BBFC decisions you agree/disagree with...

[drush9999]

Anyone think the original Star Wars Trilogy would or should be a PG these days?

[chip75]

Originally Posted by McCrutchy

I'm wondering what kind of "under 15s...English class" you've been in, as it's not exactly the kind of book or movie an English class would read or watch, and I understand that UK schools would--at the very least--need parental permission for every student if they were under 15.

It's not uncommon to have 18 certificate movies shown in schools or colleges were the students are under 18. Granted it's not something that should happen, but I remember a teacher watching the door clutching the remote while we watched a film about what's acceptable for certification.

Generally teacher should explain what the content is and then ask if any pupils would like to leave (which unfortunately leaves it open for them to stay due to peer pressure).

[eddyw78]

Originally Posted by chip75

It's not uncommon to have 18 certificate movies shown in schools or colleges were the students are under 18. Granted it's not something that should happen, but I remember a teacher watching the door clutching the remote while we watched a film about what's acceptable for certification.

Generally teacher should explain what the content is and then ask if any pupils would like to leave (which unfortunately leaves it open for them to stay due to peer pressure).

I can remember having to watch Roman Polanski’s Macbeth in my English Lit class at school. I’m sure we weren’t 15 at the time

[Markgway]

Originally Posted by drush9999

Anyone think the original Star Wars Trilogy would or should be a PG these days?

I think A New Hope would be a '12'.

That arm severing is worse than anything in The Force Awakens or The Last Jedi.

[RCRochester]

Originally Posted by eddyw78

I can remember having to watch Roman Polanski’s Macbeth in my English Lit class at school. I’m sure we weren’t 15 at the time

Funny... I was thinking the exact same thing. I watched that one as well and I also don't remember having to sign any permission slips to do so either.

[eddyw78]

Originally Posted by RCRochester

Funny... I was thinking the exact same thing. I watched that one as well and I also don't remember having to sign any permission slips to do so either.

It was on a crappy pan and scan VHS tape but you could still obviously see all the gore and nudity. I can also remember not really liking it that much either it years later I now own the Criterion BD

[eddyw78]

Talking Criterion BDs has anyone mentioned Watership Down in this thread yet? I finally caved in and showed this to my 7yr old tonight after years of telling him he wasn’t quite old enough. Surely this is the strongest U certificate of all time. Dark and at times rather gorey. Still a U in the UK but would this rating still stand if re-submitted?

[drush9999]

Originally Posted by eddyw78

I can remember having to watch Roman Polanski’s Macbeth in my English Lit class at school. I’m sure we weren’t 15 at the time

Me too, think we were 13/14. Hated hated English lessons, but enjoyed the two we spent watching this.

[UpsetSmiley]

Originally Posted by McCrutchy

I'm wondering what kind of "under 15s...English class" you've been in, as it's not exactly the kind of book or movie an English class would read or watch, and I understand that UK schools would--at the very least--need parental permission for every student if they were under 15.

Let's bare in mind the BBFC also re-classified The Last of the Mohicans as a 12, I think it's fine at 15 even with the historical context teachers could still show it to pupils with parents permission. I remember watching The Faculty at school for an essay, we must've been 14, all the effing and jeffing was err, a bit awkward. It's one of those unexpectedly sweary films.

Originally Posted by drush9999

Anyone think the original Star Wars Trilogy would or should be a PG these days?

Yep, ANH and ROTH are quite strong even for what is expected at PG nowadays.

Originally Posted by chip75

It's not uncommon to have 18 certificate movies shown in schools or colleges were the students are under 18. Granted it's not something that should happen, but I remember a teacher watching the door clutching the remote while we watched a film about what's acceptable for certification.

Bang on there chip, they show some pretty grisly films like Harry Brown to 16 year olds but when you're in an educational environment surrounded by students and a lecturer, that seems contextualised to me.

Originally Posted by eddyw78

Talking Criterion BDs has anyone mentioned Watership Down in this thread yet? I finally caved in and showed this to my 7yr old tonight after years of telling him he wasn’t quite old enough. Surely this is the strongest U certificate of all time. Dark and at times rather gorey. Still a U in the UK but would this rating still stand if re-submitted?

I was going to bring up Watership Down, it's always been a heavily discussed and highly complained about work for the BBFC. They've left it at U purely because of its notoriety.
http://www.bbfc.co.uk/case-studies/a...watership-down

If they re-classified it in 2018, it'll probably be a 12 for "moderate violence, horror" Ireland rated it a 12 in 2005 for the Deluxe Edition DVD release.

[McCrutchy]

Originally Posted by eddyw78

I can remember having to watch Roman Polanski’s Macbeth in my English Lit class at school. I’m sure we weren’t 15 at the time

Originally Posted by RCRochester

Funny... I was thinking the exact same thing. I watched that one as well and I also don't remember having to sign any permission slips to do so either.

