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Old 09-20-2019, 10:35 AM   #17841
RefractiveIndex RefractiveIndex is online now
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French court rules Steam games must be able to be resold

This is going to have massive ramifications for the sale of all digital goods in the EU if unsuccessfully appealed including iTunes and other EST storefronts.

If reselling digital films undercuts the studios and storefronts badly enough then we may see studios having a lot less enthusiasm for digital film sales in the future.

I know you could say the same about selling used physical media, but there is a big difference when you can dump your entire digital collection onto the marketplace with a few clicks along with the fact that digital films can often be brought very cheap or through free codes and this could devalue the sale of new purchases tremendously. Of course, this is just speculating, but this could get very interesting indeed.
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Old 09-20-2019, 11:25 AM   #17842
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Originally Posted by RefractiveIndex View Post
French court rules Steam games must be able to be resold

This is going to have massive ramifications for the sale of all digital goods in the EU if unsuccessfully appealed including iTunes and other EST storefronts.

If reselling digital films undercuts the studios and storefronts badly enough then we may see studios having a lot less enthusiasm for digital film sales in the future.

I know you could say the same about selling used physical media, but there is a big difference when you can dump your entire digital collection onto the marketplace with a few clicks along with the fact that digital films can often be brought very cheap or through free codes and this could devalue the sale of new purchases tremendously. Of course, this is just speculating, but this could get very interesting indeed.
I don't expect the same laws to ever be enacted in the United States. But the ability to resell digital content doesn't fix the biggest issue anyway: content can be removed or modified at any time.

I won't be surprised if being able to resell content actually exacerbates things. If digital content is devalued by a "used market" then profits will drop and the studios, publishers, and stores will be even more likely to drop their old titles that aren't selling well anymore. Being able to buy "used" digital content doesn't help if official support is still needed to be able to watch that content.

No laws require that any company has to continue supporting their unprofitable products forever (nor should they). That's why my stance has been very firm: I don't think that any company should have to continue providing support for any of their products that are no longer selling but I won't buy anything that requires continued support to function either. For the foreseeable future only physical media can fulfill that requirement.
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Old 09-20-2019, 11:57 AM   #17843
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Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity View Post
I don't expect the same laws to ever be enacted in the United States. But the ability to resell digital content doesn't fix the biggest issue anyway: content can be removed or modified at any time.
That's right. The Paris courts are ruling that it's illegal to stop the resale of licenses, the usual downsides to "buying" digital still apply regardless of the license being passed from another user or brought from the storefront vendor.

You're likely correct about the legal situation in the US, but some digital storefronts like Steam may find it difficult to run different sale systems in multiple markets and may end up rolling out changes to everyone as they did with refunds. Whatever they do it will complicate things tremendously and change the digital landscape forever. We will probably see a huge push towards subscription services and move away from digital sales altogether, especially for films and tv sales.

Quote:
I won't be surprised if being able to resell content actually exacerbates things. If digital content is devalued by a "used market" then profits will drop and the studios, publishers, and stores will be even more likely to drop their old titles that aren't selling well anymore. Being able to buy "used" digital content doesn't help if official support is still needed to be able to watch that content.
I think we'll see the price of digital new releases being jacked up to compensate for the loss of future used sales. This could be a boon to physical media because there's a lot of people who buy digital new release films only because the new release prices are cheaper. Take away the price advantage and buying physical media is going to look a lot more attractive again for the budget-minded folk.

As far as homes sales of films are concerned it would amusing to see the big studios suddenly get cozy with physical media again. Maybe we'll see studios releasing new films on physical first instead of digital to discourage people from buying digital. Perhaps the end of digital codes as well.
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Old 09-20-2019, 03:08 PM   #17844
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Originally Posted by Steedeel View Post
To be fair, I did reply at the time he posted. The only reason I brought it up is that I had been reading a film magazine and the article was an interview with Brad Pitt. I posted several times a week ago.

Also, the interview (in the link I provided) matched up (in my opinion) with what I have been saying about two hour films becoming too much of a challenge for attention deficit youngsters Possibly. That is very significant and s major potential issue.

For me, it will be very telling to see the box office numbers for next year. We don’t have many Marvel films (if any) and no Star Wars. In other words, is it just superhero fanatics that are propping up the business and will it lose millions when they are not available? Its only going to be one year but it will be interesting.

I bring this up because Pitt also alluded to the huge tent pole/event movies and how the middle budget films seem to ha e been squeezed out of the picture. (No pun intended). I think that middle area is where a lot of the creative irk comes from. With a fair budget, the film makers can project their vision and back it up with a great story. The trend though, is just big big big and it doesn’t seem sustainable to me over many years.

