I want to revisit, not to be an archivist preserving everything that I have ever seen.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Vilya

It's not something that I keep track of, but as for actual TV viewing with only my antenna, I mostly just watch documentaries on PBS.

You may find the graphic below interesting (story here). As in the past I would assume most get their broadcast TV via cable and satellite.