Bipole dipole questions

[navyman]

I am in the process of upgrading my home theater. I purchased an Onkyo 606 a few weeks ago and just took the plunge and bought polk monitor 70's for my fronts . My next purchase is either going to be a decent center channel speaker or some new sorrounds. The Onkyo is capable of 7.1 but I think i am going to bi-amp the fronts to maximize their preformance and just use the Onkyo as a 5.1 system. Plus it will result in less wires that I need to route through my apartment.
I am upgrading from an onkyo htib. It was a stupid idea to buy a htib and I probably won't be able to salvage any of the speakers that came with it. Now for my center speaker I have been looking at some of the polk line and they suggest the cs-2. I was wondering if there are beter alternatives and if spending 400 dollars for a center speaker would match up with the 70's.
My main question however is in regards to the surrounds. The whole bipole dipole thing has really caught my attention but I am not sure if my setup could take full advantage of this feature. I was looking at the polk fx4's and they are beautiful speakers. If anyone can give me any suggestions I would greatly appreciate it.

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by navyman

The whole bipole dipole thing has really caught my attention but I am not sure if my setup could take full advantage of this feature. I was looking at the polk fx4's and they are beautiful speakers. If anyone can give me any suggestions I would greatly appreciate it.

I think bipole/dipole speakers would benefit any home theater. But they can be fairly expensive. (as im sure you've noticed )

if its just a yes or no question? yes, id get some.

[Riff Magnum]

In a 7.1 setup, what speakers are ideal for side surround and what speakers are ideal for rear surround? I get confused with bipole dipole applications.

[jomari]

it depends on what you listen to,

if done properly (spl meter, proper speaker placement, acoustic treatments to reduce reverbations)

direct radiating speakers are great when watching movies, and gives you the surround effect without adding 'spatial' effects...

bipoles/dipoles are great at creating a surround environment. beautifully used it can create an orchestra hall, and give you the sound that some people prefer in a concert hall. because it does not directly catch your attention, it reduces the pinpoint location of your speakers, leaving the person attentive to the fronts.

consider a concert dvd like the eagles hell freezes over, or even their latest one. if you like to test it, try to see if you can 'move' your surrounds and have them face towards the wall (yes, its unorthodox), and take a seat in the cockpit. if you like em where you hear the 'reflections', great. if it bothers you, then, well, at least you didnt drop that moolah on em.

so, in summary,

movies? direct radiating speakers
music? bi/dipoles.

some speaker companies actually allow you to have both. so pick your flavor and get back to us.

oh, and thank you, for upgrading from a htib combo into a real home theater

[Riff Magnum]

i'm now even more confused, because i've always heard that direct speakers are better for music and bipoles and dipoles are better for movies.

[jomari]

Originally Posted by Riff Magnum

i'm now even more confused, because i've always heard that direct speakers are better for music and bipoles and dipoles are better for movies.

its a matter of personal preference riff. in my opinion...i actually dont like bipoles/dipoles. tried em before, and well, you might as well have 7.1 direct radiating speakers instead of the bi/dipoles, since you are looking for a 'spatial' environment.

but as i mentioned, thats just my 2 cents.

[MPDIEHL]

Im my dealings with these speaker types I have found the placement of the speakers to be more important than what is playing.
If the speakers will be placed to the listeners sides then Bi-pole should be selected on the speakers.
If the speakers are going to be placed behind the listening position then Di-pole should be selected.
(I am of course speaking of speakers with a selection switch such as the polk FX series)
The bottom line is what sounds good to you..... Hook them up and try both ways, simply leave the switch where you hear the best sound.

[jomari]

thys my suggestion, "if done properly"...

nice horns btw mp... been a while since ive seen em...

[Riff Magnum]

But...... are bipole/dipoles better than direct/bookshelf type speakers in a 7.1 environment? Seems most side and rear surround speakers are aimed slightly above the listeners head anyways, so you wouldn't necessarily be getting direct sound from directional speakers, correct?
If the wife allows, i will be using diffusion and absorption panels and possibly bass traps to even out the room.

[jomari]

Originally Posted by Riff Magnum

But...... are bipole/dipoles better than direct/bookshelf type speakers in a 7.1 environment? Seems most side and rear surround speakers are aimed slightly above the listeners head anyways, so you wouldn't necessarily be getting direct sound from directional speakers, correct?

yes, but then again, you have to have the proper amount of spacing and placement as well to achieve the same effect you'd want in a good movie theater.

Originally Posted by Riff Magnum

If the wife allows, i will be using diffusion and absorption panels and possibly bass traps to even out the room.

this shouldnt even be a question. :P who dah man? you are sir, YOU are.

worse gets to worse, point to the curtains that you hated for oh so long.

