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Old 11-14-2022, 02:11 PM   #241
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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Originally Posted by evertec View Post
I'm not sure how you're so confident you're not losing resolution if you haven't actually compared it to the pico4 or other high resolution headset? How do you know it's not even that much better on it?
I'm not comparing the Quest to the Pico 4. The Pico 4 easily beats the Quest on resolution but it's irrelevant because A 3D blu-ray is 1080p, or at most 1080p per eye. I can get every piece of information from that disc, and even increase the visibility of that information before it gets downscaled to native resolution. As an added bonus, downscaling nearly always increases the perceived picture quality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by evertec View Post
I know this because I have an LG 4K OLED that can display the full 1080P per eye and it's a good bit clearer than the pico if I set the screen sizes to be equivalent. And it's waaay clearer than my original Quest.
It doesn't make sense to compare an early generation pentile OLED VR screen to a passive LG 4K OLED. With post-processing I can begin to match it in detail, especially because I'm viewing on an IMAX sized screen. But with SDE and other VR limitations my guess is that the LG will look better at HD resolution and above and I wouldn't be confident in comparing the two, especially without seeing the LG OLED screen first.

I would love to have the clarity of a 4K OLED on which to view 3D. But at the same time I think I would miss the much larger screen. That's only a guess on my part, but in general 3D seems to work better on larger screens and IMAX is much larger than any possible TV size available.

Last edited by cdx47; 11-14-2022 at 02:21 PM.
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Old 11-14-2022, 03:34 PM   #242
evertec evertec is offline
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Originally Posted by cdx47 View Post
I'm not comparing the Quest to the Pico 4. The Pico 4 easily beats the Quest on resolution but it's irrelevant because A 3D blu-ray is 1080p, or at most 1080p per eye. I can get every piece of information from that disc, and even increase the visibility of that information before it gets downscaled to native resolution. As an added bonus, downscaling nearly always increases the perceived picture quality.

I would love to have the clarity of a 4K OLED on which to view 3D. But at the same time I think I would miss the much larger screen. That's only a guess on my part, but in general 3D seems to work better on larger screens and IMAX is much larger than any possible TV size available.
I'm not comparing the Quest to Pico 4 in general either. I'm comparing for movie watching and there is no way you're getting every piece of information out of a 1080P per eye disc to the Quest 1 unless, like I said, you blow the screen up to gigantic proportions, far higher than an Imax screen. The higher resolution is not at all irrelevant as it lets you view the full 1080P per eye information on a far smaller virtual screen that you can see all at once without constantly swiveling your head around. I've directly compared watching movies on Quest 1, 2, and pico. Have you?

You're right about the 4K Oled not necessarily being a better 3D movie experience. Not only do you have a smaller screen but you also have crosstalk, which the VR headsets don't have any of. So I think with the Pico4 I prefer the movie experience to my 4K Oled. Now I still can't watch with people, but my wife doesn't like 3D movies anyway so I usually just watch them on the plane while I'm traveling for work.
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Old 11-14-2022, 04:49 PM   #243
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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Originally Posted by evertec View Post
I'm not comparing the Quest to Pico 4 in general either. I'm comparing for movie watching and there is no way you're getting every piece of information out of a 1080P per eye disc to the Quest 1 unless, like I said, you blow the screen up to gigantic proportions, far higher than an Imax screen.
No need for that because I am rendering and post processing the image with madVR.

Quote:
Originally Posted by evertec View Post
The higher resolution is not at all irrelevant as it lets you view the full 1080P per eye information on a far smaller virtual screen that you can see all at once without constantly swiveling your head around.
Why would I want to give up the immersion of a large screen to watch on a smaller screen? It's why cinemas still exist in the streaming era. Plus with 3D, the larger the screen, the better the effect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by evertec View Post
I've directly compared watching movies on Quest 1, 2, and pico. Have you?
I've directly compared my Quest to the HTC Vive Pro 2 which has 2.5k per eye. I returned the Vive Pro 2.

