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Old 05-08-2016, 01:16 PM   #1
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I realize everyone is saying Disney is the last holdout, but where is MGM? I know currently they are distributed by Fox. But I have not seen one title yet. Would love to see any of the Bond films, Sergio Leone films etc.
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Old 05-08-2016, 01:30 PM   #2
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Old 05-08-2016, 04:02 PM   #3
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We're lucky when they even release something on Bluray or DVD.
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Old 05-08-2016, 04:37 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by PRO-630HD View Post
I realize everyone is saying Disney is the last holdout, but where is MGM? I know currently they are distributed by Fox. But I have not seen one title yet. Would love to see any of the Bond films, Sergio Leone films etc.
Fox, along with Warner Bros, distributes MGM films to home media. They're no longer the studio they once were.
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Old 05-08-2016, 06:09 PM   #5
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Well as for catalog fortunately Warner owns their best stuff (everything pre-1986 or so). Although Fox distributes much of MGM they only release a couple of new movies a year so it's not like there absence will be heavily felt. But I don't think they will stay on the sidelines very long.
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Old 05-08-2016, 08:26 PM   #6
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FLYBOYS - (2007) it's perfect for Dolby Atmos (dogfight lot of planes).

Poltergesit - (1982) 35th anniversary it's perfect for Dolby Atmos (a room eeer and tornado).

Platoon - (1986) 4 academy awards best picture.

Spectre - (2015) good action with Dolby Atmos. This is James Bond.
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Old 05-09-2016, 01:06 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by bruceames. View Post
Well as for catalog fortunately Warner owns their best stuff (everything pre-1986 or so). Although Fox distributes much of MGM they only release a couple of new movies a year so it's not like there absence will be heavily felt. But I don't think they will stay on the sidelines very long.
Many MGM catalog titles have been released on blu-ray from Kino, Shout, Arrow, Criterion and Twilight Time plus a few other independent labels.

I just watched a Kino MGM today.

Last edited by uther; 05-09-2016 at 01:12 AM.
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Old 05-09-2016, 01:53 AM   #8
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Many MGM catalog titles have been released on blu-ray from Kino, Shout, Arrow, Criterion and Twilight Time plus a few other independent labels.

I just watched a Kino MGM today.
Yeah I know. I think it's safe to say that more movies from MGM's vault (which includes UA, Cannon and several other smaller studios) have made it out on Blu-ray than any other studio. In fact I don't think it's even close. So in that light I don't think we have to worry about them not allowing any of their movies to get released on UHD.
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Old 05-09-2016, 05:28 AM   #9
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Well since "Pink Floyd The Wall" hasn't even been released on bluray,a 4K edition would be ideal since the live action AND the animation would look stunning
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Old 05-09-2016, 02:05 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bruceames. View Post
Yeah I know. I think it's safe to say that more movies from MGM's vault (which includes UA, Cannon and several other smaller studios) have made it out on Blu-ray than any other studio. In fact I don't think it's even close. So in that light I don't think we have to worry about them not allowing any of their movies to get released on UHD.
Even though other small labels have released MGM titles, they do no work on them, and they usually come from older masters, it may not be worth putting them on UHD, unless they come from a fresh scan.
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Old 05-09-2016, 02:36 PM   #11
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I'd love to have some Rocky and Fargo in UHD.
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Old 05-09-2016, 02:38 PM   #12
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Even though other small labels have released MGM titles, they do no work on them, and they usually come from older masters, it may not be worth putting them on UHD, unless they come from a fresh scan.
I don't expect those to be released for many years on UHD, if ever. In the first few years it would be newer catalogs and the tent poles (and some a tier lower than the tent poles)
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Old 05-09-2016, 05:48 PM   #13
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I'd love to have some Rocky and Fargo in UHD.
And Robocop and Terminator were all recently restored to 4k...

So, there is that.
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Old 05-09-2016, 06:49 PM   #14
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MGM still hasn't even figured out how to give people UV/iTunes Digital HD copies, you think they are gonna be on the ball for 4K releases?
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Old 05-09-2016, 09:07 PM   #15
Paul.R.S Paul.R.S is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uther View Post
Many MGM catalog titles have been released on blu-ray from Kino, Shout, Arrow, Criterion and Twilight Time plus a few other independent labels.

