Bipole Speaker placement

[Kali157]

My home theater upgrade is evolving. I originally wanted a 7.1 setup but due to my room config and under advisement of people from this and AVS forums , I came to the realization that I maybe forcing it. My room is about 13ft by 13ft w/ 9ft ceilings. The left side doesnt have a wall (leads to another sitting area). My main couch is nearly to the back wall making the ideal sitting area about 2 ft from the back wall.

B/c of the windows, proximity of listening position to back wall, I think my options for surround speaker mounts are only 2. First is where I currently have my surrounds at which are on the ceiling on the left and right of couch (slightly back). My second spot is behind the couch but 8.5 ft up (about 4.5ft above the listening position's ear) BUT only less than 2 ft behind. I don't think the second option is ideal tho.

So someone suggested dipole or bipole speakers. I had found some Klipsch S-1 or S-3 (S-3 might be too big). I went to Bestbuy's Magnolia and the tech there said that I should mount these speakers behind the couch even though I have to mount it so close to behind the seated position and 4.5 ft above.

Now the questions for dipole speakers. Was the Magnolia tech right? Or should I mount it left and right like I currently have my directional speakers?

Also, do I have to angle these bipole speakers towards the listening position? Or do I just have them face straight out, keeping in mind that it will be mounted 4.5 ft above ear level.

Thanks for the help.

[Steve]

Big Daddy has a very good sticky on bipole and dipole speakers you should look through.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=66471

That thread will explain to you that a bipole and dipole speaker are NOT the same thing, even though they look very similar. I have a setup similar to yours. My setup is 'only' 5.1 and I have Klipsch bipoles on the back wall. IMO they work very well. Pics are in my HT gallery if you want to see them. The problem in your situation for dipoles is that they are designed to be beside the listener. Now plenty of people here will tell you they will work perfectly well on the back wall, and that may be true, but keep in mind if you're not in the null area they'll lose much of the effect they were designed to have. Bipoles, on the other hand, are much more flexible in their placement and will work well beside your or behind you.

[Kali157]

fireman- being a complete noobie, I cant seem to find the pics of your HT... directions???

Also, I am looking at the klipsch synergy S-1 OR S-3. Are the S-3s overkill for my room setup? Is this series dipole or bipole (cant seem to find this info anywhere).

In terms of setup, you said that you have klipsch bipoles inthe REARS. Are yours mounted as high as mine due to my window (aprox 4.5ft above listening position)? And are they pointed TOWARDS the seated position or just straight across?

Thanks

[HAMP]

Did you look thru the link fireman325 provided? In that link, it will show you how to place your speakers...

By the way, Klipsch S1's or S3's are Hybrid bi-pole speakers and from reading your post, they may be perfect for what you need.

[Kali157]

I actally read that sticky before I posted. Here is a quote on the speaker setup:

"Normally, surround speakers are placed at or above ear level. However, for movies, installing them above ear level is preferred. In a 5.1 setup, you have three options for installing bipolar speakers:

1. On the side walls, above and behind ear level.
2. Hung from the ceiling, above and behind ear level.
3. The rear wall, above ear level.

In a 5.1 setup, dipolar speakers are installed on the side walls or hung from the ceiling on the same line as the listener (the null area faces the listener). In a 7.1 setup, dipolar speakers can be used. However, care must be taken to position them properly (see the section below)."

The post says you can mount on side and back. Fireman mounted to the back. My concern was with my combo of height (again, 4.5ft ABOVE ear level... cant bring it lower on back b/c of window and cant bring it lower on side config b/c there is no wall on left side) and distance to seated area (my couch is close to my back wall making sitting 2ft away from back wall). This combo makes it seem to me like the speaker is going over the listening position. So is mounting in back still an option for me? I understand the post said you can mount in back, but I think it assumes more distance from back wall to couch AND it doesnt mention HEIGHT except "above ear level".

My second question is at my height do i need to point the bipole speakers toward sitting position since I am mounting so high? The sticky did not mention whether you need to point the speakers towards the seated position like directional speakers.

Again in the sticky I couldnt find where it says if bipoles need to be pointed at the listener or if my proximity to back wall prevents me from mounting in the back. I have already beeen advised that I cannot mount Surround BACKS for 7.1 at my config. Thats why I am looking into bipoles for better sound immersion that my current directional surrounds.

Thanks for the info on the klipsch. good to know they are good choices for my room.

[HAMP]

You place them level. You do not turn them downward to point at the listening area.

They are design to spread the sound outwards to give the room a more fullness of sound.

Can you take a picture of your problem with placement?

[Steve]

Originally Posted by Kali157

fireman- being a complete noobie, I cant seem to find the pics of your HT... directions???

Also, I am looking at the klipsch synergy S-1 OR S-3. Are the S-3s overkill for my room setup? Is this series dipole or bipole (cant seem to find this info anywhere).

In terms of setup, you said that you have klipsch bipoles inthe REARS. Are yours mounted as high as mine due to my window (aprox 4.5ft above listening position)? And are they pointed TOWARDS the seated position or just straight across?

Thanks

Ordinarily you would click where it says HT Gallery under my avatar, but I screwed around last night and accidentally deleted the entire thing. I sent a PM to iceman (site developer) to see if it can be restored or recovered, but if it cant' then I won't have time to mess with it again before tomorrow. In the meantime you can still see some pics in my HT thread which is here. There are many of the same pics there which may be helpful to you.

To answer your questions, Klipsch doesn't make dipoles at all that I know of. Their speakers are more bipole in nature. Also I should have said I have bipole surrounds instead of rears, but they are on the rear wall. As far as height goes, no mine are not that high, but THX recommends that surrounds be at least 2' above ear level while seated. Going up even higher probably won't be a problem. Also mine are flush mounted on the wall, and not angled toward the listener. And no I don't think the S-3s would be overkill.

[Fors*]

I have the S3's and they are used as surrounds. My seating is tight as well, but I do feel the S-3's were not overkill. With proper calibrataion, you can get the S-3's to blend in with your other speakers to prevent any overkill. There are pics in my gallery of the S-3's and how I have them set-up if you are curious. The S-1's, S-2's or S-3's are all hybrid bipoles. They cannot be considered dipoles or can they switch over and become a dipole.

They are considered a hybrid because a true bipole would have a mid/range and tweeter at opposite sides from each other at a 90 degree angle. These speakers have a single mid/range in the middle between 2 tweeters that are at a 90 degree angle from one another. They are considered more of a "surround sound" speaker than a true bipole, but the term hybrid bipole seems to sitck when describing these speakers.

If you become quite concerned about overkill, you could invest in an SPL meter to help them blend in more seemlessly with your other speakers. By the way, the S-3's are quite big as you stated, so make sure you secured them firmly into any wall, as they are a bit heavy as well.

Good luck!