Blackmail (1929, Alfred Hitchcock) from Kino Lorber (issues..)

[drush9999]

Originally Posted by thisis2

..is it possible that BFI themselves might release this movie in europe in the near future.?...surely they wouldn't commit the same errors....

I'm surprised the BFI haven't released any of the Hicthcocks they have.

[Filmmaker]

An actual line from the Blu1ray.com review: “...there is something unique about this version which makes it feel unique.”

Boy, I guess we get the writing quality we pay for, huh?

[jamesbobo]

While I can see the difference in the screenshots of the three versions of the film in the original post, I never noticed any distortion while watching the 1:20 version. Maybe it's because my TV is only 32". In any case, the sound version looked very good to me. The segments with scratches were very short, and the picture looked quite sharp. While very similar to the silent film, the breakfast segment took advantage of the new sound medium in a unique way. A woman is talking about the murder says she would not use a knife. At first her words are clear, than they turn to a muddle, except for the word 'knife' which gets louder every time she says it. Finally, it sounds so loud (to Alice) that she drops the knife she was using to cut bread. In the silent version, she drops the knife when the front door opens and a bell rings.
The silent version has its good points, too. I thought the restaurant scene where she ditched Frank played better in the silent version.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by drush9999

I'm surprised the BFI haven't released any of the Hicthcocks they have.

The BFI doesn't have distribution rights for any of the 9 films that were restored, as far as I know, they just restored them for archival purposes. Each of the 9 titles belongs to either Studiocanal or ITV.

[Wtdk]

Originally Posted by jamesbobo

While I can see the difference in the screenshots of the three versions of the film in the original post, I never noticed any distortion while watching the 1:20 version. Maybe it's because my TV is only 32". In any case, the sound version looked very good to me. The segments with scratches were very short, and the picture looked quite sharp. While very similar to the silent film, the breakfast segment took advantage of the new sound medium in a unique way. A woman is talking about the murder says she would not use a knife. At first her words are clear, than they turn to a muddle, except for the word 'knife' which gets louder every time she says it. Finally, it sounds so loud (to Alice) that she drops the knife she was using to cut bread. In the silent version, she drops the knife when the front door opens and a bell rings.
The silent version has its good points, too. I thought the restaurant scene where she ditched Frank played better in the silent version.

yes that scene shows that even at this early stage Hitch was using sound uniquely rather than just having a talking “silent” film. It Robin Wood noted it in his book from 1973 as an early example of Hitch’s innovation in use of sound that compliments his unique visual skills.

Given the small potential for sales for any early film like this, I doubt that Kino will go back and take care of the distortion issue that occurred during the transfer.

[captainsolo]

I wanted very badly to get this but have been holding off in hopes of a corrected version.
So I take it there’s been no news and Kino may not address it...

Doggone it-and to think it was finally a release of both versions for people to discover...grrr this kind of lack of care/quality control is infuriating!

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by captainsolo

I wanted very badly to get this but have been holding off in hopes of a corrected version.
So I take it there’s been no news and Kino may not address it...

Doggone it-and to think it was finally a release of both versions for people to discover...grrr this kind of lack of care/quality control is infuriating!

They have addressed it, definitively. Unfortunately, they're firmly of the opinion that there is no technical error and their disc is in the correct aspect ratio.

[captainsolo]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

They have addressed it, definitively. Unfortunately, they're firmly of the opinion that there is no technical error and their disc is in the correct aspect ratio.

You've got to be kidding. That's just....wow....I hate to make Kino jokes but are they ever going to have more quality control?

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by captainsolo

You've got to be kidding. That's just....wow....I hate to make Kino jokes but are they ever going to have more quality control?

They definitively stated that they believe their disc with 1.11:1 is the correct aspect ratio. They also said that was the aspect ratio the film has always been presented in:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...7#post16775467

When it was pointed out that A) 1.11:1 is not the correct aspect ratio, indeed not even the aspect ratio printed on the disc (1.20) and that B) every previous home video release has been 1.19:1, they said that they disagreed with those two statements, that the 1.20:1 text printed on their disc was a typo, and that they would not be offering replacements.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...=320894&page=3

I still haven't seen any explanation for why they included a 1.33 stretched version on the main disc and put what was intended to be the OAR version on a second disc. It must have cost them more to make it a two disc set, but the reason for the 1.33 version is still a mystery.

[koberulz]

Originally Posted by captainsolo

You've got to be kidding. That's just....wow....I hate to make Kino jokes but are they ever going to have quality control?

