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Old 01-15-2020, 03:35 PM   #21
Geoff D Geoff D is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StarWarsIsAwesome123 View Post
You're probably right, but I just don't really understand why the film is DNR'd so much. Everyone says it's to match the digital look of II and III, but the majority of this movie is made up of digital effects, basically just the actors were shot on film. The only grain would be from those shots and should be fine enough not to be obtrusive.
IMO it got a grain reduction pass as part of the 3D conversion, only they didn't bother to regrain it when they prepared the 2D version and we've been stuck with it ever since.
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Old 01-20-2020, 08:25 PM   #22
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IMO it got a grain reduction pass as part of the 3D conversion, only they didn't bother to regrain it when they prepared the 2D version and we've been stuck with it ever since.
That sounds about right, since the same thing happened to T2. I watched the Blu Ray of Phantom Menace over the weekend and yikes, the DNR is awful. I expect the 20+ yrs old 1080p CGI won't look great so I wasn't expecting much there (didn't look good on DVD or in the theater for 3d), but the waxy faces gave me flashbacks to the new T2 Blu Ray. Hopefully the new Ep 1 Blu Ray/UHD looks better.

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Old 01-20-2020, 09:09 PM   #23
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They ought to just use the light grain layer that's on Revenge of the Sith on the Phantom Menace release. We'd all sleep better at night.
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Old 01-20-2020, 09:14 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kchrules View Post
That sounds about right, since the same thing happened to T2. I watched the Blu Ray of Phantom Menace over the weekend and yikes, the DNR is awful. I expect the 20+ yrs old 1080p CGI won't look great so I wasn't expecting much there (didn't look good on DVD or in the theater for 3d), but the waxy faces gave me flashbacks to the new T2 Blu Ray. Hopefully the new Ep 1 Blu Ray/UHD looks better.
Yup, I said the same thing a few years ago: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...e#post14501326
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Old 01-21-2020, 02:48 AM   #25
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IMO it got a grain reduction pass as part of the 3D conversion, only they didn't bother to regrain it when they prepared the 2D version and we've been stuck with it ever since.
Yeah, I was hoping Disney would have put more effort into remastering the films. For the prequels they clearly just took the existing masters used for the Blu-Rays and gave them an HDR pass. And the originals are from Lucas' 2012 4k remasters, so Disney really didn't do much. I wasn't expecting my Ultimate Box Set pipe dream with brand new 4K scans of every version of each film, but I'm thinking this is yet another stop-gap release before we eventually get something a bit more definitive.
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Old 01-21-2020, 02:52 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorheadache95 View Post
Yeah, I was hoping Disney would have put more effort into remastering the films. For the prequels they clearly just took the existing masters used for the Blu-Rays and gave them an HDR pass. And the originals are from Lucas' 2012 4k remasters, so Disney really didn't do much. I wasn't expecting my Ultimate Box Set pipe dream with brand new 4K scans of every version of each film, but I'm thinking this is yet another stop-gap release before we eventually get something a bit more definitive.
Wanna bet on it?
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Old 01-21-2020, 01:41 PM   #27
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Quote:
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Wanna bet on it?
Yeah, with Lucas out of the picture this may be the most definitive set we're going to get. I hope not, but logic dictates that it probably will be.
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Old 01-21-2020, 02:13 PM   #28
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Wanna bet on it?
We will get exactly what is currently on Disney+, but with higher bitrates.
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Old 01-21-2020, 02:35 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HD Goofnut View Post
Yeah, with Lucas out of the picture this may be the most definitive set we're going to get. I hope not, but logic dictates that it probably will be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrcorwin3 View Post
We will get exactly what is currently on Disney+, but with higher bitrates.
I know. That's what I'm saying.
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Old 01-21-2020, 03:36 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorheadache95 View Post
Yeah, I was hoping Disney would have put more effort into remastering the films. For the prequels they clearly just took the existing masters used for the Blu-Rays and gave them an HDR pass. And the originals are from Lucas' 2012 4k remasters, so Disney really didn't do much. I wasn't expecting my Ultimate Box Set pipe dream with brand new 4K scans of every version of each film, but I'm thinking this is yet another stop-gap release before we eventually get something a bit more definitive.
Yes but we hadn't actually SEEN those 2012 4K restorations before now, so I don't understand why people are being so blasť about them. They're getting on a bit for sure and apparently still have some of Lowry's tell-tale signatures (sharpening, frozen grain) but the Lowry of 2012 was not the same as the Lowry of 2004 that shat out the prior HD transfer, so despite their flaws I can't wait to see them in 4K, I really can't.

And LFL dont really do "stop gaps", as once they've done a transfer of something then that's pretty much it for a decade or so, it'll get rinsed in various repackages with maybe a few tweaks if it appears on another format. But as 4K is the last stop on the physical media train and as they already have serviceable (if not incredibly outstanding) 4K transfers then I can't see them revisiting the OT any time soon, I mean it took 15 years for the garish 2004 transfers to finally be superceded (though I can't wait to drink the sweet tears of people who'll moan that the old Blu-rays looked sharper and more colourful than the 4K Blu-rays do).

