How do you live with 24p stutter on OLED?

[captainsolo]

I’m finally trying an OLED and in the process of setting up. (A80j) But the motion stutter on 24p is horrendous up close and I hate smoothing effects.

How does one get used to this? My hdcrt has phosphor trails that not everyone sees. Those I was able to get used to for viewing older content but this is something else entirely. I also was driven nuts by rainbow trails of older dlp projectors but depending on the model those could be somewhat acceptable.

4k LED seems only slightly better in lower frame rate stutter and there are big trade offs from an OLED panel. Maybe I’m just spoiled by hdcrt and plasma but this may be a deal breaker for me. The only thing I watch is 24p film material.

Does anyone have tips or advice on how to adjust to this? I’ll be playing around further with the Sony processing.

[oddbox83]

It's a Sony, so try the custom motion slider set to 1. That's the minimum of motion smoothing and you can tell it's a bit smoother but doesn't look like full video motion (anything higher does). I was rather impressed by the motion on my A95K when set to that, notably the absence of horrible motion artefacts my B8 used to give me even with TruMotion set to lowest.

I'm partially sensitive to OLED stutter, depends on the content and how it was shot. My B8 I just had to live with it as I couldn't deal with the motion smoothing artefacts. The Sony though, it's nice to know I've got a motion option if I need to enable it that won't drive me more nuts than the issue I'm trying to solve.

You can also try the BFI feature (the toggle under custom Motion settings), but I find 60hz BFI unusable do to both the flicker and the dimming effect.

[CatBus]

Just seconding BFI. And sadly, agreeing that OLED brightness is often inadequate for BFI and that it's plain wrong for 60Hz. There are always technical improvements in the pipeline (not just brighter displays and higher refresh rates, but content-aware BFI) that will eventually make OLED+BFI a great combo, but that hardly helps with current displays.

[captainsolo]

Originally Posted by oddbox83

It's a Sony, so try the custom motion slider set to 1. That's the minimum of motion smoothing but gets rid of stutter. I was rather impressed by the motion on my A95K when set to that, notably the absence of horrible motion artefacts my B8 used to give me even with TruMotion set to lowest.

I'm partially sensitive to OLED stutter, depends on the content and how it was shot. My B8 I just had to live with it as I couldn't deal with the motion smoothing artefacts. The Sony though, it's nice to know I've got a motion option if I need to enable it that won't drive me more nuts than the issue I'm trying to solve.

Is that the smoothness setting under Motionflow? That seems to be the one thing that helps slightly without going soap opera effect which comes into play at 2.

[dj_intrepid]

If you've never visited rtings.com, they have excellent settings recommendations for calibrating your monitor. You might try their recommendations to see how that works out for you.

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/so...-oled/settings

[oddbox83]

Originally Posted by captainsolo

Is that the smoothness setting under Motionflow? That seems to be the one thing that helps slightly without going soap opera effect which comes into play at 2.

Yep, that's the one.

[oddbox83]

Originally Posted by CatBus

There are always technical improvements in the pipeline (not just brighter displays and higher refresh rates, but content-aware BFI) that will eventually make OLED+BFI a great combo, but that hardly helps with current displays.

LG had 120hz BFI modes on the C1 and G1, which while I never saw in action personally was highly praised round these parts. I've no idea why they dropped it on the 2022 models.

[teddyballgame]

Originally Posted by captainsolo

I’m finally trying an OLED and in the process of setting up. (A80j) But the motion stutter on 24p is horrendous up close and I hate smoothing effects.

How does one get used to this? My hdcrt has phosphor trails that not everyone sees. Those I was able to get used to for viewing older content but this is something else entirely. I also was driven nuts by rainbow trails of older dlp projectors but depending on the model those could be somewhat acceptable.

Honestly it's probably just going to take some time to adjust but you are giving up motion resolution there's no way around that fact. CRTs are still undefeated though in terms of how responsive they are with minimal blur. I'm still hoping that something like truecut (metadata for motion) will get traction because it would really help improve oled's sample and hold shortcomings. Smoothness 1 on Sony usually helps tamp it down a little but sometimes big panning scenes are still gonna chop. You might also play around with the "clearness" value under motionflow settings. You strike me as a guy who will be watching SDR at 100 nits so there's probably headroom there to add some black frames and not lose much with luminance.

[captainsolo]

That's what I'm figuring. You're right in your guess about my viewing habits..of course a big chunk of my test discs are new scans of B&W classics. There's one panning shot in ISLE OF THE DEAD in particular when all the characters are shown one at a time that's really bad in terms of showing the stuttering up close.

I've seen some things about truecut and hope it or something similar gets implemented for preserving motion...and not the high frame rate conversion Cameron has done on Titanic apparently.

Having the BFI at 1 only drops the brightness a tiny amount and does seem to improve things a little bit with or without the addition of smoothness at 1.

[tcripe]

On my Vizio OLED you have to have judder reduction on at least 2 or 3 or it looks like a slideshow.

[hashirshabbir]

Living with 24p stutter on an OLED TV, like the A80J, can be challenging, especially if you're used to CRT or plasma displays with different characteristics. One way to address this issue is to explore your TV's settings and try adjusting motion processing options. Experiment with motion smoothing settings to find a balance that reduces stutter without introducing unwanted smoothing effects.

Additionally, consider sitting further from the TV, as this can minimize the impact of the stutter when viewing up close. Ultimately, it may take some time to adapt to the differences between OLED and your previous displays, but with adjustments and patience, you can potentially improve your viewing experience for 24p content.

