The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (1966) (50th Anniversary Edition)

[lemonski]

Originally Posted by eurospec19

Why not come out and say it then? Even their correction attempt is wrong. It's excessively green. They can still fix it though.

So says the self-appointed expert. Why don't you wait until the disc is in your hands before complaining? Or if you don't like it, just don't buy it - stick with your yellow one. What do I care, do whatever you want. You're carrying on like a pork chop based on a few screen shots.

Originally Posted by eurospec19

Like I said before the bar has been set so low for such a deserving film that people like you are grateful at any attempt to correct the botched MGM 4K "monstrosity".

"People like you" - nice.

[lemonski]

Originally Posted by AlexIlDottore

Well. what we've seen so far doesn't look very good. I know they can only do so much.

They must be working from an IB Tech print, because guesstimation is a joke.

Yet earlier in the thread someone posted their own guesstimation based on a Picasa autocolor fixup (presumably they didn't get within 50 miles of an IB Tech print) and no-one was calling that a joke. Given no-one knows exactly what KL is doing, and has seen the end result, it seems like a double standard with KL on the end of it.

[Cinema84]

As much as I love this film and dislike the yellow-tinted "restoration", I will be waiting for reviews before buying. I applaud Kino's attempt at correcting the issue (and assuming they're not completely removing the yellow) but I see no point in owning 2 copies of the film with different levels of yellow. Or have I misread the comments so far and Kino actually is removing all hints of yellow?

[AlexIlDottore]

Originally Posted by lemonski

Yet earlier in the thread someone posted their own guesstimation based on a Picasa autocolor fixup (presumably they didn't get within 50 miles of an IB Tech print) and no-one was calling that a joke. Given no-one knows exactly what KL is doing, and has seen the end result, it seems like a double standard with KL on the end of it.

Yeah, those fanpics look ok. I'm just saying that guesstimation like that, on principle is a joke and I hope that nobody here would be happy with a disc where reference is based on a fellow poster's Picasa work. Come on. Let's be serious.

No we don't know what Kino are doing. I hope that they are using proper reference materials.

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by lemonski

Yet earlier in the thread someone posted their own guesstimation based on a Picasa autocolor fixup (presumably they didn't get within 50 miles of an IB Tech print) and no-one was calling that a joke. Given no-one knows exactly what KL is doing, and has seen the end result, it seems like a double standard with KL on the end of it.

Actually, the point of my autocolor fix wasn't to show accuracy. Someone asked if the yellow could ne removed digitally. I tried, and successfully did with one click of a button. I concluded by saying if I could drastically remove the overly yellow grading with one click, that Kino could probably do better with professional tools. I specifically say my examples aren't true to source. I'm also not trying to sell my "guesstimation" to the public.

It is extremely unlikely thst Kino is using any references. They weren't even aware of the issue with the remaster until like two weeks ago, which is hard to fathom. Let's not act like Kino is doing this purely for the sake of accuracy. They merely are concerned with a loss of sales, and did a hard and fast regrade to lessen the yellow. As a result, people will buy it again, so mission accomplished. I still give them praise for trying to tackle the issue, but it's far from an ideal fix.

[AlexIlDottore]

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

They weren't even aware of the issue with the remaster until like two weeks ago

Edit. Are KINO serious? People have been pissing on the last BD since Immagine Ritrovata relieved their collective bladders.

[lemonski]

Originally Posted by AlexIlDottore

Yeah, those fanpics look ok. I'm just saying that guesstimation like that, on principle is a joke and I hope that nobody here would be happy with a disc where reference is based on a fellow poster's Picasa work. Come on. Let's be serious.

No we don't know what Kino are doing. I hope that they are using proper reference materials.

I agree 100% with both points.

[lemonski]

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

Actually, the point of my autocolor fix wasn't to show accuracy. Someone asked if the yellow could ne removed digitally. I tried, and successfully did with one click of a button. I concluded by saying if I could drastically remove the overly yellow grading with one click, that Kino could probably do better with professional tools. I specifically say my examples aren't true to source. I'm also not trying to sell my "guesstimation" to the public.

I'm not criticising your efforts at all, in fact, I found it very interesting to see how trivial it was to improve the image with an off-the-shelf tool.

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

It is extremely unlikely thst Kino is using any references.
They weren't even aware of the issue with the remaster until like two weeks ago, which is hard to fathom. Let's not act like Kino is doing this purely for the sake of accuracy. They merely are concerned with a loss of sales, and did a hard and fast regrade to lessen the yellow. As a result, people will buy it again, so mission accomplished. I still give them praise for trying to tackle the issue, but it's far from an ideal fix.

I can't get behind anything you are saying here...too many assumptions when, unless you have some inside information, you really don't know what it is KL are doing, what tools and references they are using, and what the final result looks like.

[MifuneFan]

It is speculation no doubt (I should have worded it better), but I'm basing it off their response and wording. They weren't aware of any issue at all until after they announced their release, all they knew is they were getting a transfer that was approved by someone who worked on the film. Since then, there's been nothing but complaints by members here, and surely other places.

