Spears & Munsil Blu-ray Test Disc - Page 35 - Blu-ray Forum

Stacey Spears · 12-31-2014, 09:12 PM

Yes they are. Vertical line pairs are used to measure horizontal resolution and horizontal line pairs are used to measured vertical resolution.

Tech-UK · 12-31-2014, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacey Spears

Yes they are. Vertical line pairs are used to measure horizontal resolution and horizontal line pairs are used to measured vertical resolution.

Ok I see.

so is your description wrong:

'The horizontal bursts show how well the video playback chain is reproducing horizontal chroma resolution, and the vertical bursts show how well the video playback chain is reproducing vertical chroma resolution.'

Stacey Spears · 12-31-2014, 09:18 PM

I don't think so. When we say horizontal and vertical bursts we are always talking about the resolution, not the orientation. We could probably have made it more clear.

Tech-UK · 12-31-2014, 09:24 PM

Ok.

Anyway, as I was saying my Kuro seems to produce 2 pixel wide white lines on the cross hatch.

The display is set to 1:1, and the player is set to Source Direct.

As I mentioned in my previous post, that the Kuro is set to Enhancer mode 1 which is labelled Hard (Sharpness) as compared with Enhancer mode 2 Natural (sharpness). I wonder if this is the problem.

Stacey Spears · 12-31-2014, 09:47 PM

I don't know, don't have access to a Kuro. Try changing the settings and see what happens.

Tech-UK · 12-31-2014, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacey Spears

I don't know, don't have access to a Kuro. Try changing the settings and see what happens.

I might be seeing things, because on the sharpness pattern the first vertical line on the left within the centre circle is 1 pixel wide, the next is 2 then 3 then 4 then 5.

The same is true for the horizontal lines.

I presume this is correct?

I am using the ISF modes, so I will need to connect my laptop to change the display settings, so I will probably try them tomorrow.

Katatonia · 12-31-2014, 10:19 PM

I just wanted to add that the Spears & Munsil disc was easily worth the price paid. As far as adjusting the colors, contrast, backlight, sharpness, 3D settings, etc. on my Sony LED... the disc has been worth its weight in gold.

I do have one question for Stacey:

When viewing some DVD's on my older region-free Pioneer DVD player, which is hooked up via HDMI and supports 1080p upconvert, sometimes the "black" levels look purple-ish or otherwise overly bright/fake. It's only on some DVD's however, and on others the black levels appear just fine. I used the included DVD calibration disc to set the DVD player...but did I do something wrong? I'm guessing it might just be issues with some DVD's (or players) on LED TV's?

ckenisell · 04-08-2015, 03:00 AM

Stacey,

First, my equipment:
Oppo BDP-93
Panasonic PT-AE7000U
Single HDMI from Oppo to projector.

My goal was to find the best color space to set the BD player. I read all of your in-depth articles on your web site, set the brightness first, contrast second (back and forth a couple of times), sharpness, color & tint (again, I had to fold the blue filter into 3 layers).

Then, I moved onto using the scoring form for the various color spaces using the Color Space Evaluation pattern.

The Oppo will output 4:2:2, 4:4:4, RGB (Video) and RGB (PC). I focused on the first 3.
The projector has three different color space modes: YCbCr, RGB and Auto.

Here's what I noticed:

When the Oppo's color space was set to output YCbCr and the projector's color space was set to RGB (or vice versa) the projector would output video with incorrect colors (greens and pinks instead of blacks and blues).
When the Oppo's color space and the projector's color space matched, the colors were accurate.
When the projector's color space setting was set to "Auto", the projector would accurately switch between the color spaces based upon the signal it received from the Oppo.

This led me to believe that the projector was NOT reprocessing the color space and kept whichever color space that it was receiving.

