Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[stonesfan129]

Originally Posted by Zu Nim

If VUDU's 9Mbps HDX was as good as Blu-ray, Blu-rays would all have 9Mbps bitstreams on them. But they don't because it's not equivalent. For many consumers streaming is similar enough (me included) but pretending it's the same is nonsense. Whether I have 1Gbps, 100Mbps, or 10Mbps service, HDX will generally still look worse than a higher-bitrate Blu-ray.

In the years to come providers can up that bitrate. (Probably not HDX, which is already nearly twice the bitrate of other providers for 1080p content.) They could even match or exceed disc specifications eventually. But that's a hypothetical. The future of fiber connectivity is certainly bright. But saying that HDX = Blu-ray today is not credible. As for the immediate future, VUDU UHD has a bitrate of 15Mbps which is also much lower than its disc version.

+1

It all totally depends on how the stream is encoded. Blu-rays I thought had a bitrate anywhere from 20-30 Mbps most times. And I've seen recoded versions done with x264 around the same bitrate (9 Mbps) that still turn out looking better than many of these streams and download versions.

Originally Posted by tele1962

I give up.

Like music, would it not totally depend on how it was mastered? I've heard CDs that claim to be mastered from the original recording tape but sounds like crud because they don't master it to sound good. Wouldn't that be the same with movies? Just my $0.02.

[Lowenbotten]

Originally Posted by Zu Nim

If VUDU's 9Mbps HDX was as good as Blu-ray, Blu-rays would all have 9Mbps bitstreams on them. But they don't because it's not equivalent. For many consumers streaming is similar enough (me included) but pretending it's the same is nonsense. Whether I have 1Gbps, 100Mbps, or 10Mbps service, HDX will generally still look worse than a higher-bitrate Blu-ray.

In the years to come providers can up that bitrate. (Probably not HDX, which is already nearly twice the bitrate of other providers for 1080p content.) They could even match or exceed disc specifications eventually. But that's a hypothetical. The future of fiber connectivity is certainly bright. But saying that HDX = Blu-ray today is not credible. As for the immediate future, VUDU UHD has a bitrate of 15Mbps which is also much lower than its disc version.

But alchav21 has fiber to the home! That magically transforms the video source to the same as Blu-ray!

[master gandhi]

Originally Posted by Lowenbotten

But alchav21 has fiber to the home! That magically transforms the video source to the same as Blu-ray!

Yeah, and he has direct trunking to the VUDU servers, whatever the f that means.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Lowenbotten

But alchav21 has fiber to the home! That magically transforms the video source to the same as Blu-ray!

Originally Posted by master gandhi

Yeah, and he has direct trunking to the VUDU servers, whatever the f that means.

Hey Master I thought you were on my side, as you recall I Retired from AT&T and I set up some of these Fiber Networks in the Silicon Valley. Direct Trunking is the way it sounds, a Direct Route to your Home. You don't have to funnel your Streaming Video through Peering Providers. A Fiber Path straight to your Home, and then Hard Wired to your HDTV. This will give you all your Bandwidth, and provide the best Streaming Picture. Vudu a few years ago was experimenting with BitRate up to 20Mbps depending on your Bandwidth. So we have talked about it here, with the right set up and Bandwidth HDX=Blu-ray.

[stonesfan129]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Hey Master I thought you were on my side, as you recall I Retired from AT&T and I set up some of these Networks in the Silicon Valley. Direct Trunking is the way it sounds, a Direct Route to your Home. You don't have to funnel your Streaming Video through Peering Providers. A Fiber Path straight to your Home, and then Hard Wired to your HDTV. This will give you all your Bandwidth, and provide the best Streaming Picture. So Vudu a few years ago was experimenting with BitRate up to 20Mbps depending on your Bandwidth. So we have talked about it here, with the right set up and Bandwidth HDX=Blu-ray.

Soundwise, Vudu HDX =/= Blu-ray. And what happens when your internet connection goes down? I'm fine with buying compressed iTunes versions and storing them locally. Yes, not Blu-ray either, but good enough unless you have a gigantic TV or state-of-the-art surround system.

[dublinbluray108]

I watched my first ever movie on Flixster Video today. I am here to share my few thoughts with you on what it was like for me while I had watched it on my Toshiba laptop.