As for the actual prequels though then yeah, I think Disnee have taken the shortest cut possible and haven't even bothered going back to the digital files to do a new 'capture' (yes, even with TPM as the highest quality source for the vast majority of the *finished* film is the 2K master tapes, not any kind of camera negative), they've just upscaled the 2011 masters. I do still want to see them though.
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Old 01-21-2020, 03:48 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post
As for the actual prequels though then yeah, I think Disnee have taken the shortest cut possible and haven't even bothered going back to the digital files to do a new 'capture' (yes, even with TPM as the highest quality source for the vast majority of the *finished* film is the 2K master tapes, not any kind of camera negative), they've just upscaled the 2011 masters.
I'm confused- if not "the digital files", what, then, are these "2011 masters"?
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Old 01-21-2020, 03:55 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post
And LFL dont really do "stop gaps", as once they've done a transfer of something then that's pretty much it for a decade or so, it'll get rinsed in various repackages with maybe a few tweaks if it appears on another format. But as 4K is the last stop on the physical media train and as they already have serviceable (if not incredibly outstanding) 4K transfers then I can't see them revisiting the OT any time soon, I mean it took 15 years for the garish 2004 transfers to finally be superceded (though I can't wait to drink the sweet tears of people who'll moan that the old Blu-rays looked sharper and more colourful than the 4K Blu-rays do).
Yeah, this version of the OT is likely the last we'll ever see of it on physical media. Unless we ever get the unaltered versions, which I don't think will ever happen (and if it does, it won't be anytime soon).

As for TPM -- I haven't seen the Disney+ version but I'm hopeful that HDR can improve the transfer enough that the DNR is easier to overlook. Maybe if it was a more well-liked movie, more effort would've been put in to undo the DNR. But I guess if the OT can't get the respect it deserves, then TPM never stood a chance.
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Old 01-21-2020, 04:00 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctorossi View Post
I'm confused- if not "the digital files", what, then, are these "2011 masters"?
The digital files + DNR + color grading etc.
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Old 01-21-2020, 04:05 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koberulz View Post
The digital files + DNR + color grading etc.
Ah- of course. Thank you.
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Old 01-21-2020, 04:26 PM   #35
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Yeah, I meant returning to the OG digital 'negative' files and not just the capture of it that they did in 2011. Same thing with how Shout did a new capture from the DI for their release of Snyder's Dawn of the Dead and it resulted in a less sharpened and more finely detailed image than the existing 'transfer': https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&...108916&i=2&l=0. It's also got more dynamic range too: https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&...08926&i=11&l=0
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Old 01-21-2020, 11:17 PM   #36
motorheadache95 motorheadache95 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post
Yes but we hadn't actually SEEN those 2012 4K restorations before now, so I don't understand why people are being so blasť about them. They're getting on a bit for sure and apparently still have some of Lowry's tell-tale signatures (sharpening, frozen grain) but the Lowry of 2012 was not the same as the Lowry of 2004 that shat out the prior HD transfer, so despite their flaws I can't wait to see them in 4K, I really can't.

And LFL dont really do "stop gaps", as once they've done a transfer of something then that's pretty much it for a decade or so, it'll get rinsed in various repackages with maybe a few tweaks if it appears on another format. But as 4K is the last stop on the physical media train and as they already have serviceable (if not incredibly outstanding) 4K transfers then I can't see them revisiting the OT any time soon, I mean it took 15 years for the garish 2004 transfers to finally be superceded (though I can't wait to drink the sweet tears of people who'll moan that the old Blu-rays looked sharper and more colourful than the 4K Blu-rays do).

As for the actual prequels though then yeah, I think Disnee have taken the shortest cut possible and haven't even bothered going back to the digital files to do a new 'capture' (yes, even with TPM as the highest quality source for the vast majority of the *finished* film is the 2K master tapes, not any kind of camera negative), they've just upscaled the 2011 masters. I do still want to see them though.
Don't get me wrong-- I've checked out the films on Disney+, and the 4K transfers blow away the Blu-Ray transfers. I just feel like, similar to how initially Disney didn't touch those remasters for a few years and just repackaged the old 2004 transfers a couple more times, they did it again for the UHD release, as the work had pretty much been done pre-sale (aside from doing the HDR pass, I'm guessing).

And by stop-gap, I mean that the UHD transfers will be good, but not so good that there isn't room for improvement. I mean, it's Star Wars, they must be thinking how they'll be able to sell them again 10-12 years down the line, maybe finally with that pipe-dream set we've all thought about. Or maybe by then it will be some 12K holocube format or whatever
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Old 01-21-2020, 11:44 PM   #37
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I'm less bummed about the other two, but having a high quality 4K release of TPM would have been really cool. Despite the many faults of the movie, I have a lot of nostalgia for it and it has one of the best fight scenes in the franchise.

It would be great if it turned out that new 4K versions of the prequels were not ready in time for Disney+ and those were just something they quickly threw together so they could say they had them all in 4K at launch. And we're getting new actual remasters on disc. I'm sure that won't be the case though.
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Old 01-22-2020, 01:10 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrcorwin3 View Post
We will get exactly what is currently on Disney+, but with higher bitrates.
And that explains why 4k streaming on Disney+ can look better than a 52GB file of 4K77.
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Old 01-22-2020, 07:33 AM   #39
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The best Star Wars movie IMO.
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Old 01-22-2020, 08:58 AM   #40
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And that explains why 4k streaming on Disney+ can look better than a 52GB file of 4K77.


Quote:
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The best Star Wars movie IMO.
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