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Old 11-25-2012, 03:06 PM   #701
Villiam Hayes Villiam Hayes is offline
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Go on Alonso!
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:13 PM   #702
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Go on Alonso!
Crazy start. Vettel can still get it done.
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:22 PM   #703
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Crazy start. Vettel can still get it done.
Yeah I think he will...unfortunately.
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Old 11-25-2012, 05:36 PM   #704
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Another sloppy race but at least this time weather was a big factor in that and not just brutal driving. Don't know what Vettel was thinking trying to play it so safe off the start. Was asking for the inevitable contact and had a horseshoe up his ass to drive away from that one and not have the damage hurt him too much. Awful tyre call causing the extra pit stop too which was brutally slow with him obviously trying to call it in with the radio issues.

Good race by Alonso and Massa blocking well for him but the championship is where it belongs.

And now onto the late reply....

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Originally Posted by Trace17 View Post
Not a ridiculous penalty. Same happened to Hamilton earlier this year as well. RBR are fully aware of the fuel limits- they choose to cut it close or made a mistake. Their own fault.
It was a stupid penalty then too and I can't stand Hamilton. Do you really think running out of fuel should be a stricter penalty than causing a crash driving like an idiot tends to get in non-repeat offender scenarios? Last time I checked it was always possible that causing a crash could lead to a death in an unfortunate scenario. What exactly does running out of fuel do again? With the fuel difference between a car running out of fuel and the slight bit they have when they don't run out we are not talking enough of a weight difference to make an impact on lap times. And if they want to make sure the fuel is clean they can test it when the cars are fueled. Never said RBR were not to blame but like 99% of your post you were putting words in my mouth. But RBR being to blame doesn't change that it is an absurd penalty no matter who it happens to.

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An F1 race can be exciting without being a complete crapshoot. There IS a middle ground between "anybody can win" Nascar and "I'd rather be comatose" F1 processionals, which I can't fathom how anyone enjoys those. Petrov was never going to win today's race. The only people really capable of winning the race today were LH, Alonso, Ice, Button and Seb (with maybe Mal being an outside shot). And honestly, almost every weekend, those are the drivers capable of winning. Today wasn't some ridiculous luck-filled chaos race with a podium of Perez-Petrov-Glock. It was just unpredictable and entertaining, and the best drivers still finished at the top. What you describe as "nascar-like" and "skill-less" would really only apply if HRT was in the points and Vergne won the race.
Who said anything about comparing it to NASCAR positioning? The comparison was to how sloppy NASCAR races are. And yeah top names finished at the top but guess what? They do in the majority of NASCAR races too. And the amateur driving that was on display that race had an impact on the top names too like Vettel suffering damage he had to pit for putting him to the back of the pack a second time. And Webber ending up with a very rare DNF.

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I find it funny that you think it has to be pole-flag, no overtaking, just everyone racing in line behind each other. Or at least you portray that. It doesn't have to be complete chaos like Nascar might sometimes be, but F1 can be entertaining and unpredictable. It's boring as shit to watch a race when you already know the winner before it even starts, like the last three weeks went.
Again putting words in my mouth. Never said races have to be pole to flag. I am more than happy with a close race if it is a well driven clean race. But if it is pole to flag like it tends to be then that is a lot better than a close race caused by the worst driving of the season from a good majority of the field in clear conditions.
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Old 11-25-2012, 06:56 PM   #705
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All hail Vettel

Two great recoveries in the last three races to clinch the championship is very impressive.
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Old 11-25-2012, 09:31 PM   #706
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Good race today but I wont say "Hail To Vettel". But I will congradulate him for another championship....but next season there wont be a fourth. I do want to say that Fernando and Ferrari have nothing to feel bad about because they gave it everything they had and if anything this is going to drive Alonso even more next year to win the championship, and he will! Sad to see the end of an era with Schumi saying goodbye to the sport he made famous and I am going to miss him. Its to bad his career had to end on such a shitty note and I feel that MerCades and Ross Brawn should be ashamed of themselves for giving him no chance in crappy cars, Michael deserved better but he had an awsome career and nothing to feel bad about. I will always remember Michael the Ferrari years where he was most dominant. So long champ. That all being said it was a great year for F1 and I look forward to next year where hopefully it will be just as exciting with someone other then Vettel winning the championship.
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:05 PM   #707
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Even if Vettel wins 4 in a row I'll be happy if it comes down to the wire like it did yesterday in that incredibly exciting Brazilian Grand Prix. Whew!! I was rewinding right from turn 1 as I thought the Force India was just a hair away from spinning one of the RB's right on the start/finish line. Great action throughout.

