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Old 12-31-2019, 02:02 AM   #181
kurtis21 kurtis21 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sad Turtle View Post
I have a quick question and apologize in advance if has been answered, I looked it up and have not been able to find it. I have a xbox one x and had a 65 inch curved Samsung, when I played 4k movies it would skip. I thought it was because the tv did not support HDR. I just got the Sony 85 inch 950g and tried to watch Aladdin last night and it was still skipping. Am I doing something wrong, frustrating after spending 4k on a 4k tv and not being able to watch it
Being you spent all of that money on a great tv...I would get a dedicated 4K player...and not use the Xbox One X! Just my suggestion!
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Old 12-31-2019, 02:18 AM   #182
Sad Turtle Sad Turtle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kurtis21 View Post
Being you spent all of that money on a great tv...I would get a dedicated 4K player...and not use the Xbox One X! Just my suggestion!
Yes that’s what I’m going to do. Just driving me nuts that it keeps skipping
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Old 02-27-2020, 09:25 PM   #183
Staying Salty Staying Salty is offline
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Default Added reviews to the Dolby Vision and HDR10 OPs

Where can I find Dolby Vision 4K BD Reviews by Geoff D (FAQ)

. No new DV reviews

Where can I find HDR10 4K BD Reviews by Geoff D (FAQ)

. Aladdin 4K UHD (2019)

. Easy Rider 4K UHD (1969) (50th Anniversary Edition)
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Old 03-14-2020, 01:19 AM   #184
Staying Salty Staying Salty is offline
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Default Added reviews to the Dolby Vision and HDR10 OPs

Where can I find Dolby Vision 4K BD Reviews by Geoff D (FAQ)

. Doctor Sleep 4K UHD (2019)

Where can I find HDR10 4K BD Reviews by Geoff D (FAQ)

. Color Out of Space 4K UHD (2019) (SDR only)

Last edited by Staying Salty; 03-14-2020 at 08:48 PM.
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Old 03-14-2020, 12:11 PM   #185
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Salty: Color Out of Space has no HDR at all, it's SDR.
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Old 03-25-2020, 09:35 PM   #186
Staying Salty Staying Salty is offline
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Smile More tone mapping explanation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post
As for the tone mapping question re: Aquaman, here's a more long winded explanation as to why it seems much brighter with the Panny doing the mapping. As a piece of HDR software Aquaman is VERY bright, with a maximum peak light level of 3241 nits and a maximum frame average brightness of 902 nits. Both of those figures are huge.

When a TV maps this stuff down it can do it in several ways: it can clip the brightness range past a certain pre-defined point relative to what the TV's brightness can handle, this will preserve average brightness (APL for short) but clip the highlights, making them look blown out. Or it can squash down the entire available range into what the TV can handle, this will preserve the highlight information but can drastically affect APL brightness depending on the content. Or it can present the image untouched up to what the pre-defined range is and then tone map the rest, this is what the Panasonic Optimiser does and this preserves both the APL and the highlight detail (though itself is not a perfect panacea to solve all HDR ills).

So Intelli, what your TV was doing previously to Aquaman's very bright imagery was map it down on a more global level, squashing the whole range to keep the highlights but reducing the APL too. This isn't a problem with Aquaman in itself because it's SO bright to begin with, you can throw some away and still have it 'pop', but when this kind of tone mapping does it to something that already has a very low APL in the 100-200 range - so almost SDR-style average brightness - then it can look very dull, dim and dark. I mention this mainly w/ref to Filmfan73's struggles with Pet Sematary, that HDR grade has got some excellent highlight expansion in HDR but not a massive boost in APL so the tone mapping on his display is killing it, i.e. taking what is already SDR-esque and collapsing it further (which is something that the Optimiser itself can do nothing about, though he could try it with the 350-nit or 500-nit Optimiser modes to see if sending the different metadata to his TV makes it map it any more intelligently).

