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Old 07-01-2007, 05:57 AM   #1
HDTV1080P HDTV1080P is offline
Blu-ray Knight
Jan 2007
Default Blu-ray standalone recorders will give consumers true perfect HDTV recording quality

Recordable BLU-RAY standalone recorders most likely will start appearing on the US market sometime in the middle of 2008. The first generation BLU-RAY recorders might cost $2,000 and will have an NTSC/ATSC/QAM tuner and IEEE-1394 interface. Most likely the higher end models will contain a hard drive and a two way QAM tuner with cablecard slot that supports Video on Demand and all the functions of a two way Digital cable box. Recordings of 1080I, 720P, 480P, and 480I programming will be exact bit per bit perfect copies.
Right now the only way to enjoy HDTV recordings without a PC option is a HDTV DVR. The problem with HDTV DVR’s is that they are good for temp recordings and not permanent storage.
Before standalone VHS, S-VHS, and D-VHS machines went out of production JVC made the HM-DT100U D-VHS which contained a built in ATSC tuner and allowed people to make a perfect copy of 1080I, 720P, 480P, and 480I programming onto a D-VHS videotape. I wish I would have bought a second D-VHS machine about a year ago since no one makes standalone VHS, S-VHS, and D-VHS machines anymore. I will have to wait about a year for BLU-RAY standalone recorders to become a reality to make achieved HDTV discs from over the air programming.
Besides the standalone HDTV quality DVR’s that are on the market which are good for temp recordings, the only permanent way to record HDTV programs is a lossy media. Since standalone VHS, S-VHS, and D-VHS machines are no longer in production companies are now making cheap VHS /DVD combo recorders that only record at 480I quality. No one makes a combo S-VHS/DVD or D-VHS/DVD combo machine. So if you do not want to go the HDTV hard drive method to record then your only choice is DVD recorder standalones or VHS/DVD recorder combo units which are 480I quality.
There are two ways to purchase a DVD recorder standalone or VHS/DVD recorder combo which are all 480I quality.
1. Purchase a low cost recorder without any tuner
2. Or Purchase a recorder which contains a built in NTSC/ATSC tuner and some also have QAM for unencrypted Digital Cable.
Both of these two methods give one poor quality results since 1080I and 720P programming is converted to 480I quality. The consumer electronics industry decides to discontinue all the standalone VHS, S-VHS, and D-VHS machines and they end up giving the consumer cheap low quality VHS/DVD combo units. I hate combo units but if they are going to be made why not make a few S-VHS and D-VHS combo units? For an extra $30-$50 it would be technically possible to add a S-VHS ET feature if companies were smart. For an extra $100-$200 a D-VHS combo could most likely be made that recorded in true 1080I and 720P quality. The consumer no longer has a choice and can not buy S-VHS or D-VHS combos and is stuck with VHS/DVD combo’s that record in 480I quality with ATSC tuners that receive 1080I and 720P HDTV broadcasts.

I will just need to wait another year until BLU-RAY standalone recorders become a reality. Sometimes I think this country is moving to 480I SDTV instead of HDTV quality consumer electronics devices.

Last edited by HDTV1080P; 07-01-2007 at 06:23 AM. Reason: spelling
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Old 07-01-2007, 07:10 AM   #2
GasCat GasCat is offline
Special Member
Jan 2007

Will we be allowed to record all shows to them? Let's say I am watching the UNI-HD movie channel. Can I record the HD movie?

I am curious about HDCP(or something else) locking down on what we record.
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Old 07-01-2007, 07:21 AM   #3
HDTV1080P HDTV1080P is offline
Blu-ray Knight
Jan 2007

When recording ATSC or unencrypted QAM channels these should always be in true 1080I and 720P MPEG-2 bit per bit recording with no restrictions. Now when it comes to encrypted programming that uses the cable card then the cable company can decide to turn on or off the recording feature for some programs or channels. Also the satellite HDTV boxes could disable recordings if they want.
The cable and satellite industry needs to be careful before disabling recording. Consumers can always complain and/or cancel service.
Technically if the CPU in the BLU-RAY recorder had enough memory and processing power it could convert MPEG-2 broadcasts to MPEG-4/AVC and still maintain the same quality with more space on the disc. Possible the first BLU-RAY recorders might only record MPEG-2 broadcasts using MPEG-2 codec. When dubbing from a BLU-RAY camcorder disc then it most likely would record in MPEG-4/AVC.
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Old 07-01-2007, 03:59 PM   #4
MrBogey MrBogey is offline
Expert Member
Jan 2007

My price point is just over a grand. That's what I spent on getting a HTPC. With a bluray DVR-recorder and the PS3, there is almost nothing I can do on my HTPC I can't do on them.
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Old 07-02-2007, 08:48 AM   #5
GasCat GasCat is offline
Special Member
Jan 2007

Just a matter of time it looks like.

Home Recording Rights Coalition

"Selectable Output Control" ("SOC") is the remote signaling of home devices by content providers or distributors, to turn off consumer home interfaces on a program-by-program basis. The interface in question would simply not operate for the particular program. It would mean that a consumer who has purchased an HDTV display, and pays for a set-top box or other device with an HDTV output, still might not receive all of the HDTV programs he or she has paid for -- because the interface between the set-top box and the HDTV display has been turned off by remote control. In the long term, imposition of SOC could have the effect of driving from the market any home interface that supports home recording. HRRC has opposed imposition of SOC by law or in any context subject to regulation.

SOC is activated by data "triggers" that ride along with program information when it is sent to the home. FCC Encoding Rules currently ban SOC use, but the FCC has left the door open to its use in the future. "

This affects digital broadcasting from HD radio.
HRRC Opposes Audio Broadcast Flag - The Home Recording Rights Coalition has gone on record opposing H.R. bill 4861, which requires the FCC to impose anti-consumer copy control restrictions on in-home, private, personal and lawful recording from HD radio sources. [...]The RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) believes that when anyone records a song off the radio they have engaged in piracy and should be criminally prosecuted
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