Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Boccaccio]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Disney Bowing Disc Re-Releases of Titles From Disney, Pixar, Marvel, Lucasfilm for Studio’s 100th



https://www.mediaplaynews.com/disney...studios-100th/

It's nice that they're doing something at least, but what they should be doing is releasing the stuff that hasn't been released before.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by Boccaccio

It's nice that they're doing something at least, but what they should be doing is releasing the stuff that hasn't been released before.

That costs a lot more money. Disney is now in saving money mode.

[lgans316]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

That costs a lot more money. Disney is now in saving money mode.

Their own making to be frank.

Disney are the king of re-releases. They keep re-releasing the same movie in Steelbook format with different artworks and Amarays with different slips but they have lost the plot with physical media and also a bit on streaming.

Have a look at how many Steelbook versions of a MCU film they release and the list is endless.

They are sitting on a goldmine of catalog films (Fox ones especially and their Vista ones) that will sell well but looks like they are in a catch-22 situation.

The artwork choice alone is a prime example of Disney losing the plot:

https://www.jedinews.com/film-music-...0-anniversary/

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

That costs a lot more money. Disney is now in saving money mode.

No it doesn't. For all the movies and TV shows that are already decent quality on streaming releasing a physical version would barely cost any more than re-releasing the movies and TV shows that already have physical versions.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

No it doesn't. For all the movies and TV shows that are already decent quality on streaming releasing a physical version would barely cost any more than re-releasing the movies and TV shows that already have physical versions.

Nope - you are not going to get the quality you would expect from a BD or a UHD-BD using a streaming master. They are designed for 25 Mbps or less use.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Nope - you are not going to get the quality you would expect from a BD or a UHD-BD using a streaming master. They are designed for 25 Mbps or less use.

Only if you used the exact files. When a movie or TV show is remastered they don't make only a low bitrate version; they make a better quality version and then compress it.

This is even more true with all the recent TV shows that were released exclusively on streaming. They shoot and edit them with much higher quality files and then compress them to make the streaming version. They would simply have to compress the original files a bit less to make the Blu-ray and Ultra HD Blu-ray versions. No remastering is needed.

[veritas]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Only if you used the exact files. When a movie or TV show is remastered they don't make only a low bitrate version; they make a better quality version and then compress it.

This is even more true with all the recent TV shows that were released exclusively on streaming. They shoot and edit them with much higher quality files and then compress them to make the streaming version. They would simply have to compress the original files a bit less to make the Blu-ray and Ultra HD Blu-ray versions. No remastering is needed.

Ya it’s almost always cheaper to make a large raw file then compress down. It gives you a copy that has multiple potential uses and it’s harder to screw it up. I’m sure even the 100gb uhd discs are pretty compressed compared to the raw master given the costs of making the master in the first place compared to the cost of doing a good job.

[bhampton]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Nope - you are not going to get the quality you would expect from a BD or a UHD-BD using a streaming master. They are designed for 25 Mbps or less use.

Don't think the streaming version is the master. A higher quality copy hopefully exists than the one they give you for ipad on the subway.

[stonesfan129]

Originally Posted by lgans316

Their own making to be frank.

Disney are the king of re-releases. They keep re-releasing the same movie in Steelbook format with different artworks and Amarays with different slips but they have lost the plot with physical media and also a bit on streaming.

Have a look at how many Steelbook versions of a MCU film they release and the list is endless.

They are sitting on a goldmine of catalog films (Fox ones especially and their Vista ones) that will sell well but looks like they are in a catch-22 situation.

The artwork choice alone is a prime example of Disney losing the plot:

https://www.jedinews.com/film-music-...0-anniversary/

Wow that artwork is just disappointing. They really couldn't put in more effort than that?

2015 Steelbook artworks are still my favorite for Star Wars.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Only if you used the exact files. When a movie or TV show is remastered they don't make only a low bitrate version; they make a better quality version and then compress it.