Originally Posted by eddyw78

It was on a crappy pan and scan VHS tape but you could still obviously see all the gore and nudity. I can also remember not really liking it that much either it years later I now own the Criterion BD

I have a story about this, too.

I was in some kind of World History class in Middle School (so aged 11-13). We had some kind of assignment to watch a Shakespeare play on film and write about it. I think the teacher had suggested some, but also left it to our choice.

I think I might have been getting over an illness, but whatever the reason, I didn't go to the video shop to pick one out, and my babysitter did. She came back and told me that "this was the only one they had", which I still don't know if I believe, but in any event, "the only one they had" was Roman Polanski's Macbeth.

I remember as the titles came up, I was excited by the idea that it was a Playboy production, and I think there were naked witches, which was kind of fun. However, when those naked witches placed a severed arm into the ground, any remaining excitement faded significantly. I don't remember much of the next two hours, except that Lady Macbeth had a nude scene (I have fancied Francesca Annis to this day) and that there were graphic decapitations with heads on pikes.

Needless to say, I was pretty traumatized, and I don't even remember what I wrote for the assignment. I should watch my Criterion Blu-ray, but I haven't gotten around to it, yet. Maybe part of me is afraid to relive the film.

[RCRochester]

Originally Posted by eddyw78

Talking Criterion BDs has anyone mentioned Watership Down in this thread yet? I finally caved in and showed this to my 7yr old tonight after years of telling him he wasn’t quite old enough. Surely this is the strongest U certificate of all time. Dark and at times rather gorey. Still a U in the UK but would this rating still stand if re-submitted?

Dark and gory but it's still a cartoon which softens the blow a bit. I saw it in a double feature with Bakshi's LOTR when I was about five and enjoyed them both.

Originally Posted by McCrutchy

I have a story about this, too.

I was in some kind of World History class in Middle School (so aged 11-13). We had some kind of assignment to watch a Shakespeare play on film and write about it. I think the teacher had suggested some, but also left it to our choice.

I think I might have been getting over an illness, but whatever the reason, I didn't go to the video shop to pick one out, and my babysitter did. She came back and told me that "this was the only one they had", which I still don't know if I believe, but in any event, "the only one they had" was Roman Polanski's Macbeth.

I remember as the titles came up, I was excited by the idea that it was a Playboy production, and I think there were naked witches, which was kind of fun. However, when those naked witches placed a severed arm into the ground, any remaining excitement faded significantly. I don't remember much of the next two hours, except that Lady Macbeth had a nude scene (I have fancied Francesca Annis to this day) and that there were graphic decapitations with heads on pikes.

Needless to say, I was pretty traumatized, and I don't even remember what I wrote for the assignment. I should watch my Criterion Blu-ray, but I haven't gotten around to it, yet. Maybe part of me is afraid to relive the film.

Traumatized? I suppose it all depends on our life experiences. By the time I saw Macbeth I was already weaned on 80s slasher films and action films. I found the violence and nudity to be comparatively tame, though it does admittedly have a grim mood to it.

[McCrutchy]

Originally Posted by RCRochester

Dark and gory but it's still a cartoon which softens the blow a bit. I saw it in a double feature with Bakshi's LOTR when I was about five and enjoyed them both.

Traumatized? I suppose it all depends on our life experiences. By the time I saw Macbeth I was already weaned on 80s slasher films and action films. I found the violence and nudity to be comparatively tame, though it does admittedly have a grim mood to it.

I think your life experiences may be a bit unusual. I can't imagine what I would have made of Watership Down at five years old.

And certainly, for me, it wasn't the content of Macbeth, so much as the (as I recall) unnervingly dark and depressing tone in combination with it. Even the excellent cinematography was bleak and had a kind of sour quality to it that just made the film much more than I was prepared for.

[Markgway]

Watership Down traumatised me as a child.

People think I'm joking when I say I still can't watch it.

The 'U' is madness.

Sure, it's only a cartoon, so is Fist of the North Star!

Oh, and The Last of the Mohicans was a '12' at the cinema, and only a '15' on VHS because at the time there was no video '12' classification. The BBFC are just now bringing it in line with how they always viewed it.

[UpsetSmiley]

Originally Posted by Markgway

Watership Down traumatised me as a child.

People think I'm joking when I say I still can't watch it.

The 'U' is madness.

Sure, it's only a cartoon, so is Fist of the North Star!

Oh, and The Last of the Mohicans was a '12' at the cinema, and only a '15' on VHS because at the time there was no video '12' classification. The BBFC are just now bringing it in line with how they always viewed it.

