Blu-ray vs HD-DVD

[Tomokka]

I am not a real expert in this subject, but I just wonder how so many think that blue-ray will clearly be the winner here?

First of what i have read from the internet the cost of a single blue-ray disk will be 2-3 bigger than a HD-DVD disk. There was also some talk about how sony is planning on reducing blue-ray disk cost in the future, but at best it is sayed to cost twice as mutch as a HD-DVD disk.

The name blue-ray sounds alot cooler than HD-DVD but i think its not very consumer friendly. Most of the consumers probably dont know anything about eighter format or the ongoing format war, but still the name dvd sound familiar and safer than blue-ray.

Even though the blue-ray can store more data from what i have read in the internet the quality of the picture is the same ad hd-dvd even though the blue-ray will cost more.

Dont most of the old dvd companys back HD-DVD instead of blue-ray? I have read in the internet that many organization which consist of companies that are somehow involved with dvd seem to all back HD-DVD. Also when Intel and Microsoft joined the HD-DVD group and Apple decided to back both, doesent this give a huge advantage for HD-DVD in the computer markets?

Am i missing something here?

[Ascended_Saiyan]

Originally Posted by Tomokka

I am not a real expert in this subject, but I just wonder how so many think that blue-ray will clearly be the winner here?

First of what i have read from the internet the cost of a single blue-ray disk will be 2-3 bigger than a HD-DVD disk. There was also some talk about how sony is planning on reducing blue-ray disk cost in the future, but at best it is sayed to cost twice as mutch as a HD-DVD disk.

The name blue-ray sounds alot cooler than HD-DVD but i think its not very consumer friendly. Most of the consumers probably dont know anything about eighter format or the ongoing format war, but still the name dvd sound familiar and safer than blue-ray.

Even though the blue-ray can store more data from what i have read in the internet the quality of the picture is the same ad hd-dvd even though the blue-ray will cost more.

Dont most of the old dvd companys back HD-DVD instead of blue-ray? I have read in the internet that many organization which consist of companies that are somehow involved with dvd seem to all back HD-DVD. Also when Intel and Microsoft joined the HD-DVD group and Apple decided to back both, doesent this give a huge advantage for HD-DVD in the computer markets?

Am i missing something here?

You're actually missing a lot. A lot of the information you have is false. Start by reading THIS.

- An analyst report

- Here's an earlier post from me

Did you know that a 25GB Blu-ray BD-R costs $12 and the HD-DVD 15GB -R costs $13? The price per GB is much lower for Blu-ray discs.

[hmurchison]

Blu-Ray costs more but the hope is that Sony and other replicator partners can improve yields to the point where the cost differential is negligble.

Just shipping drives in the PS3 will open up opportunties for Sony to increase manufacturing. Having Matsushita onboard helps as well.

Right now the race is hard to say. The PS3 could be an absolute monster. If people take to it like a duck to water and watch movies then HD DVD could be down for the count.

If the PS3 doesn't impress moviewise then HD DVD has enough inertia to sqeak through and eat a bit of Blu-Ray's lunch.

CES 2007 is going to be very fun. Watch for the positioning for 2007. It'll be key of course.

[Tomokka]

Originally Posted by Ascended_Saiyan

You're actually missing a lot. A lot of the information you have is false. Start by reading THIS.

- An analyst report

- Here's an earlier post from me

Did you know that a 25GB Blu-ray BD-R costs $12 and the HD-DVD 15GB -R costs $13? The price per GB is much lower for Blu-ray discs.

I am talking about how mutch does it cost to produce 1 disk, not how mutch consumers have to pay to get one. The production cost that i have read state that it costs alot more to produce 1 blue ray disk than 1 HD-DVD disk. But the bigges disadvantage blue-ray has if you ask me is Sony . I am not really sure has Sony won a single format war since they lost to vcr with their format betamax that was techinically better than vcr. Also you didnt comment at all about the companies that are supporting the formats. After Apple started supporting both and Intel and Microsoft joined HD-DVD doesent that give HD-DVD the ruling position when it comes to computers? I mean if Microsofts next Windows will have features that support only HD-DVD doesent that give HD-DVD insane boost, not to mention if the biggest chip maker in the world Intel does the same?

