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Old 02-21-2019, 04:29 PM   #3001
DJR662 DJR662 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interdimensional View Post
Maybe I have a stubborn streak, but my feeling is whatever I have to do to retain the ability to watch 3D, I'll do it. I will not be dictated to.

Of course I'm hoping my current hardware holds out till they bring it back, but who knows when that'll be. In the meantime, I'm not about to be enticed to 'upgrade' by brightness or screensize or 8k or whatever moderate improvements come down the line. I'm not going to ditch 3D at the side of the road no matter what they have to offer. Without 3D, I could only see it as a downgrade.
HDR/WCG can hardly be regarded as "moderate" improvements, especially with the proper gear.

Though not having 3D capability on a TV can indeed be considered a downgrade...
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Old 02-21-2019, 04:35 PM   #3002
Paul H Paul H is offline
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Originally Posted by DJR662 View Post
HDR/WCG can hardly be regarded as "moderate" improvements, especially with the proper gear.

Though not having 3D capability on a TV can indeed be considered a downgrade...
No 3D is a downgrade for me. I can don't miss High dynamic range and wide color gamut.
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Old 02-21-2019, 04:48 PM   #3003
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Originally Posted by Paul H View Post
No 3D is a downgrade for me. I can don't miss High dynamic range and wide color gamut.
Fair enough.

Personally I wouldn't want to do without HDR/WCG for 2D movies, especially older catalogue titles. Watching those in SDR would be like watching a 3D movie in 2D. Something is just missing.

I'm really glad my displays and projector can do it all, wouldn't want it no other way.
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Old 02-22-2019, 07:40 AM   #3004
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. . . Never trust large media companies like Disney who won't release the movie "Song Of The South" and changed "Fantasia" by deleting parts not PC.
Let's not please. The legitimate criticisms of especially SOtS are of a more specific, historical nature that have to do with issues of race and representation. That more specific picture and the problems with it (which should not be dismissed as "PC") can and should be discussed separately from a larger critique of the way Disney manufactures demand by the way they use "the vault." As we look at the implications of Disney+, the company's marketing presents a clear and present danger to those of us who want our packaged media. We can have that conversation without bringing up SOtS, which has not been released for completely different reasons.

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Originally Posted by ZIROK View Post
Well on option is to do what I did My Projector screen rolls up and behind the screen is another 65" TV for casual viewing. Best of both worlds . No need to wheel one out on a table.
Is that screen a custom-installed, in-ceiling motorized design? If it's tensioned, I'd imagine so. And if so, that's part of the "can of worms" . . .

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Old 02-22-2019, 01:47 PM   #3005
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How cool would it be if Disney+ had 3D offerings? I mean Vudu does it and Netflix used to do it. Our streaming devices could handle it. It's just a matter of the app supporting it and Disney loading the movies in the 3D format. How cool would it be to have the ability to select HOW you want to watch the movie? HD, UHD or 3D.
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Old 02-22-2019, 04:50 PM   #3006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul.R.S View Post
Let's not please. The legitimate criticisms of especially SOtS are of a more specific, historical nature that have to do with issues of race and representation. That more specific picture and the problems with it (which should not be dismissed as "PC") can and should be discussed separately from a larger critique of the way Disney manufactures demand by the way they use "the vault." As we look at the implications of Disney+, the company's marketing presents a clear and present danger to those of us who want our packaged media. We can have that conversation without bringing up SOtS, which has not been released for completely different reasons.
It would have been better to ignore Retired Flyer's example if you didn't wish to discuss it. The marginal relevance here is that Disney control these films and have the power to decide what will effectively never be seen again.

I have Song of the South on VHS cassette that I bought in the nineties along with other Disney 'classics', unaware of the controversy. In the context of various vintage cartoons that are considered problematic today, it's definitely on the mild end of the spectrum. The Fantasia centaurs on the other hand, it's a much more grotesque caricature and stands out in that sequence like a sore thumb. I don't know what they were thinking. I'm hesitant to embrace historic censorship, but I can understand Disney leaving that out, it hurts an otherwise exceptional film.

