Batman: Mask of the Phantasm - Blu-ray Forum

McCrutchy · 12-20-2008, 09:49 PM

I really think this would look awesome on Blu-ray (in a much deserved Special Edition at that). I know B: TAS is probably unsalvageable for HD without a serious restoration (which we won't get until a fan gets high up at WB; maybe 20-30 years), but just so everybody remembers, this was released theatrically which means somewhere there is a 35mm print that can be scanned and transferred to 1080p. This was a great film that had some real depth for an animated film, let alone a children's animated film. The flipper DVD release is a shame and WB should have done this Batman classic up around the re-release of B: TAS in November.

Hopefully someone agrees with me?

Edit: I found these Youtube links to an HBO First Look episode on the film...I didn't even know it existed!

Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlEfS...eature=related

Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdS2h...eature=related

Red Hood · 12-21-2008, 02:01 PM

Yeah that movie was awesome, hope they will do it someday.

Gone2HiDef · 12-21-2008, 06:49 PM

+1.

GOAT · 12-22-2008, 03:18 AM

All Batman needs to be on BLU... even if it doesnt look amazing i love my batman and want it in the collection!!

Jimmyboots · 01-04-2009, 02:23 AM

I read somewhere, I think it was World's Finest that WB was considering a Blu-ray release of Mask of the Phantasm, and that we may see more Direct-to-DVD movies based on the various animated series in the DCAU.

Here's hoping for an anouncement soon.

TopCow · 11-19-2009, 12:20 PM

For the love God, I hope this happens.

Afrobean · 11-19-2009, 01:27 PM

Quote:

I know B: TAS is probably unsalvageable for HD without a serious restoration (which we won't get until a fan gets high up at WB; maybe 20-30 years)

Missing the point of Batman. If they "cleaned up" this series for a new HD version, I wouldn't bother buying it. The whole point of it was to have that dirty and gritty look. If they use digital magic to erase all of the dirt, it'd look totally wrong.

Quote:

but just so everybody remembers, this was released theatrically which means somewhere there is a 35mm print that can be scanned and transferred to 1080p.

There are film prints of every episode of the show as well.

Quote:

This was a great film that had some real depth for an animated film, let alone a children's animated film.

Batman is not for children. Sometimes he is, but this Batman, Batman the Animated Series, is not. And especially this film, above all other Batman TAS material is not for children.

Mask of the Phantasm would certainly be an easy sale for me though. WB could crap out a bad transfer and I'd still be willing to rebuy this, since my current edition of it is the "double feature" version with SubZero, both of which are 1.33:1. Ugh. I think SubZero might have actually been designed for 1.33:1 being DTV, but I know Mask of the Phantasm is supposed to be 1.85:1.

KubrickFan · 11-19-2009, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Missing the point of Batman. If they "cleaned up" this series for a new HD version, I wouldn't bother buying it. The whole point of it was to have that dirty and gritty look. If they use digital magic to erase all of the dirt, it'd look totally wrong.

I like a dirty and gritty look, but I doubt it that the cell dust was an intended effect. It's sometimes really distracting, and I wouldn't mind if they cleaned that up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Batman is not for children. Sometimes he is, but this Batman, Batman the Animated Series, is not. And especially this film, above all other Batman TAS material is not for children.

Well, it's both for children and adults, like the other Warner animated series at the time. There are some jokes in Animaniacs that aren't intended for children but that doesn't mean the entire series isn't for children.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Mask of the Phantasm would certainly be an easy sale for me though. WB could crap out a bad transfer and I'd still be willing to rebuy this, since my current edition of it is the "double feature" version with SubZero, both of which are 1.33:1. Ugh. I think SubZero might have actually been designed for 1.33:1 being DTV, but I know Mask of the Phantasm is supposed to be 1.85:1.

I think it wasn't really animated with the 1.85:1 ratio in mind. It looks awfully cramped on many, many shots. Warner also decided quite late in the game that it would be released in cinemas, so I think it's cropped instead of matted.