The movie that I watched today, which was a movie download, was Batman V Superman Dawn of Justice The Ultimate Edition.

I use the app on Windows 10 Home Edition. I thought the whole process of watching the movie on my laptop was a very mixed experience overall. I am a person that would normally be more suited to watch movies, TV shows & documentaries via physical media. That process has never changed until today.

To start off this process of watching the movie today; I had to download the movie from the day before. I did not have the time to watch it yesterday because I was busy at home. The download time for this movie for me lasted 90 minutes to which I thought was very quick to download the whole thing. I thought the file size of the movie was quite big; a total of 8.15 GB. When I tried to open the app earlier; it was frustrating at the beginning because I had clicked on the app multiple times to try & open it. It took me the best part of 30 minutes to open the damn thing on the desktop. I thought that alone was a very slow & stressful experience to go through all that hassle by just watching a movie that you liked very much when you saw it in the cinema.

When I watched the Ultimate Edition of BvS; I thought the HD picture was very good up to a point. It had flowed very well for the majority of the movie. Although; there was some issues with the picture around the first 10 minutes of the movie with picture buffering even though I was watching it offline. I thought the audio in the movie was loud to a certain point but the audio had cracked sound throughout the whole movie. I was very disappointed with that outcome because of the audio quality was certainly lacking in expectations. I was also not any given any options in the downloaded movie to change the audio options when the movie played on the laptop either. You do have options of changing subtitles in the movie to different languages. You would get options to change the closed captions as well to different preferences that suit you.

I thought there would no issues with the sound at all because I had my headphones plugged into the laptop. The reason I said that the movie was loud was because I download a DTS app for my laptop from the Toshiba website last month. I had this app before when I had used it on Windows 8.1 a few years ago. This app will give you very rich sound on your computer whenever you will play movies, TV shows, games or music whenever you want.

You also have to use Adobe Flash Player when you watch a movie or TV show on the Flixster Video app. I was under the impression that this form of video software was out of date in certain web browsers like Google Chrome due to new applications being rolled out online like HTML 5. I wouldn't mind if Flixster had made a decision to replace Adobe Flash Player with HTML 5 become of better future requirements to online video technology.

As of today, I have a total of 35 titles on the Flixster Video app on Windows, the majority of them are in HD. I don't have a new HDTV as of yet. I have a Toshiba Blu-ray player for 2 years as well as lots of Blu-ray titles at home. I will be downloading more UV titles in the mean time to see what the picture & sound quality are like on more of them when I get free time to watch them at home. Some of them are animated movies from WB like The Lego Movie & Mr Peabody & Sherman from Dreamworks. Some are from Universal namely Back to the Future Trilogy etc. I also have movies like The Monuments Men & The Interview there as well. I have one title from the BBC which is from Top Gear with Jeremy Clarkson & Richard Hammond when they are on their first Perfect Road Trip. But that show for me is in SD though.

To conclude my point on this post. If you are a fan of BvS & you want to watch it because it means a lot to you well go & watch it on Blu-ray. I would prefer doing that myself because physical media is king for me. I will say this mainly I would like to see the movie on a disc & to watch the 2 hours of extras included in it.

Also I will be writing up my review on BvS in the Movie thread later on this week. So all I can say is watch that space.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by dublinbluray108

I watched my first ever movie on Flixster Video today. I am here to share my few thoughts with you on what it was like for me while I had watched it on my Toshiba laptop.

The movie that I watched today, which was a movie download, was Batman V Superman Dawn of Justice The Ultimate Edition.

I use the app on Windows 10 Home Edition. I thought the whole process of watching the movie on my laptop was a very mixed experience overall. I am a person that would normally be more suited to watch movies, TV shows & documentaries via physical media. That process has never changed until today.

To start off this process of watching the movie today; I had to download the movie from the day before. I did not have the time to watch it yesterday because I was busy at home. The download time for this movie for me lasted 90 minutes to which I thought was very quick to download the whole thing. I thought the file size of the movie was quite big; a total of 8.15 GB. When I tried to open the app earlier; it was frustrating at the beginning because I had clicked on the app multiple times to try & open it. It took me the best part of 30 minutes to open the damn thing on the desktop. I thought that alone was a very slow & stressful experience to go through all that hassle by just watching a movie that you liked very much when you saw it in the cinema.

