Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Until they offer ads (which they will).

I don't think that adding advertising will endear them to their customers without a corresponding drop in their monthly rates which could negate any gains that they might hope to make from any ad revenue in the first place. Ads could cost them subscribers if there is no benefit to the customer from their inclusion. It would take a hell of a lot of ad revenue to erase the debt that they already have, $12.43 billion, and their expenses are only increasing. Netflix is discovering that making their own content is quite expensive.

Another possibility is that their ever heavier debt burden could make them a possible target for a takeover. Some company that actually makes money and that has plenty to spend might buy them. I would not be surprised if some giant like Disney, Apple, AT&T, etc. bought them in a fire sale and added them to their empire. Such potential buyers as these are all very profitable companies and they each have many revenue sources. Netflix, by contrast, has so very few revenue sources and they have not made a profit in nine years.

I'm just speculating, of course. At the moment Netflix's stock price is quite high at $339.66 per share, but that continues to be based upon the yet unproven belief that someday they might actually make some money. They haven't made a net dime since 2011; how long will investors maintain confidence in a company that never makes any money?

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Until they offer ads (which they will).

They have always said they would not, time will tell. I do believe sub rates will be raised again and soon.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

They have always said they would not, time will tell. I do believe sub rates will be raised again and soon.

Raising their rates will do nothing to make them more competitive with the likes of Disney+ and the new upcoming services. Raising their prices at a time when they have more competitors than ever before, and who already charge far lower rates, seems unwise, but when you're strapped for cash your options are few.

[Boccaccio]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I don't think that adding advertising will endear them to their customers without a corresponding drop in their monthly rates which could negate any gains that they might hope to make from any ad revenue in the first place. Ads could cost them subscribers if there is no benefit to the customer from their inclusion. It would take a hell of a lot of ad revenue to erase the debt that they already have, $12.43 billion, and their expenses are only increasing. Netflix is discovering that making their own content is quite expensive.

Another possibility is that their ever heavier debt burden could make them a possible target for a takeover. Some company that actually makes money and that has plenty to spend might buy them. I would not be surprised if some giant like Disney, Apple, AT&T, etc. bought them in a fire sale and added them to their empire. Such potential buyers as these are all very profitable companies and they each have many revenue sources. Netflix, by contrast, has so very few revenue sources in comparison and they have not made a profit in nine years.

I'm just speculating, of course. At the moment Netflix's stock price is quite high at $339.66 per share, but that continues to be based upon the yet unproven belief that someday they might actually make some money. They haven't made a net dime since 2011; how long will investors maintain confidence in a company that never makes any money?

I think 9 years is already a long time without making any profit. That must be some serious confidence.
Like I said, they seem to keep spending more every year. It has to stop sometime.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I don't think that adding advertising will endear them to their customers without a corresponding drop in their monthly rates which could negate any gains that they might hope to make from any ad revenue in the first place. Ads could cost them subscribers if there is no benefit to the customer from their inclusion. It would take a hell of a lot of ad revenue to erase the debt that they already have, $12.43 billion, and their expenses are only increasing. Netflix is discovering that making their own content is quite expensive.

Another possibility is that their ever heavier debt burden could make them a possible target for a takeover. Some company that actually makes money and that has plenty to spend might buy them. I would not be surprised if some giant like Disney, Apple, AT&T, etc. bought them in a fire sale and added them to their empire. Such potential buyers as these are all very profitable companies and they each have many revenue sources. Netflix, by contrast, has so very few revenue sources and they have not made a profit in nine years.

I'm just speculating, of course. At the moment Netflix's stock price is quite high at $339.66 per share, but that continues to be based upon the yet unproven belief that someday they might actually make some money. They haven't made a net dime since 2011; how long will investors maintain confidence in a company that never makes any money?

The more desperate they become.........