Goremageddon · 11-19-2009, 07:43 PM

First, I'd buy it because it's a great movie. Second, I'd buy it based solely on the fact that my dvd is in a snapper case. Truly aweful packaging.

Propellarhead9 · 11-20-2009, 12:28 AM

I would definitely pick it up if they do.

Versatil · 02-20-2010, 08:37 PM

Any news a year after?

BD4ME · 02-20-2010, 08:55 PM

It's become apparant that Warner Bros. doesn't give a crap about their hand-drawn animated films - if it's not CGI, stop-motion, motion-capture or anime - they don't care. Well the DC dtv's, but catalog - I don't think so...

Though have they ever really cared... looking at some of the previous dvd releases for in my opinion wonderfully underrated films like The Iron Giant, Cats Don't Dance, etc. the appropriate response would be 'no'.

Afrobean · 02-21-2010, 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KubrickFan

I like a dirty and gritty look, but I doubt it that the cell dust was an intended effect. It's sometimes really distracting, and I wouldn't mind if they cleaned that up.

Take out the phrase "cel dust" and replace with "film grain". Would you advocate scrubbing grain from an animated work just because it is "distracting" and "not intended"? The quirks of cel animation is what makes Batman TAS feel the way it does. Compare the later Justice League to Batman TAS. Actually compare the final season of Batman to the first ones. The style is heavily informed by the "archaic" animation techniques that lead to things like cel dust. Cut out those artifacts and the series loses a LOT of its appealing charm.

And notice that the original goal of the Batman TAS crew was to create what they believed could be visually mistaken as a Batman counterpart to Filmation's Superman cartoons. Makes me sick to think of Batman TAS glossed over with flat, edited colors.

Quote:

I think it wasn't really animated with the 1.85:1 ratio in mind.

Was it animated in open matte for 1.33:1? If the 1.85:1 frame looks strange, it could be due to the crew not being used to framing in widescreen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BD4ME

Well the DC dtv's, but catalog - I don't think so...

Yeah, because the film department is set apart from the direct-to-video stuff. Shame too, because I'm still waiting on a proper widescreen version of the Powerpuff Girls movie too. The TV division of WB puts out a pretty good series collection of PPG, and the only version of the movie available is a crappy, old pan-and-scan.

zahinn · 02-21-2010, 05:33 AM

I love this film.
I will buy this first day when WB releases is. I am also looking forward to Batman Beyond Return of the Joker.

I own these two movies in VHS and DVD, but I need a BD version. Hopefully, we get it this year.

Idioteque... · 02-21-2010, 05:56 AM

I think this will come out when Bruce Timm stops wasting his time. Nobody wants to see those crappy DTVs you're releasing. The stories are mediocre and the voice actors are horrible.

I want Timm to release this on bluray and then make a movie with the original cast of Batman TAS for a Hush movie.

McCrutchy · 02-21-2010, 06:09 AM

First of all, the cel dust is very prevalent in the series because it was drawn on black backgrounds, allowing dozens and dozens of particles of dirt to be visible on every frame that are not ideally supposed to be there. On the series DVDs, the creators lament this problem, and state plainly that they wish more, if not all of the dirt could be eliminated from the visual field. The removal of this dust (amongst any other well-crafted restorative processes) could actually render better detail and color vibrancy in the animation for HD, but unless incorrect methods are applied, the show would not appear "flat" or visually impaired in any way. Remember that this was broadcast in NTSC 480i in the early 90s, and the lack of resolution did much to hide things like cel dirt and dust, which, if left in, would be all the more obvious and distracting in 1080p.

As to Batman: Mask of the Phantasm, that was intended as a direct-to-video release until WB saw a chunk of it and decided it was good enough to release in theaters. The animators then had to go back and reanimate the cels for a 1.85:1 theatrical ratio in time for the Christmas 1993 release date. So while it was composed in 1.33:1, the end product was and should be in 1.85:1 widescreen.