Now,onto my findings:

Switching the Oppo between 4:2:2, 4:4:4 and RGB (Video) yielded the EXACT same results no matter which test pattern I used. The outline around the long skinny diamonds is equally misaligned in all of the color spaces when testing the chroma alignment (looked like nearest neighbor), everything else looked bilinear, nice smooth ramps with no banding, no clipping in any color space, chroma range looked good, etc. In any case, why do all three color modes yield the exact same results? After spending so much time reading and learning from your articles, I feel like, even though I am much better educated, I still don't know which color space is superior in my setup (because they all appear to be the same).

Am I missing something?

Tech-UK · 04-08-2015, 09:20 AM

If all three look the same, then your equipment is doing what it should do.

But yes, if you mismatch the colour spaces between your source and PJ, its going to give you incorrect colours etc. So I would make sure that both devices are set to the same colour space.

Does your PJ support Deep Colour?

If you output YCC 4:4:4 or RGB you can make use of Deep Colour which your Oppo will support.

Stacey Spears · 04-08-2015, 10:41 PM

If all look the same, then the same type of conversion is being done and it does not matter which one you chose. Most of the time this should be the case. I just happen two have two displays that don't behave that way. My projector needs 444 in and my old VT20 plasma needs 422 in. My vizio TVs are the same regardless.

Note that the OPPO UI, using the onscreen help, will show good and bad incorrectly on HDMI output 1. Its an issue in the graphics layer of the decoder. HDMI 2 shows the on screen help correctly, but that's the lower quality output. Assuming the 93 has two outputs.

103 does.

Basically the diamonds should have equal smear on both sides. (symmetrical)

ckenisell · 01-05-2016, 05:21 PM

Stacey,

Any plans for a 4K UltraHD HDR Calibration disc?

Thanks!

Stacey Spears · 01-05-2016, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chenisell

Any plans for a 4K UltraHD HDR Calibration disc?

Absolutely!

That is the good news. The bad news is that it will be the 2nd half of 2017 for the next disc. We are targeting a UHD / HDR Blu-ray disc. We want to fully support Dolby Vision. Biggest holdup are the tools. We need to update ours and we are waiting on Blu-print from Sony to author the disc.

We are looking at releasing a USB stick later this year with UHD / HDR content as well. The USB stick will have less content than the Blu-ray. We are also looking at offering content on some of the streaming services. For that to happen, we need to get some animated tutorials created. We also want these tutorials on the next disc.

I will start publishing a new bi-weekly column over at Secrets of Home Theater called Behind the Screens (BTS). It's main purpose is a production diary for the documentary I will be shooting. The first doc is on image quality and display calibration. It is being shot at 8k on the RED Weapon. We hope to begin shooting interviews during NAB in April.

In addition to following the development of the doc, I will use the BTS column as my general soapbox to cover the disc development and other image quality related topics such as the fraud being committed by the studios with their UHD releases. So hyperbole and soapbox is what the column is all about. :-)

Is there anything special you are looking for on the UHD disc? We have cool pattern to test the displays ability to show 10 bit. The Dolby Vision version will actually compare 12 to 10 and 8 bit.

ckenisell · 01-05-2016, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacey Spears

...related topics such as the fraud being committed by the studios with their UHD releases.

Um...fraud? Can you give us a taste of what you mean by that? Are studios not creating native 4K releases? Perhaps upscaling 1080p to 4K? Or maybe releasing content that was not natively shot in 4K as an upconversion. Or maybe, because the special effects weren't rendered in 4K, they are forced to upscale. Or maybe, studios are re-digitizing their film, but not at the highest bit depth or widest color spectrum, thus crushing the grayscale now available. Oh, do tell.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacey Spears

Is there anything special you are looking for on the UHD disc? We have cool pattern to test the displays ability to show 10 bit. The Dolby Vision version will actually compare 12 to 10 and 8 bit.

You asked a question, and then answered it. I believe that the best use of a 4K calibration disc would be the ability to use test patterns to set the darkest blacks and the brightest whites (brightness and contrast of course). It sure would be a pitty to purchase a new 4K HDR set and not have the proper tools utilizing the full HDR color spectrum. While one could get close, using the current bit depth of Blu-Ray, it would be impossible.