[Vilya]

Looks there will be some exciting 4K disc releases coming soon. The Star Wars prequels AND the original trilogy are all estimated to be released individually on March 31 this year.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...2#post17253802

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...3#post17253813

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...9#post17253819

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...0#post17253830

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...3#post17253843

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...4#post17253854

It also looks like The Hobbit Trilogy and The Lord Of The Rings Trilogy will be coming on 4K disc this October. These will include the extended and the theatrical cuts. This news is about the German release, but Warner Brothers will likely release these here in the U.S. also.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...&postcount=521

https://www.4kfilme.de/herr-der-ring...u-ray-geplant/

That's news of 12 big titles on the 4K disc format expected this year and it's only mid January. What other goodies are in store for us disc collectors?

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Vilya

That's news of 12 big titles on the 4K disc format expected this year and it's only mid January. What other goodies are in store for us disc collectors?

Bill Hunt mentioned the Star Wars a while back as in a screen viewing. If they did justice to the Atmos tracks then that will mean at least the 5th time I have purchased the first 3 and 3rd time for the second 3. Bring it on!!

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Bill Hunt mentioned the Star Wars a while back as in a screen viewing. If they did justice to the Atmos tracks then that will mean at least the 5th time I have purchased the first 3 and 3rd time for the second 3. Bring it on!!

I will have bought them as many times as you have, but some movies are obviously worth rebuying to get the best presentation possible. We have each rebought movies many times; what's 12 more?

The Star Wars prequels are the only "meh" titles for me, but the completionist in me will still want them.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I will have bought them as many times as you have, but some movies are obviously worth rebuying to get the best presentation possible. We have each rebought movies many times; what's 12 more?

The Star Wars prequels are the only "meh" titles for me, but the completionist in me will still want them.

My record is 6 for Alien, Aliens.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

My record is 6 for Alien, Aliens.

Now you're talking, I started with Disc on a lot of the Franchise Movies like Alien, Aliens, Jurassic Park-World, Fast and the Furious, and now into Digital 4K with all of them plus others.

[Vilya]

The entire point of rebuying these iconic movies time and again is to have the best presentation possible both in video and in audio. Only physical media offers that along with genuine ownership.

Bitrate starved digital streaming doesn't cut it on any of these counts. We want the very best, not mere convenience.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

The entire point of rebuying these iconic movies time and again is to have the best presentation possible both in video and in audio. Only physical media offers that along with genuine ownership.

Bitrate starved digital streaming doesn't cut it on any of these counts. We want the very best, not mere convenience.

You took the words right out of my mouth. (Vocals in the style of Meatloaf)

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Bitrate starved digital streaming doesn't cut it on any of these counts. We want the very best, not mere convenience.

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You took the words right out of my mouth.

That's all I hear about Streaming, Bit Starved, Convenience, and Good Enough but what does that mean exactly? Now with Streaming Bit Rates Peaks at 30+Mbps HD PQ is as good as BD. I still say PQ and Sound are all subjective for Disc or Streaming dependent on your equipment and budget. Someone that pays $10,000+ should have better Picture and Sound Quality than someone paying $1000 or less.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

That's all I hear about Streaming, Bit Starved, Convenience, and Good Enough but what does that mean exactly? Now with Streaming Bit Rates Peaks at 30+Mbps HD PQ is as good as BD. I still say PQ and Sound is all subjective for Disc or Streaming dependent on your equipment and budget. Someone that pays $10,000+ should have better Picture and Sound Quality than someone paying $1000 or less.

As usual, you have no idea what you're talking about. After all of this discussion about all of these things over all of this time and you still have not been able to learn a single thing.

The reason that you do not understand the differences between the best that streaming offers and the best that physical media offers is quite simple: you do not own a 4K disc player and you have not seen a 4K disc. How can you appreciate a difference that, by your own admission, you have never seen?