I'm not particularly keen on Vettel's post-race comments about liars and that being honest is the best way to win, not sure if he's choosing the wrong words or is just having moments of paranoia. However I did really enjoy what he said about Schumi in the days leading up to the final race, definitely good to see him paying massive kudos to the F1 legend. I too am very sad to see Schumi go, would have loved to see him get into a competitive car for one more year, obviously looking back now I think stepping into the Ferrari in 2010 would have been the correct move. Saying that it does appear that Massa FINALLY has his pre-accident form back and I expect big things from him next year a la 2008 when he challenged Lewis for the title right down to Interlagos' final lap. We sure have seem some great season finales from Interlagos that's for sure.

Kimi's wandering off down the slip road was pretty hilarious, wonder if we'll get a radio transmission of that one on the Blu-ray, definitely won't be "I know what I'm doing!"

Alonso was very gracious in defeat. I've come to take a much bigger shining to Alonso than I did in 2005/2006 when he seemed like more of a cocky know-in-all, and in 2007 racing alongside Lewis where he seemed to be quite dramatic about being hard done by. He's definitely found his team in Ferrari and I'm sure he will be a title contender throughout the remainder of his career. Not sure if that can be said for Lewis moving to Mercedes. They weren't any more competitive in 2012 than they were in 2010 and that's pish poor development for a team with a 7-time World Champion. Wonder what the final standings this year would have been if Grosjean had never gotten behind the wheel of a car, lol.

I'm very much looking forward to another stellar Blu-ray from F1. Hopefully this time they release the UK version region free, or at least we'll see a REGION A release. 2011 was the first season in years that there wasn't even a DVD release for North America. I also hope they correctly put dts-HD Master Audio on it, as the 2011 was labelled as containing dts-ma but only had lossy Dolby Digital on it.

Congratulations to Vettel on being the youngest 3-time F1 WC ever, and with three titles in a row that's some pretty magical company he's in with Fangio and Schumacher.

Roll on March 2013!!
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Old 11-26-2012, 08:03 PM   #708
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Originally Posted by dobyblue View Post
Kimi's wandering off down the slip road was pretty hilarious, wonder if we'll get a radio transmission of that one on the Blu-ray, definitely won't be "I know what I'm doing!"

Alonso was very gracious in defeat. Wonder what the final standings this year would have been if Grosjean had never gotten behind the wheel of a car, lol.

I'm very much looking forward to another stellar Blu-ray from F1. Hopefully this time they release the UK version region free, or at least we'll see a REGION A release. 2011 was the first season in years that there wasn't even a DVD release for North America. I also hope they correctly put dts-HD Master Audio on it, as the 2011 was labelled as containing dts-ma but only had lossy Dolby Digital
The Kimi thing was one of the funniest things I've seen in any sport in awhile, especially since it's Kimi.

I also thought Alsono took defeat very well, and much respect to him. I was also wondering if he was one Grosjean away from being champion haha

I wouldn't count on an NA BD release, simply because I want it and therefore it won't happen heh

Also going to throw this out there - stewards gave hulkenberg a penalty for essentially a loss of traction in the wet, but did not penalize Seb for clearly cutting into Senna (who had the line). To be brutally honest, I don't think either is worth penalty, but if you penalize one you have to penalize the other. And as far as I know, every other incident this year that involved a car forced to retire (Senna in this case) was, at the very least, investigated. But this one wasn't. Interesting...
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Old 11-28-2012, 11:19 PM   #709
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[Show spoiler]The Kimi thing was one of the funniest things I've seen in any sport in awhile, especially since it's Kimi.

I also thought Alsono took defeat very well, and much respect to him. I was also wondering if he was one Grosjean away from being champion haha

I wouldn't count on an NA BD release, simply because I want it and therefore it won't happen heh

Also going to throw this out there - stewards gave hulkenberg a penalty for essentially a loss of traction in the wet, but did not penalize Seb for clearly cutting into Senna (who had the line). To be brutally honest, I don't think either is worth penalty, but if you penalize one you have to penalize the other. And as far as I know, every other incident this year that involved a car forced to retire (Senna in this case) was, at the very least, investigated. But this one wasn't. Interesting...
Unless the infraction committed by Vettel was of an egregious nature, there was no way that the stewards were going to penalize him, not with so much riding in the final race. I can hear shouts of Ferrari favouritism resonating from Dietrich Mateschitz and all of Austria if Seb was penalized for this, whether or not it was justifiable in the stewards' eyes.