I see, didn't know that. But in that case they need to re-cert Midnight Run as a 15, since that was its original cinema rating.

[DeathlyGeneral]

Also Batman and Batman Returns are still 15 despite getting a 12 at the cinema (there was no video 12 at the time) and having a PG13 in the US. I watched these films as a 12-year old, and it never had a harmful effect on me.

[SymbioticFunction]

Originally Posted by Markgway

I think A New Hope would be a '12'.

That arm severing is worse than anything in The Force Awakens or The Last Jedi.

What do you think about 'PG' Jaws which has both severed arm and leg?

[McCrutchy]

Originally Posted by SymbioticFunction

What do you think about 'PG' Jaws which has both severed arm and leg?

I'm not Markgway, but I always thought Jaws at PG was the ultimate concession to the Americans. The idea that something so violent and realistic should be an A, which was five and over admitted, is ridiculous, and clearly an attempt to mimic the US--I'm sure if the MPAA had rated it R, which would have been pretty unlikely, it would have been AA. It wasn't given a modern classification until 1987, by which time Jaws had become a modern classic, and it clearly should have been 15 (or cut for PG) at the time. But, the film was so beloved that I think it unduly influenced the BBFC to give it a PG uncut because it kept them in line with the MPAA on a very famous film that everyone had seen anyway. See also: E.T. at U and I think a couple of the Indiana Jones movies, too. Maybe it was some kind of Spielberg effect.

It took them ages, but they finally gave it a 12A in 2012, for theatrical release. The Blu-ray is a 12 because of extras, as I recall.

[eddyw78]

Originally Posted by McCrutchy

I'm not Markgway, but I always thought Jaws at PG was the ultimate concession to the Americans. The idea that something so violent and realistic should be an A, which was five and over admitted, is ridiculous, and clearly an attempt to mimic the US--I'm sure if the MPAA had rated it R, which would have been pretty unlikely, it would have been AA. It wasn't given a modern classification until 1987, by which time Jaws had become a modern classic, and it clearly should have been 15 (or cut for PG) at the time. But, the film was so beloved that I think it unduly influenced the BBFC to give it a PG uncut because it kept them in line with the MPAA on a very famous film that everyone had seen anyway. See also: E.T. at U and I think a couple of the Indiana Jones movies, too. Maybe it was some kind of Spielberg effect.

It took them ages, but they finally gave it a 12A in 2012, for theatrical release. The Blu-ray is a 12 because of extras, as I recall.

Yes your correct, Jaws on BD is only a 12 because of the extras. If I remember correctly wasn’t the fourth Jaws film the first to be rated 15? In the triple movie set which contains 2, 3 & 4 Jaws 3 and The Revenge are both rated 12 whilst the second film is like the original a PG.

[McCrutchy]

Originally Posted by eddyw78

Yes your correct, Jaws on BD is only a 12 because of the extras. If I remember correctly wasn’t the fourth Jaws film the first to be rated 15? In the triple movie set which contains 2, 3 & 4 Jaws 3 and The Revenge are both rated 12 whilst the second film is like the original a PG.

Jaws 2 was passed A in 1978 and then PG for video in 1987.

But Jaws 3 was passed PG with cuts in 1983 and then upgraded to 15 for video in 1987, before being downgraded to 12 uncut in 2000. Oddly, it seems it might have been raised to 15 again in 2016?

The same thing happened to Jaws: The Revenge, which was passed PG with cuts in 1987 and then upgraded to 15 for video in 1988, before again being downgraded to 12 uncut in 2000.

[Martoto]

Originally Posted by DeathlyGeneral

Yeah, you don't get to complain about Shrek 2 using the word "crusade" then using it yourself in a sarcastic way. Nobody is offended except you, and the Crusades were so long ago that it's unlikely to cause much offence.

If your children ever ask what the crusades were "a big war that happened a long time ago" would do. I mean, it's the truth.

This isn't Shrek 2. Context. I've been repeatedly reminded that the people here know what crusade really means, it doesn't bother them and they don't care and they reckon most people don't know and/or don't care or are over it due to the timescale. So criticising me for using it in this context (with painfully obvious irony), after I've already explained my position, is arguably perverse and hypocritical. And it relies on the concept of a word being offensive regardless of context. (not that I'd even be offended by a word, except perhaps due to the context of its usage)

I didn't complain. I just endorsed the change and the likely reasons for doing so.

If I wanted my child to grow up ignorant I could just call it a "big war that happened". If the makers of Shrek 2 wanted to go with it being a war wound then they could have just called it "war wound".

You all keep saying I'm offended.

A) I'm not offended. Just mindful of the implications and in which context its comedic use is perhaps less than appropriate B). This wasn't cut or reclassified by the BBFC so you should all just drop it.