Tech-UK · 01-05-2016, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckenisell

Um...fraud? Can you give us a taste of what you mean by that? Are studios not creating native 4K releases? Perhaps upscaling 1080p to 4K? Or maybe releasing content that was not natively shot in 4K as an upconversion. Or maybe, because the special effects weren't rendered in 4K, they are forced to upscale. Or maybe, studios are re-digitizing their film, but not at the highest bit depth or widest color spectrum, thus crushing the grayscale now available. Oh, do tell.

I think that pretty much sums it up.

Stacey Spears · 01-05-2016, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckenisell

Um...fraud? Can you give us a taste of what you mean by that? Are studios not creating native 4K releases? Perhaps upscaling 1080p to 4K?

Many of the UHD releases where shot at 2k, for example. Or they did a 2k DI. Basically they are scaling 1080p to UHD for UHD Blu-ray.

I would rather they release 1080p HDR on Blu-ray.

One example is Mad Max: Fury Road. It was shot an an Arri camera at 2.8k. I believe they did a 2k DI. Vudu is selling a UHD HDR version. The HDR looks great. The UHD, not so much. There are pros and cons to them scaling to UHD and I will discuss that in my blog post when I get to it.

I did a side-by-side demo in early December. We had two VIZIO R65 (Reference series displays) One used an OPPO 103 -> EEColor 65x65x65 3DLUT to create 100 nits perfect 709. The other streamed UHD Dolby Vision from VUDU.

The HDR was pretty fantastic. However, the detail was not. We paused and looked at a scene from Man of Steel. The Blu-ray had a lot more detail. The UHD version looked like they had applied serious noise reduction as there was not texture in Superman's outfit. Man of Steel seems to be shot on film, but they did a 2k DI. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0770828/...ef_=tt_dt_spec

Also, 4k is 4096 wide. Blu-ray does not support 4k, it supports UHD, which is 3840 wide. I am being pedantic, I know.

I hope what I am saying makes sense. There are some true UHD titles, but many will be scaled to UHD from HD.

For me, personally, HDR is where it is at. I think HDR is the biggest advancement since HD. Maybe since color television. We have been limited to 8-bit 100 nits for so long.

Geoff D · 02-09-2016, 11:27 AM

Stacey, when you say there was no detail on the UHD version of Man of Steel was that the HDR UHD version or just the UHD on its own derived from the HDR? I ask because HDR apparently requires that the source be de-noised at some point in the chain because of how the extended range can exacerbate noise/grain (a potential problem given how super-grainy MoS is), and as someone who owns a 4K SDR set it'd be my worst nightmare if I upgraded to UHD Blu only to find that the converted HDR to SDR image means that the de-noising is laid bare without the HDR on top of it.

God, I wish this had been covered in more detail instead of the industry just losing its mind for HDR overnight. I don't mean that as a dig at anyone here, but at the whole HDR thing in general: it's gone so far so quickly that the SDR 4K owners have been left in the dust and no-one seems to give a shit. I understand that HDR is da future and it's amazing etc etc, but for those who are not yet blessed with it this UHD Blu rollout has been extraordinarily frustrating in terms of cold hard facts as to how the SDR output will be affected.

Stacey Spears · 02-09-2016, 04:17 PM

It was the Dolby Vision version.

I have not heard of anyone needing to denoise for HDR. I think this was more of a case of low bitrate compression for streaming (Vudu) but won't know for sure until we see it on disc.

I don't really see a point for UHD SDR. Just not enough gain, especially of the source is scaled from 2k. Personally I would take 1080p HDR over 4k SDR any day.

Real issue right now is lack of standards outside of Dolby Vision. There is no standard on how to remap the gamut from the larger gamut to what the display is capable of and this is a real issue with WCG today.

