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Old 06-06-2019, 03:36 PM   #1361
emailking emailking is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cminer72 View Post
Just like Adam West was Batman to the baby boomers, Michael Keaton is Batman to Gen Xers. Millennials have Christian Bale. Each brings something different to the role that resonated with it's audience at the time. Ranking them is pointless.
That's true. I might feel different if I saw this first.

I do think I prefer the Burton/Nicholson take on Joker better than the Nolan/Ledger take. They're both good though.
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Old 06-06-2019, 03:36 PM   #1362
Indiana Jonezzz... Indiana Jonezzz... is offline
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Originally Posted by ROSS.T.G. View Post
They should redo the entire movie, replace Keaton and add all CGI.
Christopher Plummer gotta eat!
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Old 06-06-2019, 03:38 PM   #1363
PeterTHX PeterTHX is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epicfilmguys View Post
There is no official word or confirmation on if Burton was even involved in these transfers at all whatsoever.
Hence the word "possible".
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Old 06-06-2019, 03:46 PM   #1364
epicfilmguys epicfilmguys is offline
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Originally Posted by PeterTHX View Post
Hence the word "possible".
Anything is "possible". To those that have watched with the Atmos downmix, does it make the newer sound effects any less jarring? I might check it out before I attempt to sync up the old mix.
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Old 06-06-2019, 05:21 PM   #1365
Bond84 Bond84 is online now
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Watched this last night. I really hate to admit it, but the new sound effects really bothered me more that I thought they would. It's not that they sound weird or out of place...just that if you know the movie inside and out like I do, its very jarring to be expecting one sound and hear something completely different. For Heaven's sake, they even changed the sound of the little batmobile bomb clanking on the ground at the chemical factory!

On the other hand, maybe it's my imagination, but I think they lowered the volume on Kim Basinger's screaming, which I'm okay with!

The PQ is fantastic but its definitely got a teal blanket over it that seems to come and go. Checking it out afterwards, I found the old bluray has the same tint but not as obvious.

Overall, I'm really torn by those sound effects. I'm usually not the type to get worked up over stuff like that but it really does bother me this time.

I should add that the rest of the new Atmos track sounds incredible though. I was hearing intricacies in the score I hadn't noticed before, especially in the bass region.

Last edited by Bond84; 06-06-2019 at 05:34 PM.
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Old 06-06-2019, 05:31 PM   #1366
BNex99 BNex99 is offline
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Originally Posted by epicfilmguys View Post
So I know I'll get laughed at for this question, but if one wanted to attempt to contact WB in order to "attempt" to see about the possibility about a replacement disc with the original audio mix, how would they begin that process?

Again, I know my chances but I'm just curious.
I've emailed this address twice (given to me by WBShop customer service): whv@wb.com.

But I haven't gotten a response yet.
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Old 06-06-2019, 06:16 PM   #1367
epicfilmguys epicfilmguys is offline
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Originally Posted by BNex99 View Post
I've emailed this address twice (given to me by WBShop customer service): whv@wb.com.

But I haven't gotten a response yet.
Thanks! I found a few more emails on their corporate website I will be contacting as well. No harm done in trying.
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:07 PM   #1368
fighthefutureofhd fighthefutureofhd is offline
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I did that back in the day before all of this. I went to the corporate office of an artist's record label to see if they knew when they would be touring in my neck of the woods. Suffice it to say they weren't, but I did find out they were playing at the same city I was in at the time. Only it would be 2 weeks later. Missed my prom to go back to see that show. Never will forget that.
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:09 PM   #1369
DarkEco910 DarkEco910 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cminer72 View Post
Just like Adam West was Batman to the baby boomers, Michael Keaton is Batman to Gen Xers. Millennials have Christian Bale. Each brings something different to the role that resonated with it's audience at the time. Ranking them is pointless.
^^

This. Thank you!
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:11 PM   #1370
HeavyHitter HeavyHitter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cminer72 View Post
Just like Adam West was Batman to the baby boomers, Michael Keaton is Batman to Gen Xers. Millennials have Christian Bale. Each brings something different to the role that resonated with it's audience at the time. Ranking them is pointless.
Yep...similar thing with Bond.
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:24 PM   #1371
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mocorongo View Post
To mix the old BD audio with the new 4K you only need to extract one and insert into the other. There's no need to sync anything, I already checked that part.
False! The 2009 Blu-ray audio needs adjustments. Was already confirmed by people who've looked into this. Same goes with the LaserDisc audio.
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:35 PM   #1372
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bendermac View Post
False! The 2009 Blu-ray audio needs adjustments. Was already confirmed by people who've looked into this. Same goes with the LaserDisc audio.
Yep it's all over the place for missing frames
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:39 PM   #1373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epicfilmguys View Post
Anything is "possible". To those that have watched with the Atmos downmix, does it make the newer sound effects any less jarring? I might check it out before I attempt to sync up the old mix.
It's not just the effects for me, the mix is all kinds of janky
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:45 PM   #1374
MisterXDTV MisterXDTV is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bendermac View Post
False! The 2009 Blu-ray audio needs adjustments. Was already confirmed by people who've looked into this. Same goes with the LaserDisc audio.
Wrong, the 2009 Dolby TrueHD track is very easy to sync

Delays

-167 ms (UHD Blu-ray)
+167 ms (Remastered Blu-ray)
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:50 PM   #1375
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I think it looked and sounded great to me for a 30 year old movie. It did freeze on me a couple of times ? I'll watch it again with the other set of grandkid's soon. Not one ***** from this guy at all
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Old 06-06-2019, 07:50 PM   #1376
TheFingering TheFingering is offline
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As a fan of this and Returns since way back, and having owned the film on every format, my jaw was on the floor from the moment I popped this in. I shit you not I was slavering.