There were various points in the relatively recent past where Disney considered releasing SOTS with a Whoopi Goldberg introduction to put things in perspective, but that never happened. They should've just put it out, with the appropriate disclaimers and not marketed to children. Interest in the film at this point is increasingly from an historic perspective rather than purely as entertainment. I imagine they are risk averse and overestimate the potential negative reaction. By keeping it locked in the vault they create a distorted perception of the potency of the content. I think if it was out there, the vast majority would accept it for what it is, if they even noticed at all, but it does more damage to the company when they create this image of it as a dangerous film that the Disney company is too ashamed of to allow anyone to watch it.

Disney now own the 20th Century Fox library, so I would hope they will not apply the same standard in terms of what they consider safe to release. The problem is the that they are now so massive, so involved in so many other lucrative areas that they pay very little attention to this stuff and can afford to ignore the modest profits that are available to them when it comes to things like deep catalog titles and 3D bluray releases.
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Old 02-22-2019, 06:21 PM   #3007
Retired Flyer Retired Flyer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interdimensional View Post
It would have been better to ignore Retired Flyer's example if you didn't wish to discuss it. The marginal relevance here is that Disney control these films and have the power to decide what will effectively never be seen again.

I have Song of the South on VHS cassette that I bought in the nineties along with other Disney 'classics', unaware of the controversy. In the context of various vintage cartoons that are considered problematic today, it's definitely on the mild end of the spectrum. The Fantasia centaurs on the other hand, it's a much more grotesque caricature and stands out in that sequence like a sore thumb. I don't know what they were thinking. I'm hesitant to embrace historic censorship, but I can understand Disney leaving that out, it hurts an otherwise exceptional film.

There were various points in the relatively recent past where Disney considered releasing SOTS with a Whoopi Goldberg introduction to put things in perspective, but that never happened. They should've just put it out, with the appropriate disclaimers and not marketed to children. Interest in the film at this point is increasingly from an historic perspective rather than purely as entertainment. I imagine they are risk averse and overestimate the potential negative reaction. By keeping it locked in the vault they create a distorted perception of the potency of the content. I think if it was out there, the vast majority would accept it for what it is, if they even noticed at all, but it does more damage to the company when they create this image of it as a dangerous film that the Disney company is too ashamed of to allow anyone to watch it.

Disney now own the 20th Century Fox library, so I would hope they will not apply the same standard in terms of what they consider safe to release. The problem is the that they are now so massive, so involved in so many other lucrative areas that they pay very little attention to this stuff and can afford to ignore the modest profits that are available to them when it comes to things like deep catalog titles and 3D bluray releases.

The ever changing "PC" culture is scary if you are a student of history. We can learn about civilization's mistakes and successes without the the PC police making the judgements for us.
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Old 02-22-2019, 09:22 PM   #3008
Paul.R.S Paul.R.S is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interdimensional View Post
It would have been better to ignore Retired Flyer's example if you didn't wish to discuss it.
"[B]etter" for whom?

That conflation/tension (along with some other opinions you mention as though they are facts, such as purporting to speak for everyone regarding whether the picture is seen as "entertainment" versus a history lesson) is a good example of why this OFF TOPIC subject should be avoided.

One could just as easily argue that it would be "better" to not mention the film--which by your own statement has "marginal" relevance to Disney "vault" issues--(along with alleged "PC police") at all as direct someone regarding what they should and should not "ignore" (which ironically could be viewed as a form of "policing").

Last edited by Paul.R.S; 02-22-2019 at 09:40 PM.
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Old 02-22-2019, 09:30 PM   #3009
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[Delete dupe--tech diff.]

Last edited by Paul.R.S; 02-22-2019 at 09:40 PM.
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Old 02-23-2019, 02:09 AM   #3010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul.R.S View Post
"[B]etter" for whom?

One could just as easily argue that it would be "better" to not mention the film--which by your own statement has "marginal" relevance to Disney "vault" issues--(along with alleged "PC police") at all as direct someone regarding what they should and should not "ignore" (which ironically could be viewed as a form of "policing").
- when someone makes an aside in the midst of several other relevant points, why single out and castigate them on that one tangential point while ignoring everything that was on topic in Retired Flyer's post?