The other is the bad advice some are giving to calibrate to P3, which is not a consumer standard. P3 content is being mapped into 2020 for delivery, so you should calibrate to 2020 and not P3. Once you go P3 R'G'B -> XYZ -> 2020 R'G'B' you are no longer P3 but are 2020. The term "container" is also misleading. Either way, R 235, 16, 16 in P3 becomes R 127, G 73, B 0 in 2020. So if you calibrate for P3 at this point, colors will be wrong. Using 8-bit values for simplicity, though it results in some rounding errors.

Dolby has been doing HDR demos for at least 3-years. Its not overnight. Sadly, I think UHD Blu-ray is poorly defined and rushed to market. It really needs another year of baking to get right. I first saw Dolby Vision in the early days of Xbox One development. Dolby was hoping it would support it. Sadly, it has taken so long to come to market.

Really interested to see what the LG w/ DV looks like. I think it is still too early to buy an HDR display. Maybe in 2017 or 2018 things will settle down. Anything you have bought up until then will be throw away sadly.

I am curious how SDR from HDR will look.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Stacey, when you say there was no detail on the UHD version of Man of Steel was that the HDR UHD version or just the UHD on its own derived from the HDR? I ask because HDR apparently requires that the source be de-noised at some point in the chain because of how the extended range can exacerbate noise/grain (a potential problem given how super-grainy MoS is), and as someone who owns a 4K SDR set it'd be my worst nightmare if I upgraded to UHD Blu only to find that the converted HDR to SDR image means that the de-noising is laid bare without the HDR on top of it.

God, I wish this had been covered in more detail instead of the industry just losing its mind for HDR overnight. I don't mean that as a dig at anyone here, but at the whole HDR thing in general: it's gone so far so quickly that the SDR 4K owners have been left in the dust and no-one seems to give a shit. I understand that HDR is da future and it's amazing etc etc, but for those who are not yet blessed with it this UHD Blu rollout has been extraordinarily frustrating in terms of cold hard facts as to how the SDR output will be affected.

Geoff D · 02-09-2016, 11:09 PM

You're right, it could just be the lousy bitrate of the streaming version that's destroying the detail, but still I'm concerned because of reading stuff like in Penton's post here: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...r#post10502760. FYI I'm not just taking one post as gospel, he did actually link to an HEVC tech paper which explicitly addressed this point of HDR exacerbating grain/noise thus requiring a level of pre-management before encoding but I'll be damned if I can find it now.

And yeah, I kinda get that there's little point of 24fps UHD without HDR (especially when dealing with 2K upscales or stuff that's <4K acquisition to begin with) but someone like me is in a unique position of having neither 1080p HDR nor 2160p HDR, I'm stuck in the middle with 2160p SDR as my last best hope which is why I wanna see those remapping questions from HDR/2020 down to SDR/709 answered definitively. But peoples just ain't squawking.

Stacey Spears · 02-09-2016, 11:14 PM

Next week is Hollywood Post Alliance (HPA) and I will be there Monday - Thursday. On Monday Charles Poynton is doing a 4-hour class and then Disney has another HDR session on Thursday. I am sure there will be more as well.

I will be part of a breakfast round table to discuss gamut remapping on playback. Hopefully something shakes out from all of that.

Stacey Spears · 02-13-2016, 11:02 PM

Some updates. No noise reduction prior to encode is happening, at least not by the compressionists / authoring folks I spoke with. HDR in and of itself does not make grain / noise stand out. If you take an old movie and try and expand to HDR, then this might be an issue. Not HDR related.

Tested out the buggy Samsung UHD player, JS9500 and Martian this week. Martian has some visible banding. It is from compression. Current encoders don't have much in the way of segment re-encoding. Since Sony does not seem to be selling UHD Blu-print, and sadly may never, Scenarist and one I had never heard of the current tools if you are not Sony or PHL. These are bottom feeder tools. I tried to use Scenarist on my 3D disc and it just crashed and they were not even interested in fixing the bugs. This was AFTER I paid $10k for the 3D update. Blu-print is SO MUCH BETTER.