Only three streaming services offer peak video bitrates near 30 mbps (Apple, MA, Disney+) and those are for their 4K streams, not their HD streams. These same 3 services average between 17-25 mbps for their 4K streams. Even so, a regular blu-ray disc can deliver bitrates as high as 48 mbps and that is more than 50% higher than the best that 4K streams offer. The average bitrates for HD streams are typically 8-10 mbps and that is not even one-fifth of what a blu-ray can deliver. A blu-ray beats an HD stream with ease and it often beats a 4K stream, too.

A 4K disc can deliver bitrates as high as 128 Mbps. The best 4K streams at their peak offer less than a fourth of the bitrate that a 4K disc can deliver at its peak.

Picture and audio quality is objectively measured on a number of parameters. The only subjective element is how much any given person cares about those objective differences. Someone with standards as low as yours is pleased by virtually everything and that is fine for you, but many of us demand better than what you settle for. We want the best and we want to really own what we buy; only physical media offers both.

Obviously, and how you do love to state the obvious, anyone that pays 10 times more for their gear should be enjoying better results, but none of that changes the source material itself. An overly compressed artifact plagued bitrate stream remains an overly compressed artifact plagued bitrate stream regardless of the equipment being used.

My newest TV cost 2.5 times what its predecessor did, but it did not transform streaming from an ugly duckling into a swan; garbage in makes for garbage out. My new TV did not work any wonders with my VHS tapes anymore than it did with streaming. My new 85" TV makes streaming's warts all the more obvious. Similarly, my surround sound system can only do so much with Amazon's embarrassingly low 190 Kbps audio bitrates; even my ancient MP3 audio files have 320 kbps bitrates. The gear certainly matters, but the quality of the source material matters every bit as much.

Penny pinchers like you would not buy a $10,000 system even if it could work miracles with bitrate starved streaming. All you care about is economy and convenience and, again, that's just dandy for you, but many of us have higher standards that you can not even begin to fathom because you have never even seen, or heard, what a 4K disc can do on any system.

[dib2]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I will probably be working until I drop.

I dropped earlier than expected or rather am slowly fading away.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by dib2

I dropped earlier than expected or rather am slowly fading away.

How so buddy?

[dib2]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

How so buddy?

Neurological problems due to PKU not being treated correctly. Hence, I am awake and can not sleep. Just one of my many problems. I find being on here reading posts and posting time to time is better than watching TV or anything else. That's about all I do most of the time. I need more variety in my life.

[stonesfan129]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Looks there will be some exciting 4K disc releases coming soon. The Star Wars prequels AND the original trilogy are all estimated to be released individually on March 31 this year.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...2#post17253802

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...3#post17253813

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...9#post17253819

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...0#post17253830

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...3#post17253843

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...4#post17253854

It also looks like The Hobbit Trilogy and The Lord Of The Rings Trilogy will be coming on 4K disc this October. These will include the extended and the theatrical cuts. This news is about the German release, but Warner Brothers will likely release these here in the U.S. also.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...&postcount=521

https://www.4kfilme.de/herr-der-ring...u-ray-geplant/

That's news of 12 big titles on the 4K disc format expected this year and it's only mid January. What other goodies are in store for us disc collectors?

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Episode 2: Attack of the Clones shot digitally in 1080p? I would be the original trilogy set if they were the theatrical cuts, not the special edition cuts.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by stonesfan129

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Episode 2: Attack of the Clones shot digitally in 1080p?

True. Can you see the difference between 1920 and 2048? To this day 2048 (2K DI) is how most things are finished and the UHD products (physical and streaming) is upscaled from those 2K DI's. The good part is we are starting to see more 4K DI's (4096).

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by dib2

Neurological problems due to PKU not being treated correctly. Hence, I am awake and can not sleep. Just one of my many problems. I find being on here reading posts and posting time to time is better than watching TV or anything else. That's about all I do most of the time. I need more variety in my life.

I wish you all the best. Hope you can find some peace. Sorry to hear you are going through that.