I just watched a Kino MGM today.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bruceames. View Post
Yeah I know. I think it's safe to say that more movies from MGM's vault (which includes UA, Cannon and several other smaller studios) have made it out on Blu-ray than any other studio. In fact I don't think it's even close. So in that light I don't think we have to worry about them not allowing any of their movies to get released on UHD.
I'm wondering about whether/when it will become financially feasible for these boutiques to release on UHD BD. I was happy to see Shout Factory enter the game, but those are docs not Hollywood features.

What with UHD mastering/authoring costs being higher, above and beyond the licensing fees, I'm eagerly awaiting word from, say, Nick Redman about the first of these boutique labels' UHD BD releases . . . and at what price. If Par's J.J. Star Trek lists are $47.99 . . .

From MGM-via-Fox, I'd like to hear about possible 4k presentations of Dances, Silence and Thelma.
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Old 05-09-2016, 09:42 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul.R.S View Post
I'm wondering about whether/when it will become financially feasible for these boutiques to release on UHD BD. I was happy to see Shout Factory enter the game, but those are docs not Hollywood features.

What with UHD mastering/authoring costs being higher, above and beyond the licensing fees, I'm eagerly awaiting word from, say, Nick Redman about the first of these boutique labels' UHD BD releases . . . and at what price. If Par's J.J. Star Trek lists are $47.99 . . .

From MGM-via-Fox, I'd like to hear about possible 4k presentations of Dances, Silence and Thelma.
How much more are the authoring costs for UHD BD than regular BD?

I realize that there are likely some additional costs with it being designed to hold more data on each disc. But it's still an updated version of Blu-Ray and not a whole new format from the ground up.
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Old 05-09-2016, 10:01 PM   #17
Paul.R.S Paul.R.S is offline
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How much more are the authoring costs for UHD BD than regular BD?

I realize that there are likely some additional costs with it being designed to hold more data on each disc. But it's still an updated version of Blu-Ray and not a whole new format from the ground up.
Re your last sentence: I understand that. Re your first: I don't know and am not the person to ask. But what I will opine is that actual costs and technical format specs are less important with regards to "price points" than marketing and the role of HDR.

Specifically, UHD will still be product positioned as a "premium" item by some players (ahem, apparently Paramount). If indeed the likely gone-by-now cost differential between DVD and BD production was the only reason for the charge, I wouldn't still be paying Netflix a monthly fee for "Blu-ray access."

And recoupment of the costs for doing an HDR pass are gonna have to come from somewhere, especially on catalog titles. It's not all Ridley Scott land out there. His relationship Fox (where his last four movies in a row were done) and the money involved (Martian grossing $630M worldwide) all play a role in the re-releases of KOH and Martian.

Last edited by Paul.R.S; 05-09-2016 at 10:33 PM.
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Old 05-10-2016, 12:16 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus View Post
And Robocop and Terminator were all recently restored to 4k...

So, there is that.
Yeah, I reckon those two would be among the first titles to be released if and when they decide to.
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Old 05-10-2016, 02:40 AM   #19
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There are a few MGM own titles scanned at 4k (some might have 2k masters):

The Graduate
The Great Escape (?)
It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World
The Manchurian Candidate
RoboCop
Rocky
Sweet Smell of Success
The Terminator
West Side Story

There are also the Bond films scanned in at 4K but Lowry botched the masters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul.R.S View Post
I'm wondering about whether/when it will become financially feasible for these boutiques to release on UHD BD.
The real cost is in the scanning and mastering which, except for some Criterion titles, is done by the title owners in this case MGM.

Nor is there any need to spend money on fake HDR. Like anybody is going to refuse to buy a true UHD classic they love such as the ones I listed because it is only SDR. Going by that anti-logic all b&w films on BD would be colorized.
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Old 05-10-2016, 03:21 AM   #20
Paul.R.S Paul.R.S is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uther View Post
The real cost is in the scanning and mastering which, except for some Criterion titles, is done by the title owners in this case MGM.