If you prefer not to got there("Let's not please."), then don't go there. No one else was!



Quote:
Originally Posted by Retired Flyer View Post
The ever changing "PC" culture is scary if you are a student of history. We can learn about civilization's mistakes and successes without the the PC police making the judgements for us.
There's so many films I've been lucky to see, and more that I would like to see, that just don't hold up to modern standards or fall foul for one reason or another. A lot of the time it's not that I necessarily disagree with the socalled 'PC' assessment about the rights and wrongs of what is depicted. I just don't want people deciding for me that I shouldn't have the chance to see for myself.

My whole thing is I want things to remain available, whether that be films of questionable virtue, or 3D cinema. The threatened demise of physical media may put that in jeopardy, but I like to think that somehow things will work out in the end. We'll see how that goes.
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Old 02-26-2019, 06:37 AM   #3011
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Hey all,

According to this, it's possible we're all going to be in the same boat. If it is any consolation, I don't buy into it.

https://www.zdnet.com/google-amp/art...nd-of-blu-ray/
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Old 02-26-2019, 01:45 PM   #3012
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Originally Posted by Joe D. View Post
Hey all,

According to this, it's possible we're all going to be in the same boat. If it is any consolation, I don't buy into it.

https://www.zdnet.com/google-amp/art...nd-of-blu-ray/
I don't buy into streaming. I've tried it, buying two 3D movies never released on Blur-ray 3D. That was it.

Updated:
50530-bf90afba20ecb5889c233239590847e2.jpg
A couple of Disney CGI 3D titles that were never released on Blu-ray 3D.*
"The Pirate Fairy 3D" (2010), and "Tinkerbell and the Legend of the NeverBeast 3D". Both in 3D & 1080P quality resolution.

Last edited by Paul H; 02-26-2019 at 04:00 PM.
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Old 02-26-2019, 03:49 PM   #3013
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Originally Posted by Joe D. View Post
Hey all,

According to this, it's possible we're all going to be in the same boat. If it is any consolation, I don't buy into it.

https://www.zdnet.com/google-amp/art...nd-of-blu-ray/
I hate how they read into this as Bluray is dead. When all Samsung said was they are not introducing and "New" models .which is ok. The present players work fine and there are not many more options they could add to them without adding silly options no one will use.
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Old 02-28-2019, 12:56 AM   #3014
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Glasses-free 3D Displays at CES

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We met with four companies at CES: Vision Engineering, Creal 3D, Dimenco and StreamTV.
https://displaydaily.com/article/dis...isplays-at-ces
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Old 02-28-2019, 04:12 AM   #3015
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Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart View Post
Really great to see they're still actively doing this behind the scenes. I hope this pushes through and will only become better once 8K TVs are the "next big thing". Actually I'm hoping by that time, glasses free 3D will become the norm and our 3D Blu-rays will also still be compatible.
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Old 03-03-2019, 08:29 PM   #3016
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If you bought a new Sony XBR TV in 2009, the last year before 3D came out, you would be crazy to throw out an XBR just to get a 3D Version. By 2012I saved up enough money and dd what a lot of 3D fans did, bought a PLaystation 3D Display. It started as the cheapest 3D TV (technically not a TV because thereís no tuner, but that would assume 3D antenna content was available.) if you did a search for indivdivual 3D models, the Playstaiton 3D TV is the number one 3D model of TV of all time. Why because for people who didnít want to throw out a big screen, this was the best way to get a 3D fix.

But 3D turned south as soon as the 3D Super Bowl was cancelled. Then 3D became a 4-letter word. I can think of no other turning point other than that.

Then the TV companies reacted in exactly the wrong way. Make Bigger and Higher def TVs with 3D and not include them in their basic models.