Afrobean · 02-21-2010, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Idioteque...

The stories are mediocre and the voice actors are horrible.

I thought the voices on Public Enemies were good.

Quote:

I want Timm to release this on bluray and then make a movie with the original cast of Batman TAS for a Hush movie.

I think I'd rather have voice actors return, but take a hard, darker aesthetic approach more akin to the comic style.

KubrickFan · 02-22-2010, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Take out the phrase "cel dust" and replace with "film grain". Would you advocate scrubbing grain from an animated work just because it is "distracting" and "not intended"? The quirks of cel animation is what makes Batman TAS feel the way it does. Compare the later Justice League to Batman TAS. Actually compare the final season of Batman to the first ones. The style is heavily informed by the "archaic" animation techniques that lead to things like cel dust. Cut out those artifacts and the series loses a LOT of its appealing charm.

Since the grain is being removed from the Disney Classics with very good results, I wouldn't really mind it as long as the image doesn't suffer from it. I doubt it that simply removing the cell dust makes it look completely different than it does now. It'd still be a very dark show, and the animation would be the same. I'm also not talking about color changes or anything, but only about sometimes severe looking cell dust. I just think it's a bit too distracting, that's all.

Versatil · 02-25-2010, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BD4ME

It's become apparant that Warner Bros. doesn't give a crap about their hand-drawn animated films - if it's not CGI, stop-motion, motion-capture or anime - they don't care. Well the DC dtv's, but catalog - I don't think so...

Though have they ever really cared... looking at some of the previous dvd releases for in my opinion wonderfully underrated films like The Iron Giant, Cats Don't Dance, etc. the appropriate response would be 'no'.

Warner does not give a crap about BDs.

Rinzler · 02-27-2010, 08:36 PM

I saw that the DVD has (shiver) Stereo. For a theatrical film, a better soundtrack should exist/would appear on the BD.

12-20-2008, 09:49 PM	#1
McCrutchy Contributor Top contributor Member since:Dec 2008 Location:East Coast, USA Home Theater Gallery:2 4K collection:1263 Blu-ray collection:6773 DVD collection:253 Blu-ray reviews: 5 Trading Score:17	Batman: Mask of the Phantasm I really think this would look awesome on Blu-ray (in a much deserved Special Edition at that). I know B: TAS is probably unsalvageable for HD without a serious restoration (which we won't get until a fan gets high up at WB; maybe 20-30 years), but just so everybody remembers, this was released theatrically which means somewhere there is a 35mm print that can be scanned and transferred to 1080p. This was a great film that had some real depth for an animated film, let alone a children's animated film. The flipper DVD release is a shame and WB should have done this Batman classic up around the re-release of B: TAS in November. Hopefully someone agrees with me? Edit: I found these Youtube links to an HBO First Look episode on the film...I didn't even know it existed! Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlEfS...eature=related Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdS2h...eature=related Last edited by McCrutchy; 12-20-2008 at 10:11 PM.

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12-21-2008, 02:01 PM	#2
Red Hood Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Jul 2008 Blu-ray collection:33	Yeah that movie was awesome, hope they will do it someday.

12-21-2008, 06:49 PM	#3
Gone2HiDef Power Member Member since:Oct 2008 4K collection:123 Blu-ray collection:759 DVD collection:169 Blu-ray reviews:1 Trading Score:4	+1.

12-22-2008, 03:18 AM	#4
GOAT Banned Member since:Oct 2008 Location:Maine Blu-ray collection:112 Blu-ray reviews:10 Trading Score:53	All Batman needs to be on BLU... even if it doesnt look amazing i love my batman and want it in the collection!!

01-04-2009, 02:23 AM	#5
Jimmyboots Junior Member Member since:Jul 2008	I read somewhere, I think it was World's Finest that WB was considering a Blu-ray release of Mask of the Phantasm, and that we may see more Direct-to-DVD movies based on the various animated series in the DCAU. Here's hoping for an anouncement soon.

