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Old 09-21-2021, 07:50 PM   #1501
Lee A Stewart Lee A Stewart is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediJones77 View Post
Most movies or TV is crap, under the 90% of everything is crap rule, but I would argue the percentage is much better for movies than TV. Look at this forum, all the old movies people keep buying on disc, often over and over again. How often does that happen for TV series? The Star Trek OG and Next Gen are some of the few that people will really spend money on as fans the same way they do movies.
Did it occur to you that the % of movies versus TV shows put on disc is like 10 to 1.
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Old 09-21-2021, 07:52 PM   #1502
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Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart View Post
And yet streamers pay dump trucks full of money to get shows like The Office, Friends and The Big Bang Theory on their service.

Tell me the highest amount paid for a license to show a movie. Not create a new movie - to show an old movie.
I'm sure he'll say that money paid is not an arbiter of whether a show is "good".

My problem is saying TV is more crap than movies. Certainly since the mid 2000s that is not the case. If you want to argue 70s or 80s TV, maybe yeah.
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Old 09-21-2021, 07:53 PM   #1503
Just_Discovered_3D Just_Discovered_3D is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediJones77 View Post
Most movies or TV is crap, under the 90% of everything is crap rule, but I would argue the percentage is much better for movies than TV. Look at this forum, all the old movies people keep buying on disc, often over and over again. How often does that happen for TV series? The Star Trek OG and Next Gen are some of the few that people will really spend money on as fans the same way they do movies.
Sadly fans allegedly didn't spend enough on TNG to get DS9 and VOY in U/HD.

The 90% rule needs some bounds or addendums because today's crap makes the "crap" from bygone decades seem like gold.
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Old 09-21-2021, 07:55 PM   #1504
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Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart View Post
Did it occur to you that the % of movies versus TV shows put on disc is like 10 to 1.
Because the companies learned they don't sell that well. Remember all of those TV box sets that got dumped at Big Lots? There are still quite a lot put out on disc. Heck, MacGyver is getting a Blu-ray set put out soon. It'll sell okay, maybe, but no one's going to tell you MacGyver is as high quality as Arnold, Willis and Stallone action movies from the same era.
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Old 09-21-2021, 07:57 PM   #1505
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Originally Posted by John1701D View Post
I'm sure he'll say that money paid is not an arbiter of whether a show is "good".
It is when it has been objectively proven that people want to watch them over and over.

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My problem is saying TV is more crap than movies. Certainly since the mid 2000s that is not the case. If you want to argue 70s or 80s TV, maybe yeah.
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Old 09-21-2021, 08:00 PM   #1506
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Because the companies learned they don't sell that well. Remember all of those TV box sets that got dumped at Big Lots? There are still quite a lot put out on disc. Heck, MacGyver is getting a Blu-ray set put out soon. It'll sell okay, maybe, but no one's going to tell you MacGyver is as high quality as Arnold, Willis and Stallone action movies from the same era.
They don't sell well because they are expensive to buy. Joe Sixpack votes with his wallet. Collectors vote with their emotions: "I got to have that."
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Old 09-22-2021, 01:13 AM   #1507
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart View Post
They don't sell well because they are expensive to buy. Joe Sixpack votes with his wallet. Collectors vote with their emotions: "I got to have that."
Collectors like myself should have gotten a special discount when we were buying almost everything that was being released.
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Old 09-22-2021, 03:22 AM   #1508
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We watch HBO Max probably more than any other streaming service, aside from a constantly looping re-watch of Star Trek, and maybe Disney+.

Having large swaths of the Criterion Collection (with many permanent & some seemingly rotating) is enough for me to keep my subscription; I've watched more incredible films over the past eighteen months than I can count.

Toss in great shows like Doom Patrol, His Dark Materials, Raised By Wolves, Warrior (picked up from Skinemax - New season forthcoming!!), the DC Animated Universe, Lovecraft Country (Sadly over) and all of HBO's existing content...and that's just about scratching the surface. Fantastic stuff.

Know they made some horrific gaffes in the rollout and subsequent strategy, but, I do believe they'll make it work in the long run.

Last edited by oneway23; 09-22-2021 at 03:45 AM.
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Old 09-22-2021, 07:33 AM   #1509
Just_Discovered_3D Just_Discovered_3D is offline
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Originally Posted by oneway23 View Post
We watch HBO Max probably more than any other streaming service, aside from a constantly looping re-watch of Star Trek, and maybe Disney+.