[Rottweiler30]

The sole reason im still 1080p and want to pull my hair out every time I read 'wheres the 4k', 'no 4k no sale' etc.

The philistines killed Plasma for a technology that struggles with film being displayed at its native framerate, and introduces motion blur like all sample and hold displays.

[ThisIsJonny]

For my Sony A90J, I've seen the recommendation of 2 for smoothness and either 1 or minimum for clearness (some suggest not messing with clearness, hence the minimum setting). It may depend on content, but I generally have my smoothness set to max and clearness at minimum. Also set smooth gradation to low or medium.

[Spooked]

Originally Posted by Rottweiler30

The sole reason im still 1080p and want to pull my hair out every time I read 'wheres the 4k', 'no 4k no sale' etc.

And the sole reason I want to go back to 1080p.

[RFK]

I'll never adjust to LCD, LED or OLED for movies nor would I want to. I had a well reviewed Samsung LCD and gave it to my grandson because I couldn't stand the motion issues. Currently have 2 Panasonic plasmas which I love and use a JVC projector for big screen viewing. If these motion issues continue to be ignored by tv manufacturers these plasmas are probably my last tv's.

[Spooked]

Originally Posted by RFK

I'll never adjust to LCD, LED or OLED for movies nor would I want to. I had a well reviewed Samsung LCD and gave it to my grandson because I couldn't stand the motion issues. Currently have 2 Panasonic plasmas which I love and use a JVC projector for big screen viewing. If these motion issues continue to be ignored by tv manufacturers these plasmas are probably my last tv's.

I keep looking at projectors, but I don't want the enormous screen size - nor the price tag. Find me a projected image between 43"-50" for under $750.00 and I'm sold.

I was able to turn off the motion software on my Samsung from 2014, but anything on the market now? It's just a mess. I regret purchasing my current television, and actually end up watching most things on my computer just because the monitor handles the framerate in the manner I'm accustomed to. The Sony A90K can be great at times, but it's inconsistent; every time those motion issues do occur, it completely derails my viewing experience (Not unlike audio sync issues, which also drive me crazy. ).

[Derb]

Originally Posted by oddbox83

LG had 120hz BFI modes on the C1 and G1, which while I never saw in action personally was highly praised round these parts. I've no idea why they dropped it on the 2022 models.

I messed with it on my C1. Refresh rate looks like 30hz in Cinematic Movement setting.

[Rottweiler30]

I dread to think how the beach scene in Atonement looks.

One of the frustrating things in Oled and Led victory over plasma is that the improvements were made to areas people would never have missed at the expense of fundamental parts of filmmaking being spoiled.

Who watched DVDs back in the day and thought 'if only the picture was bright enough to melt my eyeballs? Or blu ray thinking ' it looks nice but I wish there was even more detail even if id barely notice it under 80 inches'?

Where as, panning shots litter some of the greatest films ever made. And theres one or two films shot in 24p too!!!!
This is what happens when joe public vote with their wallets to buy a sexy slimmer TV to watch the news on.

The pros and cons lists that was all over the net said it all...

Plasma...Great contrast, motion clarity, black levels, overall picture quality.

Led...slimmer design, lower power consumption....

[Keoma]

Originally Posted by Rottweiler30

The philistines killed Plasma for a technology that struggles with film being displayed at its native framerate, and introduces motion blur like all sample and hold displays.

Amen! My VT60 plasma looks better (overall) than my A80J oled, precisely for this reason. And I love being able to watch 24fps content in the 48hz mode on the plasma. It looks like film, period. Most folks today do not even remember what film used to look like when projected, but I love that "feel" and the Panasonic plasma is the only display I know of that can faithfully recreate it.

[Keoma]

Originally Posted by captainsolo

I’m finally trying an OLED and in the process of setting up. (A80j) But the motion stutter on 24p is horrendous up close and I hate smoothing effects.

How does one get used to this? My hdcrt has phosphor trails that not everyone sees. Those I was able to get used to for viewing older content but this is something else entirely. I also was driven nuts by rainbow trails of older dlp projectors but depending on the model those could be somewhat acceptable.

4k LED seems only slightly better in lower frame rate stutter and there are big trade offs from an OLED panel. Maybe I’m just spoiled by hdcrt and plasma but this may be a deal breaker for me. The only thing I watch is 24p film material.

Does anyone have tips or advice on how to adjust to this? I’ll be playing around further with the Sony processing.

I feel your pain.

I have the same TV and went crazy for months until I was able to dial everything in and obtain something I was more or less happy with. It is a great set, so be patient, but it is not a plasma (sadly). I own a Panasonic VT60 plasma as well as the A80J, and the plasma is still superior in many ways (it is also noisiy as hell, gets crazy hot, it buzzes, etc., etc., so nothing is perfect).

The only way I could make motion blur tolerable (to my eyes) while maintaining the "film look" I love, without any soap-opera effect, was to set "Motionflow" in the following manner:

Smoothness: MIN
Clearness: MAX (darker, full BFI mode... but I like this "flicker" effect, since it reminds me of a film projection). This *will* make everything darker, so you need to adjust the settings under "brightness", including gamma, accordingly.

Also, turn all the gimmicky settings like "black adjust", "advanced contrast enhancer", etc., "off".

I use gamma at -2 (similar to 2.4 on the Panasonic plasma).

Try the above and give your eyes sometime to adjust.