The proer response would be twofold: 1) the reason the SUper Bowl iasco happened was because they made a "technically but not aesthetically 2D-compatible 3D standard." Side by side half. Put yourself in the average personís shoes. If you didnít want to buy a $1500 TV, youíd have two half-width double images. If you didnít know about this format and werenít eagerly seeking 3D, youíd complain to the TV station. The Super Bowl disaster could have been averted by being smarter with a 3D TV format. 1) broadcast it in 120 Hz, 2) make an old tuner think itís 60 Hz x 1 eye just showing left frames while new tuners see it as 60 Hz x 2 eyes. and 3) making the right eye hidden, ie encoded in the picture, until a decoder can decode it. Dolby 5.1 does that on ATSC TV. CLosed Captions do that on ATSC and even NTSC TV. Stereo TV is mono compatible. Even the first successful color TV was B/W compatible, and a previous Color format failed because it was B/W incompatible.

I do believe all 3D TVs have a 120 Hz mode. But if you have a 60 Hz TV, you can get a 30 HZ x 2 eye signal, and NTSC was 30 Hz, so no loss vs analog.

The other thing that the TV Manufacturers SHOULD HAVE DONE, was find a way to retroactively turn old TVs into Old 3D TVs, sort of like the same way you add surround sound to a TV. You donít notice it if itís not there, but if itís there, you notice it and never go back.

Luckily I know a technology tat is in public domain which turns orfdinary then-cntemporary TVs into 3D TVs, at least for their limited applications. Iím talking about the Sega Scope 3D for the Sega Master System. Granted it only worked with their own (good luck getting third parties with Nintendoís NES dominating) 3D content, but Sega thought ahead an either made separate 2D and 3D versions (Space Harrier), or later, pressing pause at the title screen changes it from 3D to 2D and back. (Zaxxon).

The best thing is, you didnít have to go out and buy a special 3D TV just to play 3D games. It works with whatever TV you have. 10 inches or 25 inches; RF input, composite input, or RGB/Scart input; any brand. Even though it was relying on most people having a CRT, I would like to know of the Sega Scope worked on other types of TVs (what other types were there than CRT back then? Front Projection, Rear Projection)

Was the Master system in Public Domain when 3D Tvs came out? I know by 2015, the Sega Scope technology was in public domain, so now you can buy as big or small screen as you want, any refresh rate, any color depth, any pixel definition, any display tech type, any low ping time vs display processing balance, any brand, and just add 3D to your current set up.

Also asking people to pay $5 extra for 3D is like asking people to pay extra for Dolby Atmos today. If they didnít a) segregate 3D as a separate copy b) either force a combo 4K/3D or force 2 separate purchases for 4K and 3D, and c) just made the 2D copy just the left eye of the 3D presentation, instead of a separate "2D purist version" and put them on the same disc, and 4) advertised them as 2D/3D combo discs, and (even better) 4K2D/4K3D combo discs that would be perfect. Iíd rather spend 5 seconds telling the machine whether I want the 2D or 3D version if that means 3D is a hidden feature in every disc that has a 3D version, just like Dolby/DTS Surround, and every movie that originally had a 3D version will be able to have the 3D version at home. No one advertises Color or Dobly 5.1 as a special feature. Heck even some colorized movies have a "luma only setting" letting you watch the movie in Black and White. A set of Shirley Temple DVDs (not even Blu Rays) I saw on a TV commercial advertised that as a feature. If 3D were a sm all-print feature instead of a big-print one, maybe by stealth it can be snuck in there. Plus youíll have 4K3D versions without making a separate 4K2D disc

(By the way. I donít like DTS being stuffed down my throat. I have a complaint about DTS, itís that my Turtle Beaches canít decode DTS surround into Dolby Headphone, and the Sony Headphone Surround solution, which does both Dolby and DTS, [but not LPCM 7.1. Sorry, Wii U, and Switch, and Apocalypto] sucks by not accurately conveying direction like my Turtle Beaches on Dolby-native movies.)

I donít blame the non-hardcore nut who doensít want to pay $3000 for a 3D TV when the only 3D TVs were in its last days on ultra premium TVs. There was no variety, and no cheap option.

Turtle Beach headphones is both a cheap manís option into surround sound, as well as a more accurate way of getting surround sound to an audience of 4 or less, without having the "king spot" problem.

