Dolby Pro Logic IIz questions

[BigGuy219]

I was able to get a Onkyo HT-TC160 on sale and it's currently on the truck headed to me, and while I'm very excited ... I am also very nervous because this marks the first time I haven't simply gotten a basic $200 HTiB. There's a lot of features I'm not familiar with, and while I've done research there are a few questions I have about Dolby Pro Logic IIz.

I've downloaded the manual from the Onkyo website and looked at the connection diagrams and I've noticed there are an additional two speaker connections on the back of the unit, for "Zone 2" and the "height" feature.

From what I understand if I hook up 9 speakers to the unit, only 7 will function at the same time. I'm afraid the manual didn't seem to make it clear how exactly this works.

Some assumptions ... if I put in a 7.1 blu-ray ... the height speakers will be 'off' and the two rears will be 'on'? ... and if I put a 5.1 disc in and activate Pro Logic IIz the height speakers will be 'on' and the rears will be 'off'? Is it that simple?

Lastly, I've never liked Pro Logic on any of the setups I've had ... in fact, I've always used it only for mono/stereo sources when DD or DTS wasn't an option. When is Pro Logic IIz used ... for DD/DTS and stereo/mono only? Will it 'mess up' a lossless DTS-HD/DD-TrueHD/PCM?

[Big Daddy]

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/techno...z-details.html

By expanding the soundfield vertically Dolby Pro Logic IIz lets you create a 7.1-channel playback system from your 5.1 surround system, or a 9.1 system from your 7.1-channel setup. Dolby Pro Logic IIz even makes speaker positioning and wiring simple. And if it’s not practical to add rear surround speakers in your environment, Dolby Pro Logic IIz still lets you enjoy incredibly realistic surround sound.

How flexible is Dolby Pro Logic IIz? If you already have a 5.1-channel system and buy a new 7.1 audio/video receiver with Dolby Pro Logic IIz, you can put the two additional speakers above your left and right front speakers for 7.1 height, or at the back for a traditional 7.1 setup. Or you can stay with 5.1 channels and use the extra amplifier channels for stereo speakers in another room. With a 9.1-channel setup, you have even more choices, including state-of-the-art 9.1 playback with both surround and back speakers and two front height speakers.

http://www.dolby.com/professional/ce...logic-IIz.html

Because it processes only nondirectional sounds for the height channels, Dolby Pro Logic IIz maintains the integrity of the source mix, so the effects are always appropriate to the material. This added dimension complements the sound from the rear surround speakers, increasing spaciousness while staying true to the original intent of the content creator.

As is the case in existing Pro Logic IIx technology, the height extensions don’t require new kinds of program content to drive the height channel outputs. Instead, the extensions are designed to effectively add depth and dimension to existing program material.

Dolby Pro Logic IIz also incorporates an encoding aspect that enables content providers and game developers to maximize the added dimension by creating entertainment with height elements of near-discrete quality.

http://www.dolby.com/professional/ce...IIz-specs.html

Dolby® Pro Logic® IIz incorporates all of the features and capabilities of Dolby Pro Logic IIx. The following information summarizes existing Dolby Pro Logic IIx implementations and what’s added for Dolby Pro Logic IIz.

Features and configurations for Dolby Pro Logic IIx:

Ability to generate up to 7.1 channels from stereo and 5.1 sources
Supported decoding:
Pro Logic mode
Virtual Compatible mode
Music mode
Movie mode
Matrix mode
Dolby Digital EX mode.Supported upmixed output configurations based on stereo sources:
2 to 3 [L, R to L, C, and R]
2 to 4 [L, R to L, R, Ls, and Rs]
2 to 5.1 [L, R to L, C, R, Ls, and Rs]
2 to 6.1 [L, R to L, C, R, Ls, Rs, and Cs]
2 to 7.1 [L, R to L, C, R, Ls, Rs, Lrs, and Rrs].Supported upmixed output configurations based on 5.1 sources with independent Ls and Rs channels:
5.1 to 6.1 [Ls, Rs to Ls, Rs, and Cs]
5.1 to 7.1 [Ls, Rs to Ls, Rs, Lrs, and Rrs]
.The features listed above allow Dolby Pro Logic IIx to provide a true surround sound experience from a variety of sources. However, all the outputs derived by existing Dolby Pro Logic IIx decoders are located in a horizontal plane. The Dolby Pro Logic IIz extensions to Dolby Pro Logic IIx allow it to derive height channel outputs that significantly enhance the spatial experience.

In addition to the features already described, the height extensions offer the following new features and configurations:

Ability to generate audio of up to 9.1 channels that include height channel outputs from stereo, 5.1, and 7.1 Back sources.
Supported upmixed output configurations based on stereo sources:
2 to 7.1 Height [L, R to L, C, R, Ls, Rs, Lvh, and Rvh]
2 to 9.1 [L, R to L, C, R, Ls, Rs, Lrs, Rrs, Lvh, and Rvh].Supported upmixed output configurations based on 5.1 sources with independent Ls and Rs channels:
5.1 to 7.1 Height [Ls, Rs to Ls, Rs, Lvh, and Rvh]
5.1 to 9.1 [Ls, Rs to Ls, Rs, Lrs, Rrs, Lvh, and Rvh]
Note: For 5.1-channel sources, Dolby Pro Logic IIz height extensions operate only on the Ls and Rs channels; L, C, R, and LFE channels are bypassed..Because new formats (such as Blu-ray Disc™) allow content to contain up to 7.1 discrete channels from Dolby Digital Plus and Dolby TrueHD audio programs, the height extensions support 7.1 Back sources and offer the following upmixed output configurations:

7.1 Back to 7.1 Height [Ls, Rs, Lrs, and Rrs to Ls, Rs, Lvh, and Rvh]
7.1 Back to 9.1 [Ls, Rs to Ls, Rs, Lrs, Rrs, Lvh, and Rvh]
Note: For 7.1-channel sources, Dolby Pro Logic IIz height extensions may operate only on the Ls, Rs, Lrs, and Rrs channels; L, C, R, and LFE are bypassed.

