Midnight Cowboy (1969)

[I KEEL YOU]

Screencap 7 on caps-a-holic just might be the tealest thing I've seen in my life. And this is coming from someone who regularly watches Charlotte Hornets home games...

[cash_black]

Originally Posted by Bates_Motel

No, and no.

Pretty sure that’s some minor edge enhancement, just looking for some proper conversation on the matter

[yellowcakeuf6]

Originally Posted by cash_black

Pretty sure that’s some minor edge enhancement, just looking for some proper conversation on the matter

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mackie_line

[CarlosMeat]

Originally Posted by AnamorphicWidescreen

However, I was pleasantly surprised by this disk! This Criterion MC print has, overall, superb PQ - very impressive. For the most part, it's unquestionably better than any previous version of the film - what a revelation.

The teal/green that I was concerned about is not THAT obvious in the film itself - but it's made more obvious when looking at comparisons to the MGM Blu. That being said, my preference would have been more natural colors. I.e., the teal/green is not extremely obvious - but it is evident - in some of the film. I find it extremely unnecessary, and doesn't add anything to the film at all.

Also, with regards to PQ, this Criterion print is not perfect. There were several scenes in Ratso's condemned apartment that were way too dark; these were much lighter/clearer on the MGM Blu.

Do I prefer this over the 2011 MGM Blu?! Overall, yes. n I want to see the film. MGM Blu because there were certain aspects of this print that I prefer - i.e. more natural lighting/color, etc

I took some of my own photos of some of the teal, scenes especially the opening portion which is the worst and in fact there are worse ones than any of those above shots but the ones already on the internet saved time.

In my images earlier I did the most simple thing ran them through photoshop "auto color correct remove color cast".

[yellowcakeuf6]

Originally Posted by CarlosMeat

I took some of my own photos of some of the teal, scenes especially the opening portion which is the worst and in fact there are worse ones than any of those above shots but the ones already on the internet saved time.

In my images earlier I did the most simple thing ran them through photoshop "auto color correct remove color cast".

Why? What was your reference?

[CarlosMeat]

Gray concrete for one. This is the simplest way to correct for white point errors. Why? Because this film color wise looks nothing like it's contemporaries. This sort of cyan push just didn't exist.

I did it just for the fun of it to evaluate the difference.

[yellowcakeuf6]

Originally Posted by CarlosMeat

Gray concrete for one. This is the simplest way to correct for white point errors. Why? Because this film color wise looks nothing like it's contemporaries. This sort of cyan push just didn't exist.

I did it just for the fun of it to evaluate the difference.

Great for getting the color of a particular concrete right, but...
So no actual reference point, such as an answer print?
No one is using gray concrete as a reference for color grading a film with stylistic choices. Do you have the Criterion Blu-ray?

[RCRochester]

Originally Posted by I KEEL YOU

Screencap 7 on caps-a-holic just might be the tealest thing I've seen in my life. And this is coming from someone who regularly watches Charlotte Hornets home games...

[Show spoiler]

That's just the lighting in the laundromat. I watched this over the weekend, it looks fantastic.

[CarlosMeat]

Originally Posted by yellowcakeuf6

Great for getting the color of a particular concrete right, but...
So no actual reference point, such as an answer print?
No one is using gray concrete as a reference for color grading a film with stylistic choices. Do you have the Criterion Blu-ray?

Maybe not but sclera isn't teal nor are irises. I have it and have watched it through twice. Stylistic choices are just that. It's my opinion that this is in fact a stylistic choice but one that falls into line with how films look now not in the late 1960's.

It looks great to me really great except for this cyan push.

[CarlosMeat]

Originally Posted by RCRochester

That's just the lighting in the laundromat. I watched this over the weekend, it looks fantastic.

That is true the fluorescent lighting there gives it that color.

[yellowcakeuf6]

Originally Posted by CarlosMeat

Maybe not but sclera isn't teal nor are irises. I have it and have watched it through twice. Stylistic choices are just that. It's my opinion that this is in fact a stylistic choice but one that falls into line with how films look now not in the late 1960's.

It looks great to me really great except for this cyan push.

OK. Also, thank you for using the word cyan.
Are you thinking this was an error, or choice, from Criterion, because the film to video transfer was overseen by the cinematographer with a reference print that was signed off by the director, producer and cinematographer.
I've always thought previous home video releases looked off, having seen this twice in 35mm in the late 70s and about 2005, and just considered them the home video version. This Criterion release finally looks right to me.

[CarlosMeat]

I frankly don't know I just wish that it had been color graded as films of the era. I spoke with a cinematographer friend of mine asking what he thinks but he has yet to look at it to comment.

I agree that it really does look great. The resolution, contrast, natural looking grain structure, nice low black floor in dark scenes you name it...just this one gripe.

[RCRochester]

Originally Posted by CarlosMeat

I frankly don't know I just wish that it had been color graded as films of the era. I spoke with a cinematographer friend of mine asking what he thinks but he has yet to look at it to comment.

I agree that it really does look great. The resolution, contrast, natural looking grain structure, nice low black floor in dark scenes you name it...just this one gripe.

Is your friend's name Adam Holender? Because that's the only cinematographer whose opinion matters.

[CarlosMeat]

Originally Posted by RCRochester

Is your friend's name Adam Holender? Because that's the only cinematographer whose opinion matters.

Is this your normal communication style ?

[CarlosMeat]

Originally Posted by RCRochester

I watched this over the weekend, it looks fantastic.

I watched this over the weekend and the color grading looks like crap.

[Dailyan]

Originally Posted by CarlosMeat

I watched this over the weekend and the color grading looks like crap.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPD5q6DC43M

[RCRochester]

Originally Posted by CarlosMeat

Is this your normal communication style ?

No.

Originally Posted by CarlosMeat

I watched this over the weekend and the color grading looks like crap.

No, it doesn't. But really, my opinion doesn't matter, and neither does yours. The people who actually made the film and supervised this transfer as well as the print that was used for color correction do, and that's good enough for me.

[tama]

Originally Posted by CarlosMeat

I watched this over the weekend and the color grading looks like crap.

Watched it last night. Looked Awesome.

[CarlosMeat]

Originally Posted by RCRochester

No.



No, it doesn't. But really, my opinion doesn't matter, and neither does yours. The people who actually made the film and supervised this transfer as well as the print that was used for color correction do, and that's good enough for me.

So you are just using that style today then.

It does look like crap since I want to fit in. It looks like an attempt to make it look like the grading in blade Runner 2049 for example where outside has a cyan push.

http://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?a=1&d1...=1&x=564&y=184

This looks nothing like films of the era but instead those of today.

I understand that the decisions are those who did the work but I'm not blind use a high quality 4K projector color calibrated so it's impossible to not see this.

[Fat Phil]

People talk about the teal of the Criterion, but I don't know how anyone can stomach that oppressive DVD era magenta push of the MGM. Fookin' unbearable

MGM


Criterion