There needs to be a 3D external adapter. Iím trying to call Sonyís business office, mainly because they are the only company in both TV mechanism business (NBC/Universal doesnít make TV Displays) as well as content business (LG doesnít make movies or TV Shows) but unfortunately I cannot proceed until I get the name of an executive I can call or email.

By the way, Shutter 3D is the future for "Johnny Lunchpail" 3D, because itís a lot easier to buy a $100 device to sync glasses with a screen than it is to add a polarized screen to any existing TV. Anyone who knows how to hook up a video game system can probably do the first. The second is very labor intensive. And polarizing a non-polar TV requires a specific part for your specific TV, where shutter can be added universally. Polar would be seen as elite, and simultaneously, shunned by those same elites.
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Old 03-04-2019, 12:09 AM   #3017
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Hi triple,

Before I had a 3D set, the Yankees broadcast three games in 3d side by side. Cablevision simply aired it on a second channel.

You're right about the xbr series. In 2005 I purchased the kd34xbr960, a 34 inch high def CRT. Loved it, all 230 pounds! One of the top rated HD sets of it's time. That is why I didn't get into 3D until 2015. The set suddenly came down with the dreaded red blinking and wouldn't turn on. But it was a blessing in disguise for obvious reasons.

If you see my signature, you'll notice I also converted my den flat system into 3D with the 3D video wizard. Though it is anaglyph, it does a nice job considering it is an add on device. There is good depth and quality reproduction though not the level of an actual monitor. Call it entry level. The point, as you make, more of these type gadgets could have been made for those like me who wanted 3D but we're not going to junk a perfect working HD monitor to get it. Not being too expensive, one could have enjoyed 3D and when the need came, get a set with the 3D feature with a more dynamic immersive effect.
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Old 03-04-2019, 07:07 AM   #3018
pieholecram2 pieholecram2 is offline
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Yes 3d is dead in America but I have an 82 inch 2012 Mitsubishi 3d tv and I buy my 3d movies at Amazon UK. They have many many region free 3d movies and they usually cost less than in the states. It does take 2 to 3 weeks to get them though so be patient lol
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Old 03-05-2019, 07:50 AM   #3019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tripletopper View Post
If you bought a new Sony XBR TV in 2009, the last year before 3D came out, you would be crazy to throw out an XBR just to get a 3D Version.
And that's exactly what I did.

I had bought a Sony 52" LCD in September of 2009 (don't remember the model) but as soon as the 2010 lineup of Sony's first gen 3D TVs was announced, I knew I just had to get one!

Prior to that I had watched The Final Destination 3D in cinemas, my first theatrical 3D movie (went to see it twice actually ), and I was immediately hooked on 3D. In the spring of 2010 I managed to get an invite to Sony HQ in my country. They had organized promotional 3D weekends during which consumers could come and check/try out all the new Sony 3D TVs before they were officially available in stores. I still have my keycord from that day:



I was immediately sold on the format. So before I could even sell my 2009 2D set, I had already ordered a 55NX810 as soon as preorders went live.

Subsequentally I wanted a bigger 3D TV the year after, so I got myself the Sony 65HX920 (HX929 in the US) and moved the NX810 to the bedroom (3D everywhere in our household ). Also bought enough 3D glasses to make sure family and friends could join in on the fun. And besides that I also spent a small fortune on those damn 3D Blu-ray brand exclusives that were going for outrageous prices on eBay at the time (I don't even want to think back on how much I paid for Megamind 3D when it was a Samsung exclusive only).

But it was worth it, those first years of 3D were really fun! 3D was big and being hyped back then, shame in the end it all went down like it did... It deserved much better. Therefore I'm enjoying my current setup to the fullest while in the meantime hoping for new 3D tech to appear sometime. In a perfect world, for me that would mean 8K glasses free 3D MicroLED...
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Old 03-05-2019, 04:58 PM   #3020
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Hi guys,

I refuse to go down without a fight. Alita might be on our side too.

How about home theater 3D being in a dormant stage right now? For when the industry needs a new feature to hype it's continued slagging sales, who knows? 3D could rise up like a phoenix once more. They always need a new sales pitch. Curved monitors didn't do it. And most everyone has multiple sources for apps.
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