Kino said they listened to complaints about the yellow, and have reduced it for the theatrical, providing before and after shots. It doesn't sound like they were going for accuracy to me, but merely trying to address the main issue that everyone was talking about. They mentioned no references or anything, and it would be unlikely th at they aquired IB prints or other references within the last week or so.

I'd love to be proven wrong here. MisterLime has been asked a few times already what they used as reference, and he hasn't replied to any yet. It wouldn't seem difficult to me, to simply say they're referencing a specific source, etc...if they were.

[eurospec19]

There you have it. KL is not using an IB TECH print any other source as a color reference.

MisterLime says:

"One of the main reasons we acquired THE GOOD, THE BAD & THE UGLY was to FINALLY release the beloved theatrical cut. Many of the older fans who grew up watching the original disliked and even hated the extended cut, not just because it almost ruins the masterpiece, but also because it had completely replaced the original.

We had no idea the 4K restoration had some complaints due to the overall yellowishness of the master. We decided to do our own tests and agreed that it was a bit too yellow, so we did some minor color correction to create a version we feel is closest to the prints we had all seen screened many times and we don't agree with fans who think we should've gone further to create the look of the old releases, which we felt were too blue. What we'll be releasing will be the essential Blu-ray release of the classic, it will include both cuts, include all the previously produced extras and some very cool new ones. Will everyone be 100% happy with the transfer? We hope so, but realistically we doubt it, we think most of the fans will be very happy, some may still have issues with the color, and others will just post negative comments just to get a reaction because that's what they do."

[Poya]

Prints? I hope it's the IB Tech prints.

[mogwai_macabre]

Originally Posted by eurospec19

We had no idea the 4K restoration had some complaints due to the overall yellowishness of the master.

I find that a bit puzzling.

[UpsetSmiley]

Originally Posted by eurospec19

There you have it. KL is not using an IB TECH as a color reference.

MisterLime says:

"Will everyone be 100% happy with the transfer? We hope so, but realistically we doubt it, we think most of the fans will be very happy, some may still have issues with the color, and others will just post negative comments just to get a reaction because that's what they do."

[AlexIlDottore]

Originally Posted by eurospec19

There you have it. KL is not using an IB TECH print any other source as a color reference.

MisterLime says:

"One of the main reasons we acquired THE GOOD, THE BAD & THE UGLY was to FINALLY release the beloved theatrical cut. Many of the older fans who grew up watching the original disliked and even hated the extended cut, not just because it almost ruins the masterpiece, but also because it had completely replaced the original.

We had no idea the 4K restoration had some complaints due to the overall yellowishness of the master. We decided to do our own tests and agreed that it was a bit too yellow, so we did some minor color correction to create a version we feel is closest to the prints we had all seen screened many times and we don't agree with fans who think we should've gone further to create the look of the old releases, which we felt were too blue. What we'll be releasing will be the essential Blu-ray release of the classic, it will include both cuts, include all the previously produced extras and some very cool new ones. Will everyone be 100% happy with the transfer? We hope so, but realistically we doubt it, we think most of the fans will be very happy, some may still have issues with the color, and others will just post negative comments just to get a reaction because that's what they do."

Where is this from? Are Kino seriously going from memory for their regrading? Also, industry insiders weren't aware of the piss storm created by the previous release, mastered by Immagine Ritrovata? I find that unbelievable.

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by AlexIlDottore

Where is this from? Are Kino seriously going from memory for their regrading? Also, industry insiders weren't aware of the piss storm created by the previous release, mastered by Immagine Ritrovata? I find that unbelievable.

Posted over at HTF

[AlexIlDottore]

Originally Posted by Poya

Prints? I hope it's the IB Tech prints.

Doesn't matter anyway if they're going from memory, as that posts suggests.

[AlexIlDottore]

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

Posted over at HTF

Thanks. Is there anybody over there who can point out to Mister Lime the fundamental flaw in Kino's regrading process?

[eurospec19]

Originally Posted by AlexIlDottore

Thanks. Is there anybody over there who can point out to Mister Lime the fundamental flaw in Kino's regrading process?

MisterLime was partly responding to members there who pointed out that his screenshots still showed excess green/teal and crushed blacks.

[MassiveMovieBuff]

I think Kino's main concern was getting the theatrical cut released and that would be the selling point as they pointed out in their comment making that the primary selling factor while referring to the extended cut as inferior and pretty much crappy which I completely disagree with which is why they didn't bother with color correcting until fans complained. That's mostly speculation of course but I think there's truth to it.

[yellowcakeuf6]

I liked the issue mentioned over at HTF about viewing the Technicolor Imbibition prints with Carbon Arc lighting, which would look significantly different than viewed with modern Xenon projection lightbulbs.
I would think Kino had some pull with getting an IB Tech print as a reference for their color work, but maybe not.