This is even more true with all the recent TV shows that were released exclusively on streaming. They shoot and edit them with much higher quality files and then compress them to make the streaming version. They would simply have to compress the original files a bit less to make the Blu-ray and Ultra HD Blu-ray versions. No remastering is needed.

How are you going to deal with the difference in the audio quality? BD has lossless audio - streaming does not.

Time and effort = money spent.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by cheez avenger

It was bound to happen, gents, but got hit with the covid yesterday. Been taking it easy for a bit, but should be back up by Sunday, or at least that's how long I have to stay in isolation for. I've got all of my shots including the seasonal ones, so I have no doubt that that's why my symptoms are "mild." The loss of taste and smell is the wacky one, though. It just feels like I have a regular cold.

Continuing the adventures of Jack Bauer - S8 E18!

take care, hope you feel better

[Anthony P]

let's see if we can get some perspective.

older (and maybe some newer films) will have
1) a film master
2) The film master will be scanned and there might be some digital correction thta is done
3) the studio now has a digital master that might be lightly compressed. digital master
4) the digital master is then encoded/re-encoded aka compressed to make astreaming master or diifferent ones for disk masters
5) the streaming services take the streaming master and then re-encoded for their different streaming (i.e. resolution and different data sizes)


if it is a newer film (for example shot on digital camera) you start on step 3

if a streaming version of the film exists that means there must be an acceptable step 3 for it that can be used for 4 & 5 and the physical media can be made from step 3

Now if someone used a crappy cell many years ago and it was digitally captured with SD video and lossy audio from the device then the digital master (3) can't have better specs and it would take some money to try and upgrade AV. But that does not apply to anything from celluloid or anything shot using professional digital equipment.

[Lee A Stewart]

The studio has two digital masters:

1. Original 16 bit RAW from the digital cameras
2. DCP for theaters.

Neither can be used for consumer content. The first is way too big - measured in terrabytes. The second uses an incompatible compression codec: MotionJPEG2000.

So a third digital master has to be created for consumer content. And it works on a top/down system with the top being highest quality for UHD-BD, down to 4K streaming, BD, HD, DVD, SD and so on. But there are two parts: video and audio and as you know, there are a myriad of audio formats for consumer use. If one doesn't exist for the chosen format, it has to be created. And again . . . creation = money spent.

Film - well that's a whole different story.

[bhampton]

Enjoyed the Devil in Ohio on Netflix

[cheez avenger]

The Head of Joaquin Murietta is up on PRIME. It's an 8 episode western season and looks wild! I tried finding a proper trailer from YT but they only have the Spanish language trailer without English subs. You can watch an English friendly trailer via the page on Amazon. It's actually in Spanish with English subtitles but you have to manually remove them should you want the authentic experience, and can understand Spanish.



https://www.amazon.com/Fox/dp/B0B8MR...s%2C155&sr=8-1

La Cabeza de JoaquÃ*n Murrieta - Tráiler Oficial | Prime Video - YouTube

[stonesfan129]

I'm super ticked because I was hoping there is a Blu-ray or DVD box set of South Park. Nope. There's S1-5, S6-10, S11-15, S16-20. Nothing after that released physically and those are all about $40-50 each. If you buy them on a digital cloud service like Vudu or Apple, they're about $25 per season. Or you can sign up for HBO Max but then you have to keep subscribing to be able to keep watching them. And I had so many problems with HBO Max $***canning my account because they saw me logging on from different IPs (I would log in at friends' places sometimes when we wanted to binge a show).

Yesterday I watched a movie on Tubi called "Helpless" and quite enjoyed it. Went to look for a Blu-ray and what I found was that there was a Blu-ray, but it was a limited release in South Korea, never available in the United States. There was also a DVD. I can't find ANY copies of this title ANYWHERE.

This angers me so much that there are good movies released in SK that just never get brought to the US. It's like trying to find a Blu-ray of "The Handmaiden." It's there, if you want to pay $155 for it, no digital option at all.

Well if they kill off physical media, they're going to go broke cause I'm not paying for a streaming service again.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

The studio has two digital masters:

1. Original 16 bit RAW from the digital cameras
2. DCP for theaters.

Neither can be used for consumer content. The first is way too big - measured in terrabytes. The second uses an incompatible compression codec: MotionJPEG2000.