Tested the display with a new banding test pattern I am working on and it seems to be 10-bit. (JS9500) The player was putting out 8-bit for a while and then was 10-bit the next day. Can plug USB thumbstick into player and play my clip as well.

If anyone wants to play with the prototype banding test pattern. Here it is: https://www.dropbox.com/s/jlp1zcjexn...SMQAT.zip?dl=0

I have included both a ts and MP4. Feel free to share with anyone. This is an early version. Will have other version that test color and eventually a 12-bit vs. 10-bit vs. 8-bit version as well. This one is just 10 and 8-bit.

Sadly current authoring tools do not support Dolby Vision. Just HDR-10. Poorly defined HDR-10.

The player seems to be setting MaxCLL and MaxFALL to 0 on output. It does seem to correctly pass gamut, min and max luma though.

SDR output from an HDR disc seems to work okay. Did not spend much time.

Comparing the include Martian Blu-ray to the UHD BD, on a 1080p display, resulted in about the same amount of detail. No banding on the BD though. Maybe when we get real UHD titles we will see more detail.

Disc also signals as 2020 in both SDR and HDR over HDMI.

All in all, I would avoid the Samsung player and wait for something better. The remote sucks, the power cord sucks, its curved too.

Clearly I am not opinionated at all.

04-08-2015, 03:00 AM	#688
ckenisell Blu-ray Samurai Top contributor Member since:Jun 2007 Location:Round Rock, TX Blu-ray collection:368 Blu-ray reviews:3	Stacey, First, my equipment: Oppo BDP-93 Panasonic PT-AE7000U Single HDMI from Oppo to projector. My goal was to find the best color space to set the BD player. I read all of your in-depth articles on your web site, set the brightness first, contrast second (back and forth a couple of times), sharpness, color & tint (again, I had to fold the blue filter into 3 layers). Then, I moved onto using the scoring form for the various color spaces using the Color Space Evaluation pattern. The Oppo will output 4:2:2, 4:4:4, RGB (Video) and RGB (PC). I focused on the first 3. The projector has three different color space modes: YCbCr, RGB and Auto. Here's what I noticed: When the Oppo's color space was set to output YCbCr and the projector's color space was set to RGB (or vice versa) the projector would output video with incorrect colors (greens and pinks instead of blacks and blues). When the Oppo's color space and the projector's color space matched, the colors were accurate. When the projector's color space setting was set to "Auto", the projector would accurately switch between the color spaces based upon the signal it received from the Oppo. This led me to believe that the projector was NOT reprocessing the color space and kept whichever color space that it was receiving. Now,onto my findings: Switching the Oppo between 4:2:2, 4:4:4 and RGB (Video) yielded the EXACT same results no matter which test pattern I used. The outline around the long skinny diamonds is equally misaligned in all of the color spaces when testing the chroma alignment (looked like nearest neighbor), everything else looked bilinear, nice smooth ramps with no banding, no clipping in any color space, chroma range looked good, etc. In any case, why do all three color modes yield the exact same results? After spending so much time reading and learning from your articles, I feel like, even though I am much better educated, I still don't know which color space is superior in my setup (because they all appear to be the same). Am I missing something?

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12-31-2014, 09:12 PM	#681
Stacey Spears BD Test Disc Author Member since:Mar 2008	Yes they are. Vertical line pairs are used to measure horizontal resolution and horizontal line pairs are used to measured vertical resolution.

12-31-2014, 09:18 PM	#683
Stacey Spears BD Test Disc Author Member since:Mar 2008	I don't think so. When we say horizontal and vertical bursts we are always talking about the resolution, not the orientation. We could probably have made it more clear.