[AmberMosquito]

hey big daddy, you seem to be very knowlidgeable in this area.. so i was wondering what you think about audyessy(im sure i spelled it wrong) dynamic eq. Should I use it when playing bluray movies at a loud level? 73 being usually the loudest i ever need it. Does it add anything at loud levels? Or is it only for use at lower levels? When I do use it at lower levels I usually have to turn it wat down cause it makes the surrounds + front very loud. and it adds a ton of base. I have an onkyo txnr708 with 5.1+front height. do you know the difference between the NR model and the SR model? any insight on these matters would be greatly appreciated.

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by AmberMosquito

hey big daddy, you seem to be very knowlidgeable in this area.. so i was wondering what you think about audyessy(im sure i spelled it wrong) dynamic eq. Should I use it when playing bluray movies at a loud level? 73 being usually the loudest i ever need it. Does it add anything at loud levels? Or is it only for use at lower levels? When I do use it at lower levels I usually have to turn it wat down cause it makes the surrounds + front very loud. and it adds a ton of base. I have an onkyo txnr708 with 5.1+front height. do you know the difference between the NR model and the SR model? any insight on these matters would be greatly appreciated.

Give this a read Amber & Welcome to the forum!!

https://forum.blu-ray.com/audio-theo...ur-system.html

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by AmberMosquito

hey big daddy, you seem to be very knowlidgeable in this area.. so i was wondering what you think about audyessy(im sure i spelled it wrong) dynamic eq. Should I use it when playing bluray movies at a loud level? 73 being usually the loudest i ever need it. Does it add anything at loud levels? Or is it only for use at lower levels? When I do use it at lower levels I usually have to turn it wat down cause it makes the surrounds + front very loud. and it adds a ton of base. I have an onkyo txnr708 with 5.1+front height. do you know the difference between the NR model and the SR model? any insight on these matters would be greatly appreciated.

First of all, make sure all your speakers and the subwoofer are calibrated properly. Double check with an SPL meter.

Audyssey Dynamic Equalization is meant to be used at low volumes. Technically, as long as you are below reference level, using Audyssey Dynamic Equaliztion is a good idea. Reference level is extremely loud. I would leave dynamic eq on all the time. However, if it bothers you so much, turn it off. It is a matter of personal preference.

Brief Explanation of Audyssey Dynamic Eq:
Multi-channel audio is mixed at high volume and is meant to be played back at very high reference level. However, in home theaters, people turn the volume down and as a result the sound quality suffers. Normally, when you turn the volume down for surround sound movies, the bass and surround effects suffer. With the Audyssey Dynamic EQualization, you can regain this information even at low volumes.

For more detailed information, check the following links:

http://www.audyssey.com/technology/dynamiceq.html
http://www.electronichouse.com/artic...ynamic_volume/


Reference Level:
Reference level is defined for film mixing and movie theaters. Every studio and movie theater is calibrated according to this level. It represents an average of 85dB for the regular speakers on the SPL meter (set on C weighting and Slow) using a band limited (500Hz to 2,000Hz) pink noise at the listening position. The peak level is set 20dB higher at 105db and the LFE peak level is set +10dB higher to a maximum of 115dB. The purpose of the +10 dB gain for the LFE channel is to increase the dynamic range of bass sound such as explosions and crashes. This means when the receiver master volume is set to 0dB, the regular speakers are expected to play a peak level of 105dB and the subwoofer is expected to produce a peak output level of 115dB. This is louder than most people can tolerate, so people normally set the master volume much lower than 0 when watching movies or listening to music. Furthermore, such loud bass level places a heavy burden on the subwoofer and requires multiple high-end subwoofers to produce it accurately.

Because 85dBC test tones can be very loud in a small home theater room and can damage hearing, receiver manufacturers through the encouragement by Dolby and THX decided that a reasonable test-tone level is 75dB and that is the level that most receivers use.

[AmberMosquito]

thanks for the info.. i have been using the setup mic to calibrate the speakers. but i do have a sound meter. which do you think is better? and if i do use the sound meter i usually calibrate the speakers to 75db. all equal. is that the best way to do it? or does the setup mic actally do any special calculations that i cant do with the sound meter?

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by AmberMosquito

thanks for the info.. i have been using the setup mic to calibrate the speakers. but i do have a sound meter. which do you think is better? and if i do use the sound meter i usually calibrate the speakers to 75db. all equal. is that the best way to do it? or does the setup mic actally do any special calculations that i cant do with the sound meter?

The calibration program inside the receiver and the included microphone do several things:

1. Measure the distances between the speakers/ subwoofer and the listening position.
2. Adjust the levels of the speakers/subwoofer.
3. Perform equalization to get rid off some of the problems associated with audio in small rooms.
4. Depending on the calibration program that you own and its version, they can perform equalization for multiple listening positions.

An SPL meter is generally used to check the levels of the speakers and is a good idea to double check the speaker levels after calibration. In order to measure the frequency response of the speakers in the room and perform equalization with an SPL meter, you need other equipment and it will take several hours. Moreover, low cost SPL meters do not have the needed accuracy for such measurements. It is best to use a calibrated microphone. Behringer sells one for less than $100.

[AmberMosquito]

thanks so much for all the good info! now I know the dynamic eq works with the setup mic, I turn it off before doing mic set up test and after tests its back on again.. does that mean the calibrated settings will not apply when the dynamic eq is off?