For a scant, fleeting moment, I felt bad for Alonso at the end of the race (I may not like him, but I do respect his skill and perseverance), but in the end, I believed that the best driver and team secured the championships (drivers and constructors). I would have liked to see Hamilton finish the season's final race, but it wasn't meant to be; I'm not sure if Perez is the right successor, but it will be one of many storylines I'll be following next season.
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:21 PM   #710
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Vettel will retain title as FIA say Red Bull star has 'no case' to answer over 'illegal' overtake

Sebastian Vettel's fears over potentially losing his third Formula One world title to an on-track infringement have been dismissed by the FIA.

Four days after an enthralling title fight concluded with Sunday's dramatic Brazilian Grand Prix, motor sport's governing body have confirmed Vettel is in the clear over a disputed overtake.

The FIA will now confirm their findings to Ferrari, who had written a letter seeking clarification of Vettel's lap-four pass at Interlagos on Jean-Eric Vergne's Toro Rosso.

Vettel made history on Sunday when he became the youngest three-time champion at the age of just 25, beating Ferrari's Fernando Alonso to the title by three points.

However, there lurked the prospect of the FIA being forced to review an incident which, if Vettel had been found guilty, could have led to a retrospective 20-second drive-through penalty being applied to his elapsed race time.

The consequence of which would have demoted Vettel from sixth to eighth on the race classification, and with it losing his third consecutive title by a point to Alonso.

The FIA, however, has confirmed that there is 'no case to answer', ensuring a swift conclusion to a potentially unsavoury end to the season.

The case in point had centred on footage from Vettel's car which appeared to suggest an illegal move on Vergne in a yellow-flag zone in which no overtaking is allowed.

At the time, Vettel was attempting to battle his way back through the field after a first-lap incident with Williams' Bruno Senna which had spun him around and relegated him to the rear of the pack.

Come the start of lap four, and with yellow flags in place following an accident involving the second Williams of Pastor Maldonado, video shows Vettel passing Vergne on the straight between turns three and four.

In Vettel's case a yellow light was flashing at turn two and again at turn three, while at the same time lights and the word 'flag' appear on the cockpit system of his Red Bull.

The images are not helped due to the grainy footage and with water on the lens from drizzle over Interlagos.

What can only be made out via enhancement is that 200 metres into the straight Vettel passes a marshal's post where a green flag was being waved, allowing him to make a move on Vergne.

Vettel completes it prior to passing another marshal's post at the end of the straight displaying a green light, at which time the indicators in his cockpit also disappear.

Under FIA regulations as flags take precedence over lights, which are a supplementary aid, Vettel is in the clear. Race director Charlie Whiting has since confirmed the findings, saying: 'If the lights are not installed at a flag post, the driver responds to the first signal that is shown.

'In Vettel's case, between the last yellow light and the green light there was a green flag being waved.

'The distance is 350 metres here. Vettel responded to the flag and did everything right.'
What a sad desperate attempt by Ferrari to get Alonso the title. But FIA shot it down in a hurry like it should have been so good on them.

Even if they would have had a case it would have been pathetic. Had Vettel done an illegal pass and were penalized at the time he would have pushed harder and made it a moot point. So trying to weasel a world championship away from somebody after the fact knowing they can't race off the penalty is pathetic.

I hope this pisses off Vettel and erases all the Vettel to Ferrari rumors because I never want to see him race for them
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:45 PM   #711
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Originally Posted by Hayabusa85 View Post
What a sad desperate attempt by Ferrari to get Alonso the title. But FIA shot it down in a hurry like it should have been so good on them.

Even if they would have had a case it would have been pathetic. Had Vettel done an illegal pass and were penalized at the time he would have pushed harder and made it a moot point. So trying to weasel a world championship away from somebody after the fact knowing they can't race off the penalty is pathetic.

I hope this pisses off Vettel and erases all the Vettel to Ferrari rumors because I never want to see him race for them
I'm sure Ferrari thought they were doing right by Alonso if they petitioned this case to the FIA (whether or not it was done on behalf of Alonso), but if Alonso is a man of integrity (as some of his supporters claim), he would never accept the title under such circumstances (if I was in his shoes, I know I wouldn't). This latest attempt by Ferrari is one of the reasons why I could never support their F1 endeavour; everything about this feels so weaselly and tactless, and just screams of desperation.
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Old 11-30-2012, 03:17 AM   #712
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Eh, I don't really take anything from it. They were likely doing it to appease the Italian press, not Alonso, who seemed much more at peace with himself this time compared to 2010.
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Old 12-01-2012, 05:44 PM   #713
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Well, 2012 season is over so...let the 13 talk begin!