Toss in great shows like Doom Patrol, His Dark Materials, Raised By Wolves, Warrior (picked up from Skinemax - New season forthcoming!!), the DC Animated Universe, Lovecraft Country (Sadly over) and all of HBO's existing content...and that's just about scratching the surface. Fantastic stuff.
Is HBO Max streaming in full UHD HDR now? I've seen reviews mentioning that D+ is bitrate starved, is HBO Max similarly streaming at levels lower than disc?

On those shows, I can't help but think that South Park was right about streaming bringing about the balkanization of television shows as most of those shows are news to me just by their title alone. So many niche shows with next to no "zeitgeist-level" hype shows, it just doesn't seem sustainable IMO.

Quote:
Yep, those and Seinfeld and Simpsons are the handful of "hot" sitcoms that still have fan interest.
I'd quibble that Simpsons no longer has fan interest

This is part of why the niche show strategy does not seem sustainable IMO, as if these niche shows were bringing in the views then there would be no reason to shell out a king's ransom to steal these old "zeitgeist-level" shows from rival services. When a streamer is paying a king's ransom to play contractual keep-away with Seinfeld, can it even have money to keep pumping out niche shows?

Netflix in particular has been surprisingly stingy with its show budgets, with productions looking like they received Roger Corman-esque budgets but without Corman's acumen at making macrame out of a shoestring budget.

I expect that since Netflix is having these problems, so too will D+ and HBO Max etc.
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Old 09-22-2021, 11:11 AM   #1510
oneway23 oneway23 is offline
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Originally Posted by Just_Discovered_3D View Post
Is HBO Max streaming in full UHD HDR now? I've seen reviews mentioning that D+ is bitrate starved, is HBO Max similarly streaming at levels lower than disc?

On those shows, I can't help but think that South Park was right about streaming bringing about the balkanization of television shows as most of those shows are news to me just by their title alone. So many niche shows with next to no "zeitgeist-level" hype shows, it just doesn't seem sustainable IMO
I think it's only streaming 4K for the day & date releases right now. As for Disney, I've found their streaming quality to be fantastic amongst their competitors, for the most part.

I generally don't really see the point of a streaming to disc quality comparison, since you can't go and buy many of these services' programs on physical, though, as someone who used to stare themselves virtually blind doing comparisons, I completely understand how and why obsessives feel compelled to do so, and, that's fine; I know what forum I'm on, but, I'm also personally at a stage in life where streaming has crossed over the "good enough" barrier. YMMV, of course.

The "balkanization" argument has been going on for what feels like almost a decade now, and, I don't think it's really worth a "debate" anymore. It's true...You subscribe to a streaming service, FOR THE MOST PART, to watch the two or three things you really want to see, and they hope you get hooked on the rest. I will, however, disagree about a dearth of "zeitgeist-level" shows. Have you seen this past week's Emmy results?

As for the quality to crap ratio? I dunno. I'm not sitting in front of a spreadsheet of stats, but, to me, it hardly feels any different now then when we "only" had a few hundred cable channels, honestly. We're not in the 70s anymore, either, where every household was watching one of three channels. That ship has sailed. Of course nothing would feel as culturally significant on TV, in comparison, as it maybe once did, but, you still have your breakthroughs, just as you always have.

Last edited by oneway23; 09-22-2021 at 11:30 AM.
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Old 09-22-2021, 10:31 PM   #1511
Just_Discovered_3D Just_Discovered_3D is offline
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Originally Posted by oneway23 View Post
I generally don't really see the point of a streaming to disc quality comparison, since you can't go and buy many of these services' programs on physical, though
A review of Black Widow was posted here with a comparison between the 4K, 3D, and D+ versions of the film, and the reviewer mentioned that there were scenes on D+ that were very visibly bit-starved. I trust that this was a D+ issue and not an ISP issue.

Thanks for the 4K update, YouTubers have mentioned that much of HBO Max is still at 1080p, which is still 2.25x better than cable.


Quote:
I will, however, disagree about a dearth of "zeitgeist-level" shows. Have you seen this past week's Emmy results?
Not until you mentioned it, and that's something of the point. Looking at the list, I've only heard a handful of these shows mentioned in pop culture, but it is just title awareness, and many I have not heard of at all, which surprises me as I have access to, or know many who do, Netflix/HBO/Hulu/D+/Prime Video.

Zeitgeist-level shows and critical darlings are not mutually inclusive and, too often, are mutually exclusive.

Quote:
We're not in the 70s anymore, either, where every household was watching one of three channels.
Why aren't we? My understanding is that access to at least one of the major streaming services is widespread. After all, there are only two types of people nowadays: those paying for a Netflix account, and those provided with a Netflix password
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Old 09-23-2021, 01:00 AM   #1512
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I don't use Netflix, D+, HBO Max, or anything. I never subscribed to them or, in the old days, HBO, Cinemax, Showtime, etc. in my life. I have no desire to pay for content that way. So far they haven't introduced anything that I need to watch that badly to "rent" it from them. There's a lot of stuff I'd buy if they released it on disc though.

