Blu-rays encoded in the incorrect color space - Fix?

[drb124]

I have been looking around for a definite answer to this question. A few blu-rays slip through the cracks and get accidentally encoded in the wrong color space, most notably the Sony's recent black crush issue. But my question concerns the inverse of that when blu-rays are encoded with the black levels too high or bright which results in milky blacks.

One I know of and have gotten confirmation on is The Blind Woman's Curse from Arrow (UK release only). This was corrected for the US release.

I have read, and seee the effects of changing the RGB setting on these titles to full in order to correct the problem. My question is if doing this is an actual fix that results in a display as if the blu-ray had been properly encoded or if it is just a band-aid that get you somewhere close to what it would have looked like?

[nitin]

Originally Posted by drb124

I have been looking around for a definite answer to this question. A few blu-rays slip through the cracks and get accidentally encoded in the wrong color space, most notably the Sony's recent black crush issue. But my question concerns the inverse of that when blu-rays are encoded with the black levels too high or bright which results in milky blacks.

One I know of and have gotten confirmation on is The Blind Woman's Curse from Arrow (UK release only). This was corrected for the US release.

I have read, and seee the effects of changing the RGB setting on these titles to full in order to correct the problem. My question is if doing this is an actual fix that results in a display as if the blu-ray had been properly encoded or if it is just a band-aid that get you somewhere close to what it would have looked like?

If it's actually the incorrect colour space, I believe changing the RGB input is an actual fix. From memory, I tried comparing the UK Blind Woman's Curse which I already owned with the RGB change against my US version when it arrived via the Indiegogo perk and they looked identical as far as I could tell.

But maybe lyris can chime in for a more definitive answer.

[drb124]

Originally Posted by nitin

If it's actually the incorrect colour space, I believe changing the RGB input is an actual fix. From memory, I tried comparing the UK Blind Woman's Curse which I already owned with the RGB change against my US version when it arrived via the Indiegogo perk and they looked identical as far as I could tell.

But maybe lyris can chime in for a more definitive answer.

Thanks for the input. I don't have any issue swapping over, but since some of us, myself included go to some amount of trouble to get our sets calibrated, I just wanted to be sure that if I did the RGB fix it would in fact give me accurate greyscale, etc.

I have the UK Blind Woman's Curse, and I was told by an Arrow rep that they planned to fix the issue on the UK release when it was repressed. It was not clear if the corrected one was on the market yet or not. I inquired further, but it has been about 3 weeks and I have not heard anything back.

[Geoff D]

Yes, changing the player's levels from Limited to Full/Enhanced will correct such a problem (also seen on the UK Blu-rays of Rumble in the Bronx and Drunken Master 2) BUT because the source has been encoded far too brightly the appreciable bit depth is reduced, so stuff like banding may become more obvious, "may" being the operative word. Rumble and DM2 look fine when corrected but the French edition of Kingdom of Heaven has some obvious banding on trickier gradations of light and shade, like flickering torches.

[barrett75]

is it possible to have a complete list of all BDs with incorrect color space?

[drb124]

Originally Posted by barrett75

is it possible to have a complete list of all BDs with incorrect color space?

If you google it, there is a thread over at AVS, and there is a list somewhere on this site. I will see if I can find it. Most of these are not absolutes, but guesses based on other releases and the general look of the transfers.

[barrett75]

Originally Posted by drb124

I will see if I can find it.

i'd really appreciate it as i can't find it :-(

[Tom09]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Yes, changing the player's levels from Limited to Full/Enhanced will correct such a problem (also seen on the UK Blu-rays of Rumble in the Bronx and Drunken Master 2) BUT because the source has been encoded far too brightly the appreciable bit depth is reduced, so stuff like banding may become more obvious, "may" being the operative word. Rumble and DM2 look fine when corrected but the French edition of Kingdom of Heaven has some obvious banding on trickier gradations of light and shade, like flickering torches.

So the cloudy and washed out look especially in dark scenes is not a result of wrong colour space?

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Tom09

So the cloudy and washed out look especially in dark scenes is not a result of wrong colour space?

I'm saying that for the affected titles it IS very much a case of the wrong levels being applied during mastering BUT some anomalies in the image could still occur even when 'fixed' at the display end.

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by drb124

I have been looking around for a definite answer to this question. A few blu-rays slip through the cracks and get accidentally encoded in the wrong color space, most notably the Sony's recent black crush issue. But my question concerns the inverse of that when blu-rays are encoded with the black levels too high or bright which results in milky blacks.

One I know of and have gotten confirmation on is The Blind Woman's Curse from Arrow (UK release only). This was corrected for the US release.

I have read, and seee the effects of changing the RGB setting on these titles to full in order to correct the problem. My question is if doing this is an actual fix that results in a display as if the blu-ray had been properly encoded or if it is just a band-aid that get you somewhere close to what it would have looked like?

This happened with the Gatchaman anime series. Milky blacks and colors due to the wrong color space. They also stretched out all the extras from 4:3 to 16:9. A totally botched release.

[mar3o]

On my Panasonic player, I have 2 RGB settings - RGB standard and RGB enhanced. Am I correct that RGB enhanced is the 0-255 setting that I would select to correct any discs that are authored in the wrong color space? Is RGB enhanced the same as RGB full?


This won't result in black crush, will it?

[chip75]

Originally Posted by mar3o

On my Panasonic player, I have 2 RGB settings - RGB standard and RGB enhanced. Am I correct that RGB enhanced is the 0-255 setting that I would select to correct any discs that are authored in the wrong color space?

It depends on what's wrong with them, if they've been set to high and the blacks are grey or the video is coming out too dark (but the information is still there like The X-Files Season Eight) as the wrong information is sent to the display from the disc. You can run into several different authoring issues.

Originally Posted by mar3o

Is RGB enhanced the same as RGB full?

It is.

Originally Posted by mar3o

This won't result in black crush, will it?

If the image is too dark and changing the HDMI level with the TV settings to high or normal doesn't bring back the detail, then it's crushing the blacks.

Changing the RGB settings can be very much player/display dependent. Sending 0-255 may not do anything if the display expects that signal. But dropping HDMI levels down may darken the image.

[mar3o]

I guess the only way to know is to try. Gatchaman collector's set is on sale and I'm tempted but I believe the set has incorrect black levels. Out of principle it would be nice not to buy it but it's a good price and I have some Amazon credit too, but I hate to buy it if I can't correct it during playback.

[nitin]

Yeah pick a disc with known incorrect levels and switch to the other setting on your player and see if it does anything. RGB enhanced sounds right though.