This is the BEST '89 has ever, ever looked. The purple in Joker's suit, the FOREST!

I'd say it's the hype getting to me and clouding my judgement, but I can't find a damn thing wrong.

I'll convince the partner to let me throw another 20 at Returns.

Regarding sound, I know how this film should sound. I recognise every inch of it like I do my...
It didn't bother me too much, but I maintain they shouldn't have played with it to begin with. Bit of a shame.

I gather Returns hasn't been tinkered with?
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Old 06-06-2019, 08:09 PM   #1377
epicfilmguys epicfilmguys is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFingering View Post
As a fan of this and Returns since way back, and having owned the film on every format, my jaw was on the floor from the moment I popped this in. I shit you not I was slavering.

This is the BEST '89 has ever, ever looked. The purple in Joker's suit, the FOREST!

I'd say it's the hype getting to me and clouding my judgement, but I can't find a damn thing wrong.

I'll convince the partner to let me throw another 20 at Returns.

Regarding sound, I know how this film should sound. I recognise every inch of it like I do my...
It didn't bother me too much, but I maintain they shouldn't have played with it to begin with. Bit of a shame.

I gather Returns hasn't been tinkered with?

I mentioned it in the BR thread this morning, but they have added some minor sound effects and replaced a few here and there in the Atmos mix for Returns. Nowhere near the level of 89, but they did tamper with it.
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Old 06-06-2019, 08:10 PM   #1378
TheFingering TheFingering is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epicfilmguys View Post
I mentioned it in the BR thread this morning, but they have added some minor sound effects and replaced a few here and there in the Atmos mix for Returns. Nowhere near the level of 89, but they did tamper with it.


You know the one; if it ain't broke...
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Old 06-06-2019, 08:56 PM   #1379
Ambler1980 Ambler1980 is offline
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I'm a little cooler on the transfer than others because I don't like the original cinematography. I think it's an ugly, drab looking movie that feels cheaper than it's meant to because of that.

And I'm a huge fan of the original, as it's the first Batman I saw in theaters and one of the first VHS we owned.

I feel the cinematography in Returns is much improved and closer to Burton's visual sensibilities, which is his strong suit. The first Batman barely feels like a Burton flick. He famously had a terrible time on the production with the producers making him cry at certain points. As a result it really feels like compromised Burton, as he really wasn't that respected back then by Hollywood big wigs. It really was his baptism by fire.

So the transfer is mostly great (aside from some weird color grading inconsistencies) but it did more to reveal the film's inherently ugly cinematography for me, than make me excited about the film in 4K.
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Old 06-06-2019, 09:26 PM   #1380
Mocorongo Mocorongo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bendermac View Post
False! The 2009 Blu-ray audio needs adjustments. Was already confirmed by people who've looked into this. Same goes with the LaserDisc audio.
I meant no UHD Blu-ray needs adjustment. Haven't looked into the new 1080p Blu-rays remastered.

I am inserting all the 1080p audios from all 4 movies into all UHDs just in case movies 3 and 4 are also affected.

The above member says -167 ms are needed to sync the BD audio yet forgot to explain how he discovered that is the precise number. I am not saying he is wrong, only that either the difference is too small for me to detect or there isn't one.

For the guy saying my caps are not reliable: son, this is how these movies look like in my PC (now properly corrected with the madVR renderer) and even in my IPP 10.5:

[Show spoiler]







It's not my fault you want to blatantly lie to all members of this forum by saying there's no difference between the old BD and this 4K. And it's not OUR FAULT that Crapner wants Batman to look like it was made yesterday, making it even darker and with this obnoxious blue light. They butchered the audio and modified how the movie looks like. FACT.

Granted it looks good for the most part, however unless you need your eyes checked you will discover it's clearly inferior when compared to the old BD.

Crapner is never happy unless it can change the color from actor's clothes, the skies, unless it's changing any blue detail from a scene to green or an oversaturated tone, or anything else detrimental to the picture.

So what if looks sharp, if I put dog's poo next to a diamond it would still be a stone with shit and this devalues the product and spoils the experience.

You conveniently forgot other movies suffered from the same wrong color grading. How about you tell everyone here this isn't new? Or you are too dishonest to admit that happens...? Since you act as if I was inventing the fact these distributors love to do this.

For a true fan and a serious collector / someone that values a faithful presentation this means there is no definitive edition, considering all these changes I see no problem in having all home video releases.

It's unfortunate how there were so much expectations and these companies always manage to disappoint us somehow. I haven't seen anyone asking for a new audio mix. Why they did it? It's also a disrespect towards the people that created these sound effects.

This is the sort of thing that we need to boycott with full force, otherwise tomorrow they will start releasing colorized versions of B&W classics and giving the finger to anyone that dares asking for a proper (B&W) release. Or maybe the original aspect ratio...

Colorization has been tried decades ago when was faced with a lot of criticism. Sadly in modern times many will accept anything without questioning.

These changes made to Batman are sending a clear message, that in the future anything can be done against the source material. Anything AT ALL.

This is why physical media is dying. I thought these antics were restricted to Youtube or random forums filled with video editors trying to show off...
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