Nor is there any need to spend money on fake HDR. Like anybody is going to refuse to buy a true UHD classic they love such as the ones I listed because it is only SDR.
You're missing my/the point and/or I'm not describing it thoroughly enough.

From my scattered reading about Hanno Basse and the Fox Innovation Lab, in particular, and how over the past year or so the impetus behind the release of a 4k BD format shifted from the benefits of higher resolution (negligible to all but uber videophiles according to some) to HDR instead, it appears to me that the studio that has controlled home vid distribution of the MGM catalog for several years now has HDR as a top priority.

This is the same studio that can't be bothered to release classics like Judgment at Nuremberg and Witness for the Prosecution directly (they were licensed); do right by the likes of Cast Away ($429M worldwide gross), Master and Commander ($212M worldwide) and Speed ($350M worldwide)--and by "do right" I mean re-release them with the great supps that were on each of those movie's double-disc DVD SEs; or even bother to release Waiting To Exhale (the highest-grossing "African American film" of all time in 1995) at all.

I am eagerly hoping to be proven wrong over the next, oh, 18 months with UHD BD release slate announcements. But my current thinking is that this new format--what with all that is going on in the streaming spaces and the (IMO overstated) decline of packaged media--is NOT going to be a shot in the arm to the lazier studios' (IMO, Fox and Par) attitude toward releasing more catalog titles.

I dig The Graduate and The Great Escape, too, but the first thing the beancounters are going to look at are how many copies of those titles have sold on BD. And we all know how BD has underperformed. We all have friends and family who don't care about BD and who may not even know what it is. I routinely see Escape in the $4.99 bin at Busted Buy.

Which leads to my opining that it's not that Fox is going to decide to release catalog titles with SDR. Rather, I think Fox will be looking to the format as an HDR vehicle for eligible titles like the Prometheus sequel and not releasing many SDR catalog titles at all.

It's not that you and I and other collectors will still buy a UHD BD of the 1962 Manchurian Candidate (despite already owning the Criterion 1080p BD) even though it may be "only" SDR. Rather, it's that Fox is likely going to make an a priori decision based upon their HDR priorities to not even release that movie on UHD in the first place.

If someone had told me in 2006 that Par would not release 1980 Best Picture winner Ordinary People on BD even 10 years into the future, I wouldn't have believed them. Are they suddenly going to jump up and release it on UHD now? I don't think so.

To the extent that your statement is accurate about the greatest costs incurred are in the scanning and mastering which is done by the titles' owner, then that underscores the idea that Fox is not going to go to that expense unless either the numbers pencil out for them to recoup their money via the number of units sold upon direct release -or- they're getting a fat license fee upfront.

Which brings me back to wondering whether the most prodigious (in terms of quantity) indie that Fox licenses titles to, Twilight Time, can make it pencil out to pay an even higher licensing fee to get access to 4k masters, author 3,000 copies and hope they sell through enough for them to get their money back. Methinks the odds are that this is not gonna happen.

Let's say for the sake of discussion that even a super popular TT title from MGM that has sold out--The Train--were to be a 4k re-release candidate. First, there are a "lot" (using this term loosely: we're talking about 3,000 people here) of guys who already have the 1080p BD and who therefore won't be interested. Second, I'd have to say that a list price any higher than what TT titles sell for right now (around $33) would push me even further towards renting these discs from 3D Blu-ray Rental over buying them. And I'm a (mild) collector.

So, again, although I'm sad about it I have to acknowledge that it sure seems to me the economics are not in favor of many catalog titles seeing the light of UHD BD even if the cost of "fake HDR" is skipped. There is plenty of precedent over the past two years of disinterest on the part of the Big Guys. And if they do scan/master and license to the Small Guys, the latter are almost certainly going to be paying a higher fee and passing that on to us.

How much will, say, 5,000 guys pay for an SDR UHD BD of Sweet Smell Of Success?

Last edited by Paul.R.S; 05-11-2016 at 04:07 PM.
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