I think Pitt also wondered if we go all out with streaming or do people still want the communal big screen as well in the future? He brought up some very good points (as I have done) but he is a mega rich film actor and I am a guy from the North East Of England lol. He won't be mocked for his comments, I will. It’s a strange world.
The attention spans of youngsters are just fine; human attention spans have been proven to be unchanged, to even slightly improved, by scientists across the world despite the obstinate insistence otherwise by recalcitrant crackpots like yourself. You have the incredible hubris to repeatedly say that the global scientific community is absolutely wrong and that you, with no qualifications whatsoever, know better. This is one of the reasons why you get mocked; because you ignore proven facts unless they suit your "all is lost" paranoia.

You routinely criticize millenials and worse you pretend to be qualified to diagnose their cognitive function when all they are guilty of is enjoying their phones more than you do. You seem to think that every time a millenial watches a vertically framed short subject on their phone, a movie production gets scrapped. The irony is that you are blaming millenials for killing movies when they are a major demographic attending the cinema.

Spending on home video entertainment has been increasing for years and box office receipts have been growing right along with them. It won't matter what next year's box office receipts show because you will twist the results to fit your apocalyptic vision regardless as you have with all of the preceding year's results. If box office receipts are up next year, you will say it is their "last gasp" before the inevitable plunge. If they drop any amount at all, it will be the falling pebble that heralds the annihilating avalanche. Either outcome will "prove" your feverish nightmares. With you, all roads lead inexorably to hell.

Brad Pitt's musings are entirely unlike your "everything is doomed" rants. He thinks the way that movies are being made and delivered are changing; you think they are in mortal danger. Brad Pitt also admits that he could be wrong about his concerns whereas you can not even imagine being wrong. In short, Brad Pitt is being rational while you are being entirely irrational. You're dead certain that we are all hopelessly screwed and believe that we should all spend every waking moment dreading tomorrow. You go ahead and be a little frightened bunny; the rest of us have much better things to do.

It is not just your baseless fear for the future of movies that causes you to be ridiculed, but it is the context of that fear among all of your other ludicrous worries that make you a comedic punching bag. You predict the end of damn near everything from movies to TVs themselves along with the creation of imaginary taxes that penalize us for sitting too long. You vilify everyone from millenials to vegans in bringing this unavoidable disaster upon us. These are some of the many reasons why you get laughed at far and wide.

You even predicted that I would abandon physical media because I redeemed a few digital codes- codes that came with my disc purchases. When I rented a movie from Vudu, you said the same thing, that I would no longer buy discs, even though I then bought that very movie on 4K disc. Since that rental I have bought more than 300 discs. This alone proves that you can't predict sh*t.

Last edited by Vilya; 09-20-2019 at 04:33 PM.
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Old 09-20-2019, 03:52 PM   #17845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RefractiveIndex View Post
French court rules Steam games must be able to be resold

This is going to have massive ramifications for the sale of all digital goods in the EU if unsuccessfully appealed including iTunes and other EST storefronts.

If reselling digital films undercuts the studios and storefronts badly enough then we may see studios having a lot less enthusiasm for digital film sales in the future.

I know you could say the same about selling used physical media, but there is a big difference when you can dump your entire digital collection onto the marketplace with a few clicks along with the fact that digital films can often be brought very cheap or through free codes and this could devalue the sale of new purchases tremendously. Of course, this is just speculating, but this could get very interesting indeed.
I find this news to be greatly amusing. I would like to see this decision upheld and expanded to include all digital content and for it to become the law globally. I feel that purchases should include the right to resell the item.

It will be fun to see if this court decision has any legs and where it goes with them or whether an appellate court cuts this decision off at the knees.

Last edited by Vilya; 09-20-2019 at 03:57 PM.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:15 PM   #17846
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Originally Posted by Vilya View Post
I find this news to be greatly amusing. I would like to see this decision upheld and expanded to include all digital content and for it to become the law globally. I feel that purchases should include the right to resell the item.

It will be fun to see if this court decision has any legs and where it goes with them or whether an appellate court cuts this decision off at the knees.
Valve: "a sale is actually a 'subscription' to a product".
Paris High Court: "nope".
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:23 PM   #17847
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Ever since Star Wars came out there has been a summer blockbuster that’s taken its place. So I think the box office is going to be just fine without them
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:26 PM   #17848
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Originally Posted by RefractiveIndex View Post
Valve: "a sale is actually a 'subscription' to a product".
Paris High Court: "nope".
If it is a subscription or a lease, then it should be clearly labelled as such and it should include the length of time that it lasts.

Purchase implies ownership and ownership allows the buyer to dispose of that purchase by reselling it if they so choose. I hope the decision sticks if for no other reason than to see digital content providers squirm a little; it would establish a precedent that could spread to all digital content and beyond France.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:30 PM   #17849
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Originally Posted by The_Donster View Post
Ever since Star Wars came out there has been a summer blockbuster that’s taken its place. So I think the box office is going to be just fine without them
The point is, the biggest earners by far were all Marvel. Feel free to bookmark this post, I know I am.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:35 PM   #17850
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vilya View Post
The attention spans of youngsters are just fine; human attention spans have been proven to be unchanged, to even slightly improved, by scientists across the world despite the obstinate insistence otherwise by recalcitrant crackpots like yourself. You have the incredible hubris to repeatedly say that the global scientific community is absolutely wrong and that you, with no qualifications whatsoever, know better. This is one of the reasons why you get mocked; because you ignore proven facts unless they suit your "all is lost" paranoia.