To begin with, Downloads and Streaming are different, you can't compare a 30 GigaBit Movie to just 8 or 10 GB's. Also a Laptop is not a Big Screen HDTV, so there is no comparison there. So your assessment of watching a Digital Movie is not the best.

[Cevolution]

Originally Posted by alchav21

To begin with, Downloads and Streaming are different, you can't compare a 30 GigaBit Movie to just 8 or 10 GB's. Also a Laptop is not a Big Screen HDTV, so there is no comparison there. So your assessment of watching a Digital Movie is not the best.

You are not really in any position to be telling anyone that their assessment is not the best, considering that you make your comparisons between online services and Blu-ray on a 1080i model tv, and from this declare that they are the same.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

To begin with, Downloads and Streaming are different, you can't compare a 30 GigaBit Movie to just 8 or 10 GB's. Also a Laptop is not a Big Screen HDTV, so there is no comparison there. So your assessment of watching a Digital Movie is not the best.

Originally Posted by Cevolution

You are not really in any position to be telling anyone that their assessment is not the best, considering that you make your comparisons between online services and Blu-ray on a 1080i model tv, and from this declare that they are the same.

Hey Cevolution you come out of the woodwork from time to time, but I think my Mitsubishi 62" DLP 1080i is better than any Laptop, especially with my set up. Soon I will be credible again, I have on order a Sony 75" UHD TV with a Panasonic UHD Blu-ray Player. Then we will see if my Postings get a little more respect.

[Dubstar]

Originally Posted by randian

What movies are you thinking of? Titles like Megamind and Kung Fu Panda are certainly available on blu-ray.

'Wallace and Gromit in Curse of the WereRabbit'
'Prince of Egypt'
'Road to El Dorado'

~
on Vudu in HDX, but didn't buy personally:

'Sinbad: The Legend of the Seven Seas'
'Flushed Away'
'Over the Hedge'

[master gandhi]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Hey Master I thought you were on my side, as you recall I Retired from AT&T and I set up some of these Fiber Networks in the Silicon Valley. Direct Trunking is the way it sounds, a Direct Route to your Home. You don't have to funnel your Streaming Video through Peering Providers. A Fiber Path straight to your Home, and then Hard Wired to your HDTV. This will give you all your Bandwidth, and provide the best Streaming Picture. Vudu a few years ago was experimenting with BitRate up to 20Mbps depending on your Bandwidth. So we have talked about it here, with the right set up and Bandwidth HDX=Blu-ray.

I'm not against you, but we've discovered that you do embellish some things on here, which hurts the digital argument. Your internet setup does sound impressive. I hope more and more people get access to fiber the same way. Gimme that direct trunking please. Still, it's inconclusive whether VUDU bitrates/encodes can ever compare to Blu-ray at this time. From my experience, it looks Blu-ray-like in bright scenes, and suffers in darker scenes. That goes for all digital providers. They all have trouble with darker scenes.

[bubba111]

Originally Posted by master gandhi

I'm not against you, but we've discovered that you do embellish some things on here, which hurts the digital argument. Your internet setup does sound impressive. I hope more and more people get access to fiber the same way. Gimme that direct trunking please. Still, it's inconclusive whether VUDU bitrates/encodes can ever compare to Blu-ray at this time. From my experience, it looks Blu-ray-like in bright scenes, and suffers in darker scenes. That goes for all digital providers. They all have trouble with darker scenes.

I'm probably as in favor of digital as you are, but it's hard to take you seriously when you advocate people move to different geographical area just to get faster Internet. It's more effective if you acknowledge the weaknesses (as well as the strengths) of your position rather make some assertion that is either untrue (as you acknowledge some of your bitrate arguments to be) or laughable (as is uprooting your family and moving just to get faster Internet).

tl;dr: both Blu-ray and digital have their advantages. In the future, some of those advantages/disadvantages could change.

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by master gandhi

I'm not against you, but we've discovered that you do embellish some things on here, which hurts the digital argument. Your internet setup does sound impressive. I hope more and more people get access to fiber the same way. Gimme that direct trunking please. Still, it's inconclusive whether VUDU bitrates/encodes can ever compare to Blu-ray at this time. From my experience, it looks Blu-ray-like in bright scenes, and suffers in darker scenes. That goes for all digital providers. They all have trouble with darker scenes.