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Originally Posted by evertec View Post
So I think with the Pico4 I prefer the movie experience to my 4K Oled.
According to the head of the ISF, contrast is the number picture quality factor. So while I'm generally a high nit LED guy, I do understand why OLED TVs are generally thought of as being better. I'm not saying that the Pico 4 is bad, I almost bought one myself. But I'm very happy with the high contrast, great colors and excellent detail I'm getting right now. But nothing is perfect and I'm always looking for potential options.

Last edited by cdx47; 11-14-2022 at 05:36 PM.
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Old 11-14-2022, 06:00 PM   #244
evertec evertec is offline
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Originally Posted by cdx47 View Post
No need for that because I am rendering and post processing the image with madVR.
What does this even mean? Rendering and post-processing doesn't have anything to do with the actual resolution and information displayed. Even if you're artificially enhancing the image, it should look even that much better on a higher resolution display.

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Originally Posted by cdx47 View Post
Why would I want to give up the immersion of a large screen to watch on a smaller screen? It's why cinemas still exist in the streaming era. Plus with 3D, the larger the screen, the better the effect.
Ok, you're not understanding what I'm saying. You say you watch a film at Imax sizes, I'm saying to not lose any quality watching on your quest you'd have to watch it at something like 4 times Imax size, which is completely impractical as you'd only be able to see just a portion of someone's face without having to swivel your head all around.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cdx47 View Post
I've directly compared my Quest to the HTC Vive Pro 2 which has 2.5k per eye. I returned the Vive Pro 2.
A vive pro 2 is a poor representation of a higher resolution headset. The lenses are horrible, I returned mine as well since it looked worse overall than even the Quest 1 and 2. A headset with better lenses such as the Reverb G2 or Pico 4 is much better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cdx47 View Post
According to the head of the ISF, contrast is the number picture quality factor. So while I'm generally a high nit LED guy, I do understand why OLED TVs are generally thought of as being better. I'm not saying that the Pico 4 is bad, I almost bought one myself. But I'm very happy with the high contrast, great colors and excellent detail I'm getting right now. But nothing is perfect and I'm always looking for potential options.
It's great you're satisfied, I'm just saying don't make these definitive statements with such certainty when you haven't actually compared the two.
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Old 11-14-2022, 07:04 PM   #245
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evertec View Post
What does this even mean? Rendering and post-processing doesn't have anything to do with the actual resolution and information displayed. Even if you're artificially enhancing the image, it should look even that much better on a higher resolution display.
A 1080p image might look better upscaled on a 4k screen because more of the available source information is viewable from the same distance. But the information itself doesn't change. It's about what can be perceived at various distances or on different sized screens.
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Originally Posted by evertec View Post
Ok, you're not understanding what I'm saying. You say you watch a film at Imax sizes, I'm saying to not lose any quality watching on your quest you'd have to watch it at something like 4 times Imax size,
I understood exactly what you said and it's wrong. A 4K HDR image will nearly always look better on the same screen size partly because of the increased resolution but mainly because of the increased contrast ratio. That's why the majority of 4K HDR reviews state HDR as the major improvement, not resolution. Contrast is king. Also, I think you are basing your opinions on basic linear math, but the math behind human perception is not linear for obvious reasons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by evertec View Post
It's great you're satisfied, I'm just saying don't make these definitive statements with such certainty when you haven't actually compared the two.
I've seen the same scenes played on non HDR 4K TVs and good HD TVs and at normal viewing distances there's little difference. So let me clarify. I would love to have the extra contrast that HDR brings and the upscaled resolution to increase the perceived resolution. But failing that, I instead use software rendering and post-processing to bring out similar levels of details. This works very nicely with high quality sources like blu-rays. But with low quality sources this actually makes the picture look worse because it highlights the flaws lol. I use a separate display profile for those movies.