12-31-2014, 09:24 PM	#684
Tech-UK Blu-ray Ninja Top ranked HT gallery Top contributor Member since:Sep 2010 Location:UK Home Theater Gallery:91 4K collection:113 Blu-ray collection:999 Blu-ray reviews: 19 Trading Score:23	Ok. Anyway, as I was saying my Kuro seems to produce 2 pixel wide white lines on the cross hatch. The display is set to 1:1, and the player is set to Source Direct. As I mentioned in my previous post, that the Kuro is set to Enhancer mode 1 which is labelled Hard (Sharpness) as compared with Enhancer mode 2 Natural (sharpness). I wonder if this is the problem.

12-31-2014, 09:47 PM	#685
Stacey Spears BD Test Disc Author Member since:Mar 2008	I don't know, don't have access to a Kuro. Try changing the settings and see what happens.

12-31-2014, 10:19 PM	#687
Katatonia Blu-ray Archduke Top contributor Member since:Nov 2010 Location:Missouri, USA 4K collection:499 Blu-ray collection:6978 DVD collection:3773 Digital collection:31 Prime collection:62 Blu-ray reviews: 26 Trading Score:127	I just wanted to add that the Spears & Munsil disc was easily worth the price paid. As far as adjusting the colors, contrast, backlight, sharpness, 3D settings, etc. on my Sony LED... the disc has been worth its weight in gold. I do have one question for Stacey: When viewing some DVD's on my older region-free Pioneer DVD player, which is hooked up via HDMI and supports 1080p upconvert, sometimes the "black" levels look purple-ish or otherwise overly bright/fake. It's only on some DVD's however, and on others the black levels appear just fine. I used the included DVD calibration disc to set the DVD player...but did I do something wrong? I'm guessing it might just be issues with some DVD's (or players) on LED TV's?

04-08-2015, 09:20 AM	#689
Tech-UK Blu-ray Ninja Top ranked HT gallery Top contributor Member since:Sep 2010 Location:UK Home Theater Gallery:91 4K collection:113 Blu-ray collection:999 Blu-ray reviews: 19 Trading Score:23	If all three look the same, then your equipment is doing what it should do. But yes, if you mismatch the colour spaces between your source and PJ, its going to give you incorrect colours etc. So I would make sure that both devices are set to the same colour space. Does your PJ support Deep Colour? If you output YCC 4:4:4 or RGB you can make use of Deep Colour which your Oppo will support.

04-08-2015, 10:41 PM	#690
Stacey Spears BD Test Disc Author Member since:Mar 2008	If all look the same, then the same type of conversion is being done and it does not matter which one you chose. Most of the time this should be the case. I just happen two have two displays that don't behave that way. My projector needs 444 in and my old VT20 plasma needs 422 in. My vizio TVs are the same regardless. Note that the OPPO UI, using the onscreen help, will show good and bad incorrectly on HDMI output 1. Its an issue in the graphics layer of the decoder. HDMI 2 shows the on screen help correctly, but that's the lower quality output. Assuming the 93 has two outputs. 103 does. Basically the diamonds should have equal smear on both sides. (symmetrical)

01-05-2016, 05:21 PM	#691
ckenisell Blu-ray Samurai Top contributor Member since:Jun 2007 Location:Round Rock, TX Blu-ray collection:368 Blu-ray reviews:3	Stacey, Any plans for a 4K UltraHD HDR Calibration disc? Thanks!

02-09-2016, 11:27 AM	#696
Geoff D Blu-ray Emperor Top contributor Member since:Feb 2009 Location:Swanage, Engerland 4K collection:1097 Blu-ray collection:2399 Blu-ray reviews: 6 Trading Score:33	Stacey, when you say there was no detail on the UHD version of Man of Steel was that the HDR UHD version or just the UHD on its own derived from the HDR? I ask because HDR apparently requires that the source be de-noised at some point in the chain because of how the extended range can exacerbate noise/grain (a potential problem given how super-grainy MoS is), and as someone who owns a 4K SDR set it'd be my worst nightmare if I upgraded to UHD Blu only to find that the converted HDR to SDR image means that the de-noising is laid bare without the HDR on top of it. God, I wish this had been covered in more detail instead of the industry just losing its mind for HDR overnight. I don't mean that as a dig at anyone here, but at the whole HDR thing in general: it's gone so far so quickly that the SDR 4K owners have been left in the dust and no-one seems to give a shit. I understand that HDR is da future and it's amazing etc etc, but for those who are not yet blessed with it this UHD Blu rollout has been extraordinarily frustrating in terms of cold hard facts as to how the SDR output will be affected.