[theknub]

here u go
https://www.blu-ray.com/faq/#bluray_vs_hddvd_comparison

also, manufacturing costs are not more expensive from my memory. there is a thread on here discussing this but i can't find it at the moment

[theknub]

tomo... it isn't sony vs the world (a common misconception). it is the BDA vs toshiba and microshaft (and a few others). the BDA accounts for most major studios (disney, warner, fox, sony, and paramount), most CE manufacturers (sony, pioneer, panasonic, samsung, mits, etc) and also some software companies such as sun. it isn't sony vs the world

[Tomokka]

Originally Posted by theknub

here u go
https://www.blu-ray.com/faq/#bluray_vs_hddvd_comparison

also, manufacturing costs are not more expensive from my memory. there is a thread on here discussing this but i can't find it at the moment

I am prity sure they are more expencive other wise there wouldent be a war would there? A clear advantage also is that HD-DVD can be made using almoust the same machines as used for dvd:s. Otherwise blue-ray is probably better in everyway, exsept the price and maby the company support.

[Tomokka]

Originally Posted by theknub

tomo... it isn't sony vs the world (a common misconception). it is the BDA vs toshiba and microshaft (and a few others). the BDA accounts for most major studios (disney, warner, fox, sony, and paramount), most CE manufacturers (sony, pioneer, panasonic, samsung, mits, etc) and also some software companies such as sun. it isn't sony vs the world

I knew that Sony wasnt alone, Toshiba isnt alone eigher. But everybody got to agree that Sonys track record isnt very good . I dont really have any opinion which one will win , I am no fan boy, but makes me wonder why companies like Microsoft and Intel which both are the biggest at what they do join HD-DVD and not Blue-ray? Hard to belive those two companies do anthing with out checking all the options. Also why did Apple leave blue-ray? And started supporting both?

[Spankey]

I dont really have any opinion which one will win , I am no fan boy,

Had me fooled...

[iceman]

Ever heard about compact disc (CD)? Sony + Philips are the creators.

Current BD players cost about $1000 and can do 1080p. Current HD-DVD players can't do 1080p and cost less. Next gen HD-DVD player can do 1080p and will cost about $1000. No price advantage.

Also, Apple hasn't left BDA, they are just supporting both formats.

How is Intel going to support HD-DVD? Intel Pentium, now with HD-DVD support!

Microsoft is supporting HD-DVD by not including it in their Xbox 360....

[Tomokka]

Originally Posted by sltmag

Had me fooled...

I get that alot

[phloyd]

Perhaps we can add a new forum - call it the 'war zone' and toss any thread wanting to do HD DVD to BD comparisons into that forum.

And keep this discussion area for Bluray and associated discussion?

If there is a place for all these tired arguments, at least it will reduce the clutter in here. We could even have some stickies that talk about the various strengths and weaknesses.

Personally I have no interest in seeing HD DVD stuff in this forum. I can go to other places to see this.

Thoughts?

[Tomokka]

Originally Posted by Iceman

Ever heard about compact disc (CD)? Sony + Philips are the creators.

Current BD players cost about $1000 and can do 1080p. Current HD-DVD players can't do 1080p and cost less. Next gen HD-DVD player can do 1080p and will cost about $1000. No price advantage.

Also, Apple hasn't left BDA, they are just supporting both formats.

How is Intel going to support HD-DVD? Intel Pentium, now with HD-DVD support!

Microsoft is supporting HD-DVD by not including it in their Xbox 360....

Didnt know that cd was Sonys, kudos to them. Didint Sony also create MD? I think Intels how page will have info on how Intel will support HD-DVD. I think Microsoft will add features to their next Windows and to the next Xbox they will create.

[Spankey]

Personally I have no interest in seeing HD DVD stuff in this forum. I can go to other places to see this.

I agree. I have read all the HD-DVD talking points in the past. Everyone of them is innacurate and have been refuted time and time again. The influx of these posts has increased in the last few days.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by Tomokka

Didnt know that cd was Sonys, kudos to them.

Sony and Philips.

[dobyblue]

You are wrong in who is backing HD-DVD and who is backing Blu-ray.

If you look at the founding members of DVD and founding members of Blu-ray you'll see the list is almost identical.

DVD founding members.
http://www.dvdforum.org/about-mission.htm

Hitachi, Ltd.
Matsushita Electric Industrial Co. Ltd.
Mitsubishi Electric Corporation
Pioneer Electronic Corporation
Royal Philips Electronics N.V.
Sony Corporation
Thomson
Time Warner Inc.
Toshiba Corporation
Victor Company of Japan, Ltd.

Blu-ray Disc Association board of directors
http://www.blu-raydisc.com/general_i...009/Index.html

Apple
Dell
HP
Hitachi
LG
Mitsubishi Electric
Panasonic (Matsushita)
Pioneer
Philips
Samsung
Sharp
Sony
Sun Microsystems
TDK
Thomson
Twentieth Century Fox
Walt Disney
Warner Bros.

A lot of familiar names no?
That's 8 of the 10 founding members of DVD are backing Blu-ray.
Also MS are releasing Vista on DVD-ROM, not on HD-DVD-ROM. Their support of HD-DVD does little to bolster HD-DVD sales outside of the 360 add-on.