So a third digital master has to be created for consumer content. And it works on a top/down system with the top being highest quality for UHD-BD, down to 4K streaming, BD, HD, DVD, SD and so on. But there are two parts: video and audio and as you know, there are a myriad of audio formats for consumer use. If one doesn't exist for the chosen format, it has to be created. And again . . . creation = money spent.

Film - well that's a whole different story.

yes absolut3ely like I said step 3

3) the studio now has a digital master that might be lightly compressed that is what you called 1

like I said in 4 "the digital master is then encoded/re-encoded aka compressed to make a streaming master or different ones for disk masters " and yes I did not think of adding a theatrial master.

but all of these are just different encodings of the same studio digital master. You can't watch X on Netflix in UH if there was no suitable studio master for UHD.

Now a UHD BD will need a bit of work for a menu and maybe for some extras if they want to include them.

But you can't stream a film in 4k if there is no 4k +studio master and that 4k+ studio master can be used to make a UHDBD, it does not need to start from the 4k streaming master.

Now as for encoding if you do zoom,skype,teams..... (or your VCprogram of choice) if you ever owned a digital PVR that taped NTSC signal.... they all do real time encoding (take raw file from camera/analogue broadcast and compress the hell out of it)

now professional equipment is much better and yit is not necessarily real time or less and so the algorithm can better decide where to compress and a good compressionist working for a good studio might try several different parameters to come up with the best compression but it is not that big of a cost.

The real costs are in making the film and or restoring a film that was shot on celluloid that has degraded over time. And all those need to have been done if you will be streaming the film in 4k.

What is being missed a bit by others is the studio pays for X copies of a film on disk. The replicator packages a bunch but there will still be some on a spindle, printing a new cover and repacking the old copies has practicaly no extra costs and it reduces inventory.

[Boccaccio]

Originally Posted by stonesfan129

I'm super ticked because I was hoping there is a Blu-ray or DVD box set of South Park. Nope. There's S1-5, S6-10, S11-15, S16-20. Nothing after that released physically and those are all about $40-50 each. If you buy them on a digital cloud service like Vudu or Apple, they're about $25 per season. Or you can sign up for HBO Max but then you have to keep subscribing to be able to keep watching them. And I had so many problems with HBO Max $***canning my account because they saw me logging on from different IPs (I would log in at friends' places sometimes when we wanted to binge a show).

Yesterday I watched a movie on Tubi called "Helpless" and quite enjoyed it. Went to look for a Blu-ray and what I found was that there was a Blu-ray, but it was a limited release in South Korea, never available in the United States. There was also a DVD. I can't find ANY copies of this title ANYWHERE.

This angers me so much that there are good movies released in SK that just never get brought to the US. It's like trying to find a Blu-ray of "The Handmaiden." It's there, if you want to pay $155 for it, no digital option at all.

Well if they kill off physical media, they're going to go broke cause I'm not paying for a streaming service again.

I completely agree with you, but sadly that is the way we are heading.
And most people don't seem to care at all.
I know one thing, as long as they keep making discs, I will keep buying them.

[cheez avenger]

Binged 7 of the 8 episodes of that PRIME show "The Head of Joaquin Murrieta." It's a terrific show. If folks enjoyed The English and That Dirty Black Bag this one compliments those perfectly. It's multilingual show in Spanish, English, Indigenous, and Chinese, so you may have to play around with the subtitle settings. I would have finished the show off but started to get some ISP issues with my Internet that I decided to just call it a night. Will finish it off today.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

For all the movies and TV shows that are already decent quality on streaming releasing a physical version would barely cost any more than re-releasing the movies and TV shows that already have physical versions.

Would it be of any value if I created a simplified lens to end user workflow block diagram? If so then I will try to get it done sometime in the next few weeks.

If anyone knows of an existing one then post a link. There are lots of specific ones, like adding special effects or color grading, etc. but have not found a end to end one.