Okay, so, get back to the point: why is the Optimiser mode making Aquaman seem so much brighter than before then on the Samsung TV? Because unlike the TV's internal tone mapping it's preserving most or all of that very high APL which is what gives Aquaman in particular such a superficially bright, zingy appearance (even though the actual amount of dynamic range isn't all that wide-ranging). The next question might be "but hang on, the tone mapping on my TV is still active so how comes it's not squashing it down regardless then?", and the answer is that when you engage the Optimiser you're also sending different metadata to the TV, so instead of 4000-nit mastering display level, 3241 MaxCLL and 902 MaxFALL it sends out 1000-nit mastering display level, 1000 MaxCLL and 800 MaxFALL on the 'Middle/High Brightness' setting. In other words, it's not receiving a signal that's anywhere near as SUPER bright as it was before so it's not tone mapping it as aggressively.

You're then thinking "but if it's not as bright, then how comes it's brighter than before?" but it's because of the two different tone mapping approaches, squashing the whole range vs preserving what you can 'natively' and mapping the remainder. If we have a TV that does 1000 nits and play something with peak brightness of 3000 nits and average brightness of 900 nits and it tone maps the whole range to fit the 1000-nit display then it will reduce everything by a third on a global level, more or less: peak brightness becomes 1000 nits and average brightness becomes 300 nits (and we can now appreciate why something with very low average brightness can be so badly damaged, if maximum APL is at 67 nits already e.g. Goodfellas then reducing that by two thirds would be disastrously dim). But if the processing can preserve the image up until the point where the TV can't go any higher and then tone maps the rest, then on this 1000-nit TV it will retain the 900-nit average brightness while the highlights will still peak at 1000 nits. Makes sense?
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Old 03-25-2020, 10:05 PM   #187
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I bought a Sony 4K UHD Player UBP-X700 today for my first 4K player.

I have had an LG brand 4K television (Model # 49UF6700-UC) for years, but it's an older one that doesn't have seem to have HDR (High Dynamic Range), and I have been using a standard Blu-ray player with it (which looks great, so I was not in a hurry to upgrade).

I turned on the HDMI Ultra HD Deep Color option for my LG just now, so that should help out a bit until I get a newer 4K television with full HDR capabilities.

I tested a 4K disc (1917) earlier, and the disclaimer came up that, in order to get the full effect of my 4K player, I needed HDR setup. That was before I turned on the HDMI Ultra HD Deep Color on my television, so I'll see what happens soon.
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Old 03-25-2020, 10:51 PM   #188
IntelliVolume IntelliVolume is offline
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Old 03-26-2020, 10:39 AM   #189
mrtickleuk mrtickleuk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staying Salty View Post
Hehe. I know what you mean but it was an excellent post, explaining something which is very complicated as clearly as you could reasonably expect. I know my attempt would have been much longer! These are not simple matters
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Old 03-26-2020, 11:05 AM   #190
The Great Owl The Great Owl is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Great Owl View Post
I bought a Sony 4K UHD Player UBP-X700 today for my first 4K player.

I have had an LG brand 4K television (Model # 49UF6700-UC) for years, but it's an older one that doesn't have seem to have HDR (High Dynamic Range), and I have been using a standard Blu-ray player with it (which looks great, so I was not in a hurry to upgrade).

I turned on the HDMI Ultra HD Deep Color option for my LG just now, so that should help out a bit until I get a newer 4K television with full HDR capabilities.

I tested a 4K disc (1917) earlier, and the disclaimer came up that, in order to get the full effect of my 4K player, I needed HDR setup. That was before I turned on the HDMI Ultra HD Deep Color on my television, so I'll see what happens soon.
I watched Jumanji: The Next Level as my first 4K UHD disc on my above setup last night.

My HDR converts to SDR with my older LG television with the HDMI Ultra HD Deep Color option turned on, but there's still a noticeable improvement in detail with the 4K UHD presentation over the standard Blu-ray, which I also sampled.

There's a good bit more “oomph” with the detail, and I did not notice any strange color schemes with the HDR>SDR conversion, as many people report to see. This movie will obviously look better with HDR, but I didn't notice anything off-putting with the HDR>SDR colorwise.

A proper new 4K television with HDR capabilities is in my near future, but I'm happy that 4K discs still look great on my older 4K television without HDR.
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