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I'd quibble that Simpsons no longer has fan interest
The 1990s seasons still do. They're considered classics. The Steamed Hams meme just blew up three years ago, and has individual YouTube videos with up to 10 million views. Also, I believe The Simpsons has been highly rated on Disney+.
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Old 09-27-2021, 01:59 PM   #1513
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Bruce Lee's Fight With WB Over Enter The Dragon Explained

https://screenrant.com/bruce-lee-ent...er-bros-fight/

While Lee was naturally enthusiastic about getting the chance to make Enter the Dragon with Warner Bros., he didn’t hesitate to fight the studio whenever he took issue with one of their decisions. In Bruce Lee: A Life by Matthew Polly, it’s explained that one of the biggest problems Lee had was the title, which was supposed to be Blood and Steel.

Eventually, Warner Bros. tried to appease Lee by scrapping Blood and Steel and going with the title, Han’s Island, which was the setting of the movie and would have been appropriate to the story; Lee remained undeterred. He received an advantage in their fight when Warner Bros. came to realize just how big Enter the Dragon was going to be.
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Old 09-27-2021, 02:25 PM   #1514
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Data Suggests Sluggish HBO Max Rollout in Europe

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Challenges affecting WarnerMedia’s rollout of the HBO Max subscription streaming service are well-documented. Most-recently, Warner cautioned that the departure of the Max app from the Amazon Prime Channels platform could see it lose 5 million subscribers.

Now, new data from Digital TV Research contends the service’s launch across Europe is being undermined by existing distribution deals HBO has with regional pay-TV distributors. Indeed, Max will have a limited impact in Western Europe, with just 3.2 million paying subs across seven countries by 2026, according to the London-based research firm.
https://www.mediaplaynews.com/data-s...out-in-europe/
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Old 09-27-2021, 02:38 PM   #1515
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Data Suggests Sluggish HBO Max Rollout in Europe



https://www.mediaplaynews.com/data-s...out-in-europe/
They really should have done an evaluation of everything they had, then attacked them all separately. Way to much changing of the tires while the vehicle is in motion. This is going to cost them again.
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Old 09-29-2021, 01:10 AM   #1516
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WarnerMedia CEO Concedes Rushed Rollout of HBO Max Day-and-Date Plan
"We should have taken the better part of a month to have over 170 conversations — which is the number of participants that are in our 2021 film slate," Jason Kilar said at the Code Conference.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/bu...4c9ce9541f3e30

WarnerMedia CEO Jason Kilar said he rushed the process of communicating his decision to place Warner’s 2021 film slate on HBO Max and should’ve taken “the better part of a month” to speak with the more than 170 individuals impacted by his decision.

“I will be the first one to say, and the responsibility rests on my shoulders, that, in hindsight, we should have taken the better part of a month to have over 170 conversations — which is the number of participants that are in our 2021 film slate,” Kilar said on Tuesday at Vox Media’s Code Conference. “We tried to do that in a compressed period of time, less than a week, because of course there was going to be leaks there was going to be everybody opining on whether we should do this or not do this.”
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Old 09-29-2021, 01:16 AM   #1517
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Originally Posted by mwynn View Post
WarnerMedia CEO Concedes Rushed Rollout of HBO Max Day-and-Date Plan
"We should have taken the better part of a month to have over 170 conversations — which is the number of participants that are in our 2021 film slate," Jason Kilar said at the Code Conference.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/bu...4c9ce9541f3e30

WarnerMedia CEO Jason Kilar said he rushed the process of communicating his decision to place Warner’s 2021 film slate on HBO Max and should’ve taken “the better part of a month” to speak with the more than 170 individuals impacted by his decision.

“I will be the first one to say, and the responsibility rests on my shoulders, that, in hindsight, we should have taken the better part of a month to have over 170 conversations — which is the number of participants that are in our 2021 film slate,” Kilar said on Tuesday at Vox Media’s Code Conference. “We tried to do that in a compressed period of time, less than a week, because of course there was going to be leaks there was going to be everybody opining on whether we should do this or not do this.”
And yet, they're not the ones getting sued....
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Old 09-29-2021, 01:17 AM   #1518
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And yet, they're not the ones getting sued....
Pretty funny huh.
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Old 09-29-2021, 01:20 AM   #1519
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Pretty funny huh.
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Old 09-29-2021, 01:35 AM   #1520
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Or maybe they were and no one leaked it to the press to get those public brownie points.
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