11-19-2009, 12:20 PM	#6
TopCow Active Member Member since:Feb 2009 4K collection:57 Blu-ray collection:919 Trading Score:12	For the love God, I hope this happens.

11-19-2009, 07:43 PM	#9
Goremageddon Active Member Top contributor Member since:Mar 2008 Location:New Mexico 4K collection:418 Blu-ray collection:2519 DVD collection:103 Blu-ray reviews:1 Trading Score:67	First, I'd buy it because it's a great movie. Second, I'd buy it based solely on the fact that my dvd is in a snapper case. Truly aweful packaging.

11-20-2009, 12:28 AM	#10
Propellarhead9 Blu-ray Guru Member since:Jul 2009 Location:Clarksville, Indiana 4K collection:498 Blu-ray collection:1721 Blu-ray reviews: 1 Trading Score:9	I would definitely pick it up if they do.

02-20-2010, 08:37 PM	#11
Versatil Active Member Member since:Apr 2008 Location:Montreal Blu-ray collection:22	Any news a year after?

02-20-2010, 08:55 PM	#12
BD4ME Active Member Member since:Nov 2009 Location:The Netherlands Blu-ray collection:79	It's become apparant that Warner Bros. doesn't give a crap about their hand-drawn animated films - if it's not CGI, stop-motion, motion-capture or anime - they don't care. Well the DC dtv's, but catalog - I don't think so... Though have they ever really cared... looking at some of the previous dvd releases for in my opinion wonderfully underrated films like The Iron Giant, Cats Don't Dance, etc. the appropriate response would be 'no'.

02-21-2010, 05:33 AM	#14
zahinn Special Member Member since:Feb 2009 4K collection:5 Blu-ray collection:150	I love this film. I will buy this first day when WB releases is. I am also looking forward to Batman Beyond Return of the Joker. I own these two movies in VHS and DVD, but I need a BD version. Hopefully, we get it this year.

02-21-2010, 05:56 AM	#15
Idioteque... Banned Member since:Sep 2009 Location:NJ Blu-ray collection:140	I think this will come out when Bruce Timm stops wasting his time. Nobody wants to see those crappy DTVs you're releasing. The stories are mediocre and the voice actors are horrible. I want Timm to release this on bluray and then make a movie with the original cast of Batman TAS for a Hush movie.

02-21-2010, 06:09 AM	#16
McCrutchy Contributor Top contributor Member since:Dec 2008 Location:East Coast, USA Home Theater Gallery:2 4K collection:1263 Blu-ray collection:6773 DVD collection:253 Blu-ray reviews: 5 Trading Score:17	First of all, the cel dust is very prevalent in the series because it was drawn on black backgrounds, allowing dozens and dozens of particles of dirt to be visible on every frame that are not ideally supposed to be there. On the series DVDs, the creators lament this problem, and state plainly that they wish more, if not all of the dirt could be eliminated from the visual field. The removal of this dust (amongst any other well-crafted restorative processes) could actually render better detail and color vibrancy in the animation for HD, but unless incorrect methods are applied, the show would not appear "flat" or visually impaired in any way. Remember that this was broadcast in NTSC 480i in the early 90s, and the lack of resolution did much to hide things like cel dirt and dust, which, if left in, would be all the more obvious and distracting in 1080p. As to Batman: Mask of the Phantasm, that was intended as a direct-to-video release until WB saw a chunk of it and decided it was good enough to release in theaters. The animators then had to go back and reanimate the cels for a 1.85:1 theatrical ratio in time for the Christmas 1993 release date. So while it was composed in 1.33:1, the end product was and should be in 1.85:1 widescreen.

02-27-2010, 08:36 PM	#20
Rinzler Blu-ray Guru Top contributor Member since:Sep 2009 4K collection:26 Blu-ray collection:919 DVD collection:142 Trading Score:1	I saw that the DVD has (shiver) Stereo. For a theatrical film, a better soundtrack should exist/would appear on the BD.

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