The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (1966) (50th Anniversary Edition)

[thatguamguy]

Originally Posted by murch13

But I think like anybody who has a second chance to re-evaluate their work, Leone may have made what he considered improvements.

I think that's certainly possible, and it's a reasonable interpretation, but to my mind, if Leone felt they were improvements, I don't understand why he would've left the Italian cut alone. That seems contradictory to me. Whereas it seems very common, especially in that time period, for foreign directors to willingly make cuts for the English language market as long as they can retain their original cut in their home country.

Anyway, this is a case where there's no explicit preference by the director, so it makes sense to just fall back on your own personal taste. Both arguments have legitimate points and legitimate flaws and ultimately all the English language versions will be compromised in some way. So you pick the compromise that bothers you the least and you (hopefully) don't let it affect your enjoyment of the movie!

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by murch13

I don't think there are any conclusive interviews with Leone stating his preferred cut. There is an interview where he states he personally supervised the editing of the shorter theatrical cut and approved all the trims and changes.

As for the extended version, it is close to the original Italian version but there are still differences. Originally the full beating scene was part of the cut, there are a few shots missing from Angel Eyes introduction, the scene where Blondie slides down to the skeleton in the desert was included and some of the mix is different. The scene where Tuco recruits men in the grotto was never part of any release prints.

This is my all time favorite movie, and usually more would be better but aside from it excluding the scene where Angel Eyes visits the fort, I prefer the shorter cut.

Thanks a lot, Murch. I was hoping you would come in and share your expertise on the film. I was going by what I thought I had read somewhere about Leone having fully authorized the original U.S. cut. But I made sure to add to my post that my information may not be definitive. To me the extended cut is a novelty to enjoy every so often, but the shorter cut is the masterpiece.

[aviosis]

When is the preorder going live btw? I really don't want to miss this

[murch13]

Originally Posted by thatguamguy

I think that's certainly possible, and it's a reasonable interpretation, but to my mind, if Leone felt they were improvements, I don't understand why he would've left the Italian cut alone. That seems contradictory to me. Whereas it seems very common, especially in that time period, for foreign directors to willingly make cuts for the English language market as long as they can retain their original cut in their home country.

Anyway, this is a case where there's no explicit preference by the director, so it makes sense to just fall back on your own personal taste. Both arguments have legitimate points and legitimate flaws and ultimately all the English language versions will be compromised in some way. So you pick the compromise that bothers you the least and you (hopefully) don't let it affect your enjoyment of the movie!

Unfortunately in the case of the Italian cut, over the years it has also suffered from revisionist/censor/soundtrack edits and even the versions out on blu/dvd in Italy are not Leone's cut.

[eurospec19]

Originally Posted by thatguamguy

My personal belief is that if you compare the Italian version of the torture scene and the English version of the torture scene...

Which Italian version? The full beating scene available as an extra or the edit used for Italian home releases?

[thatguamguy]

Originally Posted by eurospec19

Which Italian version? The full beating scene available as an extra or the edit used for Italian home releases?

I don't know what's on the Italian blu-ray, I had always heard it was intact but I take murch at his word that there are discrepancies. So I assume it's the full beating version that I'm talking about.

[murch13]

Originally Posted by thatguamguy

I don't know what's on the Italian blu-ray, I had always heard it was intact but I take murch at his word that there are discrepancies. So I assume it's the full beating version that I'm talking about.

The Italian beating scene in its last few appearances on Italian home video is a truncated mess, a result of the negative being damaged sometime in the 70's and them trying to hack together what's left. The uncut scene as it appears on the U.S. Blu's (as an extra) is the way it should be (for the Italian version). Aside from the aforementioned version on the U.S. blu which came from the last 1966 archive print known in Italy (which looks like it has chemical damage) we actually sourced 2 more 1966 Italian prints and had them scanned - the beating scene is uncut on both (without chemical damage) and using these two other prints you could likely restore the scene to the film in an acceptable quality. I don't argue that the longer version is better than the international shorter version, but at least it is not the truncated hacked together version currently used in Italy.

[eurospec19]

As murch13 stated above, the OCN was damaged at some point after the creation of the International Cut/US theatrical cut. As a result, a shorter edit has persisted on Italian home releases since the 80's (VHS, DVD, BD) that is crude by comparison with the US cut.

[Marksman71]

voted for the Theatrical. The changed/old voices on the extended scenes are just so poor that it really spoils the enjoyment of the film and never cared for the grotto scene, the tone of it feels like its from a different film completely

[RegressiveScan]

According to their Facebook page, looks like Kino has decided that the 4K disc will be the Theatrical Cut....

EDIT: oh, and they made a post about it on this here forum, too...

[hanshotfirst1138]

Damn. Well, can’t win’em all.

Originally Posted by MDK

Am i the only one who wants the TC on blu-ray?

Apparently not.

Damn, the old Kino BD release looks rough. If only those of use who prefer the extended cut had a choice. Of course, I’m not 4K YET, but still...

Wait, so did the last release have the proper mono track of not?!

[ps3bd_owner]

This, Once Upon a Time in the West, and Unforgiven are more or less my top three Western movies.

Needless to say this is an amazing film and a work of art, but what always gets me is that Lee Van Cleef can be the villain and I still hate to see him be shot dead.

[JimDiGriz]

Originally Posted by ps3bd_owner

This, Once Upon a Time in the West, and Unforgiven are more or less my top three Western movies.

Needless to say this is an amazing film and a work of art, but what always gets me is that Lee Van Cleef can be the villain and I still hate to see him be shot dead.

What you do then is watch For a Few Dollars More!

The Leone Westerns are my top Westerns. Even Unforgiven doesn't get close.

[KubrickKurasawa]

Check out Sabata 1 if you like LVC.

[drush9999]

For more LVC, I would recommend The Big Gundown, Death Rides a Horse & Day of Anger.