Last edited by cdx47; 11-15-2022 at 10:58 AM.
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Old 11-15-2022, 08:09 AM   #246
RefractiveIndex RefractiveIndex is offline
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https://www.techradar.com/news/plays...ews-and-rumors

PSVR 2... OLED screen, 110 degree FOV, support for 4k HDR. Let's hope Sony add support for 3D blu-ray which isn't currently supported on the PS5 and then we will have a winner for VR movie watching IMO.
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Old 11-15-2022, 10:57 AM   #247
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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Originally Posted by RefractiveIndex View Post
https://www.techradar.com/news/plays...ews-and-rumors

PSVR 2... OLED screen, 110 degree FOV, support for 4k HDR. Let's hope Sony add support for 3D blu-ray which isn't currently supported on the PS5 and then we will have a winner for VR movie watching IMO.
Yeah I've been following its progress. Could be a winner but it's still too expensive, at least until a new PS5 slim appears. SDR might still be an issue. The other issue would be lack of decent viewing software which according to owners of the original PSVR was a major issue.
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Old 11-15-2022, 10:59 AM   #248
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdx47 View Post
Yeah I've been following its progress. Could be a winner but it's still too expensive, at least until a new PS5 slim appears. SDR might still be an issue. The other issue would be lack of decent viewing software which according to owners of the original PSVR was a major issue.
Oh I see. It's going to be hard to beat the IMAX cinema on Steam Virtual desktop as well.
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Old 11-15-2022, 12:30 PM   #249
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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Originally Posted by RefractiveIndex View Post
Oh I see. It's going to be hard to beat the IMAX cinema on Steam Virtual desktop as well.
I love the screen choices in the Steam version but I've recently gone back to the Quest app again lol. I miss the extra screens but now that I've sorted a few things out, the picture quality is actually better. It's probably been like that for a while now but I was so fixated on the Steam version (which was initially better) that I didn't notice.
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Old 12-02-2022, 09:27 PM   #250
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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I recently picked up a used Samsung Odyssey Plus. I was hoping this would be my ideal HMD because it's basically a Quest with anti-SDE and no compression. Here is what I have found so far.

Pros:
HDMI: No compression, no banding, aliasing minimised.
SDE filter: SDE very much reduced. Wasn't a major issue for me the difference is obvious when compared with Quest.
Very comfortable out of the box, evenly balanced, simple and effective adjustment controls.
Clearly wider FOV.

Cons:
Updated. See below.

Last edited by cdx47; 12-08-2022 at 11:46 PM.
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Old 12-08-2022, 11:47 PM   #251
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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Update to the previous message. I've significantly improved the picture quality, mainly by removing the remaining post processing I needed for the Quest. But Windows itself seems to play a part depending on the settings I choose.

So for Cons:
SDE filter still visible but improved once post processing removed.
Occasionally can see fresnel lens outlines on plain backgrounds.

I guess there is no such thing as a perfect VR viewing experience but this isn't bad at all
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Old 01-05-2023, 11:50 PM   #252
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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New hardware but back to my old trusty Quest again lol.
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Old 01-31-2023, 03:36 AM   #253
Superballs Superballs is offline
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HP Reverb G2 and Virtual Home Theater is bliss. Addresses everything I've ever hated about 3d movies and amplifies everything I love about them.

2160x2160 per eye and a laptop 3080 means I can supersample to hell and back and see tack-sharp images.

Now back to stewing over the UHD standard not supporting 3d.
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:18 PM   #254
cdx47 cdx47 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Superballs View Post
HP Reverb G2 and Virtual Home Theater is bliss. Addresses everything I've ever hated about 3d movies and amplifies everything I love about them.

2160x2160 per eye and a laptop 3080 means I can supersample to hell and back and see tack-sharp images.
I would much prefer the higher resolution of the G2 to reduce SDE which is why I bought the Vive Pro 2 (with even higher resolution). But there's a fixed amount of information on a disc and I see all of it, especially since my 3080+MadVR allows me to post process almost every aspect of the picture if needed. I would love to reduce SDE but with post processing some of it mitigated and my brain mostly ignores the rest. I may also not be as susceptible to SDE as others.

Essentially for "3D movie viewing", there's nothing the superior hardware of the Pro2/G2 can do that the Quest can't match. But the Quest has OLED lenses which provides significantly better contrast and colors than LED lenses. I found the picture with LED lenses is like what I imagine HDR would be like without WCG colors. I'm not challenging your setup, I'm just laying out my preferences in a techie way

We are both at the vanguard of 3D viewing in VR so I'm happy that you are happy (hope that makes sense).

Last edited by cdx47; 01-31-2023 at 01:25 PM.
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