Looks like only 22 cars on the grid next year as reports come out that HRT failed to find a buyer and the FIA list only has 22.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/104673
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:18 AM   #714
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Will we see Kubica back in 2013?
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Old 12-02-2012, 05:09 AM   #715
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*Prepares for NBC rage from the US posters*

Wonder what Perez will show up since he has was awful after McLaren signed him not even picking up a single point. Failed to point in 13 races total. Compare that to somebody like Hulk who finished 3 points behind him overall who had 32 points in that time and only 9 races out of the points total. Or even Kobayashi who might be forced into retirement with 25 points over that timeframe and 11 races out of the points total. Did McLaren jump the gun on this one? Even when you look at his podiums other than Montreal they were races where drivers like Vettel, Button and Webber either had bad races or didn't even finish. But still he did show promise in the first half of the season. But really came across as nothing but a driver that drives for a contract and then doesn't care to close things out.

Also wonder who will finish second behind Vettel as he wins his fourth season in a row
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Old 12-02-2012, 02:34 PM   #716
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Originally Posted by Hayabusa85 View Post
*Prepares for NBC rage from the US posters*

Wonder what Perez will show up since he has was awful after McLaren signed him not even picking up a single point. Failed to point in 13 races total. Compare that to somebody like Hulk who finished 3 points behind him overall who had 32 points in that time and only 9 races out of the points total. Or even Kobayashi who might be forced into retirement with 25 points over that timeframe and 11 races out of the points total. Did McLaren jump the gun on this one? Even when you look at his podiums other than Montreal they were races where drivers like Vettel, Button and Webber either had bad races or didn't even finish. But still he did show promise in the first half of the season. But really came across as nothing but a driver that drives for a contract and then doesn't care to close things out.
Kimi Raikkonen. An up and down rookie campaign with Sauber was enough to get promoted to Mclaren where he struggled in his first year there. We all know what happened after that.

Perez has talent. I think he just needs to handle the pressure better and he should be fine.

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Also wonder who will finish second behind Vettel as he wins his fourth season in a row
Kimi again!
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:55 PM   #717
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Will we see Kubica back in 2013?
I'm sure Kubica's exploring all of his options. While I would like to see him return to F1, he has shown a great deal of potential on the WRC circuit with Citroën (finding a partner for next season, as well as sponsorship, will need to be addressed though).
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Old 12-02-2012, 04:10 PM   #718
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Throwing Kubica around for a seat in 2013 is pointless. I don't think he'll ever race again at the F1 level, and if he gets a test drive/pirelli drive they'll see. His surgeon has said his wrist will never be fully back to pre-crash condition. There's a lot of young piranhas trying to get in too. And, as of now, there could even be two less race seats to fight for. Odd were and are not in his favor.
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Old 12-03-2012, 01:15 PM   #719
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Throwing Kubica around for a seat in 2013 is pointless. I don't think he'll ever race again at the F1 level, and if he gets a test drive/pirelli drive they'll see. His surgeon has said his wrist will never be fully back to pre-crash condition. There's a lot of young piranhas trying to get in too. And, as of now, there could even be two less race seats to fight for. Odd were and are not in his favor.
As severe as the injury was to Kubica's forearm, this in itself is not a deterrent to at least one constructor (Sahara Force India) who covets an experienced driver in their lineup. Depending on his recovery pace, I do believe that, at the very least, one or two of the smaller constructors are willing to extend a test seat to Kubica in 2013, if for no other reason than to evaluate his probability for a return. There will always be emerging GP2 drivers chomping at the bit for a possible open seat, but as is the case with most employers, they would rather have experience over potential. It doesn't matter how much promise di Resta or Hülkenberg showed this past season; if the team thinks that Kubica is primed for a return (in spite of his injury), I don't think they would bat an eyelash at the prospect of releasing one of their young drivers to pave the way for Kubica.
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Old 01-02-2013, 08:33 PM   #720
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Cover art released for the season review.
I originally thought we got shafted period in NA for the 2011 review but I found it did actually get released on DVD, just no Blu-ray. For 13 pounds I'm ordering the UK Blu-ray again, comes out next week, hopefully this time I don't have to deal with region B locked discs and hopefully this time if they say dts-ma it will actually have it.
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