Fixed.

Honestly it's not the quality control that bothers me the most, it's the blatant lies when they're called out on their subpar products.

[captainsolo]

This really started on their Leone responses which I found extremely insensitive to people who were really trying to help. I didn't get any directed my way I think but I've been researching those titles specifically since I was in high school years ago around the time of the 2003 GBU extension and used to write in to MGM about them so I do have experience in that area and even know some of those fine folks who tried to contact KL.

I always knew they had issues back during the DVD era for example but this is a new level of standoffishness. I was trying to be polite above but their continued focus on quantity over quality plus such a tone of negativity is really disconcerting. Then there are so many titles I've later replaced or needed to replace after a foreign label does the same master with a better encode and new or more extras which makes me hesitate to purchase any KL title. Their ongoing issues with silent titles is really bad-and their Nosferatu disc is just awful because of it.

We've been waiting years fro proper releases of these Hitchcock titles and to finally have both sound and silent versions in HD should have been amazing. To pay top dollar for this disc and it not be in the correct aspect ratio is not too much to ask and is indeed a true problem that needs to be rectified.

I haven't seen any news on Murder! Is that title at least unaffected by the same kind of issue? I'll definitely be waiting for reviews first on the boxset.

[JEDGAR1000]

Since the talkie version of the bluray got messed up, what's the best dvd edition of the talkie version?

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by JEDGAR1000

Since the talkie version of the bluray got messed up, what's the best dvd edition of the talkie version?

I don't think there has ever been a legit DVD release in the US.

This German disc is probably your best option:

https://www.amazon.de/Blackmail-Erpr...1031906&sr=8-1

I have this UK DVD set, which looks great:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hitchcock-E...9&s=dvd&sr=1-1

I don't believe there has ever been a legit standalone UK DVD. There is a legit standalone DVD in France, but it's OOP

https://www.amazon.fr/Chantage-Skin-...1031874&sr=8-1

Be aware that any European DVDs you buy will be PAL, 25fps. You'll want to watch on your computer with VLC player, so you can play them at 96% speed.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by captainsolo

I haven't seen any news on Murder! Is that title at least unaffected by the same kind of issue? I'll definitely be waiting for reviews first on the boxset.

Blackmail is unique among Hitchcock's films in having this issue. It was produced during a very brief window of time when film aspect ratios were in flux due to the addition of sound. Murder is normal 1.33:1.

[koberulz]

So what do I need to do if I want to fix the aspect ratio issue myself? Assume I already have the video files off the disc, obviously.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by koberulz

So what do I need to do if I want to fix the aspect ratio issue myself? Assume I already have the video files off the disc, obviously.

Since the intended aspect ratio of 1.20:1 is not a standard one, I don't think simply stretching it in VLC while playing it would work, I think you would need to use some sort of editing software to stretch it to precisely the right aspect ratio.

[koberulz]

Well yes, but what ratio am I going for? Has anyone actually done it and know exactly what to do with it?

There are two aspect ratios available and neither is accurate, right? Which file should I be starting with? Disc 1 or disc 2? Or does it make no difference?

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by koberulz

Well yes, but what ratio am I going for? Has anyone actually done it and know exactly what to do with it?

There are two aspect ratios available and neither is accurate, right? Which file should I be starting with? Disc 1 or disc 2? Or does it make no difference?

Correct, neither disc has an accurate aspect ratio.

The "talkie" version on disc 1 is stretched to 1.33:1
The version on disc 2 is squished to 1.11:1

You want to take either of them and resize them to 1.19:1

I'm not sure that it matters which one you resize. I've never heard of anyone doing it, I suspect it would be a bit complicated.

I kept this set for the restored silent version, for the sound version I just watch my old DVD, which appears to be from the same master and is the correct aspect ratio.

[kishiro]

There are two aspect ratios available and neither is accurate, right? Which file should I be starting with? Disc 1 or disc 2? Or does it make no difference?

Yes. Disc one has been horizontally strecthced to 1.33:1 (people are too fat), while disc 2 has been vertically strecthced to 1.12:1 (mislabeled as 1.20:1 on the cover) which makes everyone too skinny.

The correct AR is 1.20:1. Personally I would use disc 2 and crop away pixels from the black bars to make the correct AR (for example wth an AviSynth script)

[koberulz]

Is the silent version correct and does it contain the same shots anywhere? Could it be used as a reference?