Pretty much this. This is mostly where digital loses, in my opinion. I've learned to be okay with it but digital hasn't gotten the darker scenes right yet and I've been looking over my digital copies via iTunes for over 2 years now. The only films, digitally, that I've seen do the darker scenes pretty damn effectively that almost match Blu Ray are the UNDERWORLD films.

[Cranston37]

Originally Posted by Jumpman

Pretty much this. This is mostly where digital loses, in my opinion. I've learned to be okay with it but digital hasn't gotten the darker scenes right yet and I've been looking over my digital copies via iTunes for over 2 years now. The only films, digitally, that I've seen do the darker scenes pretty damn effectively that almost match Blu Ray are the UNDERWORLD films.

If you have Zero Dark Thirty on Vudu, go to the 2 hour 2 min mark and look at the quality of those scenes. It's pretty dang funny...

[twobelowpar]

I'm surprised there is this much dissent over this issue. It should be obvious that Bluray > iTunes or Vudu. I've transitioned to mainly digital because of convenience and because I pay "wholesale" price for codes. Exceptions are Disney titles and a few favourite films I want to have in physical form. The question is whether the convenience and sometimes price difference is worth the subtle drop in quality. That answer will vary for every person.

[master gandhi]

Originally Posted by bubba111

I'm probably as in favor of digital as you are, but it's hard to take you seriously when you advocate people move to different geographical area just to get faster Internet. It's more effective if you acknowledge the weaknesses (as well as the strengths) of your position rather make some assertion that is either untrue (as you acknowledge some of your bitrate arguments to be) or laughable (as is uprooting your family and moving just to get faster Internet).

tl;dr: both Blu-ray and digital have their advantages. In the future, some of those advantages/disadvantages could change.

Just to be clear to others, bubba111 is not referring to me when he says "you", even though he quoted me here. He's talking about alchav21.

I don't advocate that people move for better internet. For many people, it's not that easy to move, so to do it for the sake of getting better internet speeds isn't enough of a good reason.

Even though I acknowledge digital's weaknesses, I still favor it over physical these days. It's convenient, it saves physical space, it's usually cheaper and you don't have to worry about disc rot. Those are some reasons off the top of my head that gets me to support digital so strongly.

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by Cranston37

If you have Zero Dark Thirty on Vudu, go to the 2 hour 2 min mark and look at the quality of those scenes. It's pretty dang funny...

I have it on iTunes. I'll take a look.

[Greyman]

Originally Posted by twobelowpar

I'm surprised there is this much dissent over this issue. It should be obvious that Bluray > iTunes or Vudu. I've transitioned to mainly digital because of convenience and because I pay "wholesale" price for codes. Exceptions are Disney titles and a few favourite films I want to have in physical form. The question is whether the convenience and sometimes price difference is worth the subtle drop in quality. That answer will vary for every person.

It is basically one person trolling Bluray.com with deliberate misinformation.

Originally Posted by alchav21

I know Master, I just like to Tweak these Disc Lovers so I kind of Embellish the information I have. Vudu has contacted me for an Interview, maybe they have seen my Postings. I remember a statistical class I took in College, and you can do so many things with the right Stats. I love Streaming Video, and I know it's going to be the way of the Future. First Run Movies right to your Home Theater!

[master gandhi]

Originally Posted by Greyman

It is basically one person trolling Bluray.com with deliberate misinformation.

Yeah, even after admitting he embellishes, he continues to say VUDU HDX = Blu-ray. I don't like that behavior one bit. Lying is a huge pet peeve of mine, and clearly others feel the same way. Thankfully there are still honest people out there. Unfortunately, he is not one of them.

I'm all for defending digital, but do so with the truth.

[bubba111]

Originally Posted by master gandhi

Just to be clear to others, bubba111 is not referring to me when he says "you", even though he quoted me here. He's talking about alchav21.

I don't advocate that people move for better internet. For many people, it's not that easy to move, so to do it for the sake of getting better internet speeds isn't enough of a good reason.

Even though I acknowledge digital's weaknesses, I still favor it over physical these days. It's convenient, it saves physical space, it's usually cheaper and you don't have to worry about disc rot. Those are some reasons off the top of my head that gets me to support digital so strongly.

Yes, apologies - I was referring to alchav21. He is the only person I have seen on this forum who has advocated moving just to get better Internet.