[Shadowself]

Seems every few days a new persona show up in these forums making the same general statements (not worded exactly the same but variations on the same theme). When the initial comments are slapped down they come up with "what about ...". When that is refuted we get a "but there's this..." etc. etc. etc.

There are stickies here which answer 80% of the questions asked. Another 19+% of the questions are answered in the other threads running through here. When they don't even try to do any searches or read the stickies they don't want the answers. They just want to annoy.

It is unfortunate that we must wade through these personas (I won't even claim they are more than two or three people) in order to have legitimate discussions as well as ask and answer real questions. If this were that other forum and they had a less pro HD DVD bend they'd have been bounced by now. This forum does a fairly good job of helping the legitimate newcomers, but sometimes the trolling gets old.

While I do appreciate this board's mode of operation, I sometimes wonder if we're just too nice.

[hmurchison]

Guys calm down. If you feel strongly about something then it's only appropriate to see if your argument can withstand criticism.

The beaty is that there simply isn't enough information regarding either format to really ascertain which format will survive.

It's not about refuting conjecture with more conjecture but rather posting how you feel and checking back in the future to see if your assumptions were correct.

I agree though if you don't have to stomach for a little debate them a "smackdown" topic is where the battle should ensue. Putting on my armor right now.

[PurpleAardvark]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

You are wrong in who is backing HD-DVD and who is backing Blu-ray.

If you look at the founding members of DVD and founding members of Blu-ray you'll see the list is almost identical.

DVD founding members.
http://www.dvdforum.org/about-mission.htm

Blu-ray Disc Association board of directors
http://www.blu-raydisc.com/general_i...009/Index.html

A lot of familiar names no?
That's 8 of the 10 founding members of DVD are backing Blu-ray.
Also MS are releasing Vista on DVD-ROM, not on HD-DVD-ROM. Their support of HD-DVD does little to bolster HD-DVD sales outside of the 360 add-on.

I see alot of quailty names in that group. Anthor factor were I feel HD DVD is lacking.
Toshiba is known for its lack of quaility in dvd players. Go to any electronics store BB, CC ect.... and tell them you want to buy an toshiba player and ask if it is the best player in it is price range. You will get a big fat NO, and a recomendation for a different player. RCA is no better.
Now go in to that same store and ask about a sony DVD player. You will get a positive reaction.
So with that said when buying a next gen player, who would I trust more, BD by far. Yes BD players cost more but i would rather pay the extra and have less head aches. I have gone thourgh 4 defective HD A1's and i still have the same BD P1000, no defects and no problems. So that is 5 HD players to 1 BD player. I am not the only one who has had this type of luck either.
Both HD and BD have there lemon movies, and there great movies. The review of MI 3 on BD crushes HD, surpassing it in every way. The SQ imo is better on BD by far.
The PS3 is going to rock he boat. It is par with the other BD players with a few less options. The XBOX360 add on is going to be sub par. Reports now stand as having problems with black and grey contrasts. Make sence seeing you have add it on and it is not part of the system. Who wants that, in fact it may hurt HD rather than help it.
MS is not that big in the movie industry, so to say the are the biggest at what they do is inncorrect in this case. Most of there money comes from software
Not computers. Alot of people hate MS too. I am one of them. I own a 360 and that is all I will own from them.
Here is a fact that no person can dispute, BD can get 100% studio support, HD cannot. Sony and fox are BD to the end. To say other wise is just stupid (I did have one HDfanboy tell me that sony would be on the HD trail by the end of the year. Can we say RETARD!!!).
Take this anyway you will, but I see stuff leaning tward BD. If I had to guess on what will happen, HD will fail with in 2 years. BD will be a clear cut winner or both formats will fail. I don't forsee HD DVD going any further than it is right now. There is no room for improvements or advances to give it an advantage over BD.

[hmurchison]

Originally Posted by PurpleAardvark

The review of MI 3 on BD crushes HD, surpassing it in every way. The SQ imo is better on BD by far.

Oh really?

What about this one?

http://www.docdvd.com/bluray_reviews_14366.htm

This Blu-ray comes in second place to its HD-DVD counterpart, but its still fantastic. Its nearly perfect and without any blemishes. The colors are rich and beautiful.

or

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/miss...ssibleiii.html

http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/missi...ssibleiii.html

Peter says both look the same. HD DVD version has Dolby Digital+ and IME Interactivity. The Blu-Ray version lacks these.

PurpleAardvark how is no interactivity and using an older version of Dolby Digital "Surpassing HD DVD" in every way? Can you point me to some 3rd party reviews that corroborate your hypothesis here?