02-09-2016, 11:09 PM	#698
Geoff D Blu-ray Emperor Top contributor Member since:Feb 2009 Location:Swanage, Engerland 4K collection:1097 Blu-ray collection:2399 Blu-ray reviews: 6 Trading Score:33	You're right, it could just be the lousy bitrate of the streaming version that's destroying the detail, but still I'm concerned because of reading stuff like in Penton's post here: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...r#post10502760. FYI I'm not just taking one post as gospel, he did actually link to an HEVC tech paper which explicitly addressed this point of HDR exacerbating grain/noise thus requiring a level of pre-management before encoding but I'll be damned if I can find it now. And yeah, I kinda get that there's little point of 24fps UHD without HDR (especially when dealing with 2K upscales or stuff that's <4K acquisition to begin with) but someone like me is in a unique position of having neither 1080p HDR nor 2160p HDR, I'm stuck in the middle with 2160p SDR as my last best hope which is why I wanna see those remapping questions from HDR/2020 down to SDR/709 answered definitively. But peoples just ain't squawking.

02-09-2016, 11:14 PM	#699
Stacey Spears BD Test Disc Author Member since:Mar 2008	Next week is Hollywood Post Alliance (HPA) and I will be there Monday - Thursday. On Monday Charles Poynton is doing a 4-hour class and then Disney has another HDR session on Thursday. I am sure there will be more as well. I will be part of a breakfast round table to discuss gamut remapping on playback. Hopefully something shakes out from all of that.

02-13-2016, 11:02 PM	#700
Stacey Spears BD Test Disc Author Member since:Mar 2008	Some updates. No noise reduction prior to encode is happening, at least not by the compressionists / authoring folks I spoke with. HDR in and of itself does not make grain / noise stand out. If you take an old movie and try and expand to HDR, then this might be an issue. Not HDR related. Tested out the buggy Samsung UHD player, JS9500 and Martian this week. Martian has some visible banding. It is from compression. Current encoders don't have much in the way of segment re-encoding. Since Sony does not seem to be selling UHD Blu-print, and sadly may never, Scenarist and one I had never heard of the current tools if you are not Sony or PHL. These are bottom feeder tools. I tried to use Scenarist on my 3D disc and it just crashed and they were not even interested in fixing the bugs. This was AFTER I paid $10k for the 3D update. Blu-print is SO MUCH BETTER. Tested the display with a new banding test pattern I am working on and it seems to be 10-bit. (JS9500) The player was putting out 8-bit for a while and then was 10-bit the next day. Can plug USB thumbstick into player and play my clip as well. If anyone wants to play with the prototype banding test pattern. Here it is: https://www.dropbox.com/s/jlp1zcjexn...SMQAT.zip?dl=0 I have included both a ts and MP4. Feel free to share with anyone. This is an early version. Will have other version that test color and eventually a 12-bit vs. 10-bit vs. 8-bit version as well. This one is just 10 and 8-bit. Sadly current authoring tools do not support Dolby Vision. Just HDR-10. Poorly defined HDR-10. The player seems to be setting MaxCLL and MaxFALL to 0 on output. It does seem to correctly pass gamut, min and max luma though. SDR output from an HDR disc seems to work okay. Did not spend much time. Comparing the include Martian Blu-ray to the UHD BD, on a 1080p display, resulted in about the same amount of detail. No banding on the BD though. Maybe when we get real UHD titles we will see more detail. Disc also signals as 2020 in both SDR and HDR over HDMI. All in all, I would avoid the Samsung player and wait for something better. The remote sucks, the power cord sucks, its curved too. Clearly I am not opinionated at all.

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