You routinely criticize millenials and worse you pretend to be qualified to diagnose their cognitive function when all they are guilty of is enjoying their phones more than you do. You seem to think that every time a millenial watches a vertically framed short subject on their phone, a movie production gets scrapped. The irony is that you are blaming millenials for killing movies when they are a major demographic attending the cinema.

Spending on home video entertainment has been increasing for years and box office receipts have been growing right along with them. It won't matter what next year's box office receipts show because you will twist the results to fit your apocalyptic vision regardless as you have with all of the preceding year's results. If box office receipts are up next year, you will say it is their "last gasp" before the inevitable plunge. If they drop any amount at all, it will be the falling pebble that heralds the annihilating avalanche. Either outcome will "prove" your feverish nightmares. With you, all roads lead inexorably to hell.

Brad Pitt's musings are entirely unlike your "everything is doomed" rants. He thinks the way that movies are being made and delivered are changing; you think they are in mortal danger. Brad Pitt also admits that he could be wrong about his concerns whereas you can not even imagine being wrong. In short, Brad Pitt is being rational while you are being entirely irrational. You're dead certain that we are all hopelessly screwed and believe that we should all spend every waking moment dreading tomorrow. You go ahead and be a little frightened bunny; the rest of us have much better things to do.

It is not just your baseless fear for the future of movies that causes you to be ridiculed, but it is the context of that fear among all of your other ludicrous worries that make you a comedic punching bag. You predict the end of damn near everything from movies to TVs themselves along with the creation of imaginary taxes that penalize us for sitting too long. You vilify everyone from millenials to vegans in bringing this unavoidable disaster upon us. These are some of the many reasons why you get laughed at far and wide.

You even predicted that I would abandon physical media because I redeemed a few digital codes- codes that came with my disc purchases. When I rented a movie from Vudu, you said the same thing, that I would no longer buy discs, even though I then bought that very movie on 4K disc. Since that rental I have bought more than 300 discs. This alone proves that you can't predict sh*t.
Brad Pitt is concerned that movies won’t survive. He said that in one of his most recent interviews. He believes they may have simply ‘run their course’.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:37 PM   #17851
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Brad Pitt is concerned that movies won’t survive. He said that in one of his most recent interviews. He believes they may have simply ‘run their course’.
Then I guess Brad Pitt is stupid too. Is that the response you were looking for?
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:38 PM   #17852
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Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity View Post
Then I guess Brad Pitt is stupid too. Is that the response you were looking for?
No, his concerns are genuine and intelligent. Like mine.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:40 PM   #17853
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Originally Posted by Steedeel View Post
The point is, the biggest earners by far were all Marvel. Feel free to bookmark this post, I know I am.
It doesn't matter. No matter what happens, you will still insist that the end is nigh. It is your mantra.

No one and nothing can convince you of anything; you have the world ending and you will predict this until the day you die.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:42 PM   #17854
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It doesn't matter. No matter what happens, you will still insist that the end is nigh. It is your mantra.

No one and nothing can convince you of anything; you have the world ending and you will predict this until the day you die.
Especially since he now believes that the almighty Brad Pitt shares his concerns.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:44 PM   #17855
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No, his concerns are genuine and intelligent. Like mine.
I do not think I have ever seen anyone, other than you, describe your "concerns" as being "intelligent." It is a telltale sign of delusion when you cite yourself as proof. Insisting that everyone else is wrong is still another such sign.

I'd love to read any quotes from any member, besides you, that has ever described your paranoid ramblings as "intelligent." I will make a donation to special education programs for each one.

Last edited by Vilya; 09-20-2019 at 04:55 PM.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:45 PM   #17856
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Especially since he now believes that the almighty Brad Pitt shares his concerns.
It is kinda nice that he can see more than just imaginary threats; now he has an imaginary ally, too, his very own "Harvey."
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:50 PM   #17857
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But that’s just it, he’s not concerned Steedeel
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:52 PM   #17858
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Especially since he now believes that the almighty Brad Pitt shares his concerns.
Unless that was a clone speaking, he does.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:53 PM   #17859
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Especially since he now believes that the almighty Brad Pitt shares his concerns.
I would take the opinion of a guy who works slap bang in the middle of the business over yours, no offence.
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Old 09-20-2019, 04:54 PM   #17860
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But that’s just it, he’s not concerned Steedeel
You know this how? He must be reasonably concerned to bring up the subject amongst filmmaker friends? Or bring up the same s he t in several different interviews. He has absolutely expressed concern about some of the classics disappearing from the public conscious.
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