[MPDIEHL]

Better....No, Different....Yes
I prefer the sounds of the dipoles im using for surrounds... I could haave simply used 5 matching speakers but after listening I decided to match the front three and go with Di-pole surrounds

[jomari]

Originally Posted by MPDIEHL

Better....No, Different....Yes
I prefer the sounds of the dipoles im using for surrounds... I could haave simply used 5 matching speakers but after listening I decided to match the front three and go with Di-pole surrounds

as mentioned, its all a matter of personal preference.

if we had to go 'by the book' on this one, we'd all be in 15x20 rooms staring at black walls, and have the same speakers, same product line, and (IMO) horrible looking popcorn machines in the foyer.

[DiverSpear]

Moment of derail. Navyman how are you liking Corpus Christi? MCM's will work you to death, won't they.

[navyman]

Originally Posted by DiverSpear

Moment of derail. Navyman how are you liking Corpus Christi? MCM's will work you to death, won't they.

It's not too bad. My crew is fantastic and my men are some of the most intelligent service members I have ever seen. My main problem is that these ships were only meant to last 10 years so they are not very sea worthy. We spend more time fixing them then we do using them. The area is very nice though and it is a nice change from New York City. Here you can actually look someone in the eye without worrying about getting stabbed.

[Johnny Vinyl]

I've thought about a 6.1 setup and I have 2 questions. The "sixth" will be placed on the wall behind my couch.

1. Bipole or dipole speaker?
2. My couch is against the wall and would literally have to be mounted above my head. Would that be pointless?

[DiverSpear]

Originally Posted by navyman

It's not too bad. My crew is fantastic and my men are some of the most intelligent service members I have ever seen. My main problem is that these ships were only meant to last 10 years so they are not very sea worthy. We spend more time fixing them then we do using them. The area is very nice though and it is a nice change from New York City. Here you can actually look someone in the eye without worrying about getting stabbed.

I found out they sold off my ship to Greece and decommissioned the rest of the MHC's. As far as being sea worthy, trust me when you head through a mine field that is the one ship you want to be on.

[jomari]

Originally Posted by John72953

I've thought about a 6.1 setup and I have 2 questions. The "sixth" will be placed on the wall behind my couch.

1. Bipole or dipole speaker?
2. My couch is against the wall and would literally have to be mounted above my head. Would that be pointless?

try it out for kicks. heck it might cost you a little time and a lot of speaker wire... but experiment. a good theater is always in for some trial and error...

id say pass. but thats just me.

[fronn]

Originally Posted by navyman

I am in the process of upgrading my home theater. I purchased an Onkyo 606 a few weeks ago and just took the plunge and bought polk monitor 70's for my fronts . My next purchase is either going to be a decent center channel speaker or some new sorrounds. The Onkyo is capable of 7.1 but I think i am going to bi-amp the fronts to maximize their preformance and just use the Onkyo as a 5.1 system. Plus it will result in less wires that I need to route through my apartment.
I am upgrading from an onkyo htib. It was a stupid idea to buy a htib and I probably won't be able to salvage any of the speakers that came with it. Now for my center speaker I have been looking at some of the polk line and they suggest the cs-2. I was wondering if there are beter alternatives and if spending 400 dollars for a center speaker would match up with the 70's.
My main question however is in regards to the surrounds. The whole bipole dipole thing has really caught my attention but I am not sure if my setup could take full advantage of this feature. I was looking at the polk fx4's and they are beautiful speakers. If anyone can give me any suggestions I would greatly appreciate it.

I think you'll find most pros will tell you to avoid any speaker that depends on wall reflections for its sound quality... unless you can do it right (custom install by someone who knows what they are doing -- not from bestbuy).

Room accoustics are hard enough to deal with without depending on them so directly like that... I'd say absolutely stay away from bipoles/dipole speakers.

On a side note, there are two types of dipole speakers -- ones that are used for rears a lot (the ones we are talking about in this thread) and then there are ones that essentially house the driver on a baffle with no box (the rear of the driver is exposed)... those tend to be quite fantastic when designed right (especially the mid range).

[fronn]

Originally Posted by John72953

I've thought about a 6.1 setup and I have 2 questions. The "sixth" will be placed on the wall behind my couch.

1. Bipole or dipole speaker?
2. My couch is against the wall and would literally have to be mounted above my head. Would that be pointless?

Don't bother with a sixth speaker. The added benefit, even in a room more suited for it is minor at very best (98% of soundtracks are 5.1 only and very few of those even give the rear channels a proper work out, sadly). In your situation I'd say it'd be far more trouble than it's worth -- it may even end up sounding worse and/or weird (with the speaker mounted above you it could quite easily be more distracting than anything).

[Pelican170]

Originally Posted by jomari

its a matter of personal preference riff. in my opinion...i actually dont like bipoles/dipoles. tried em before, and well, you might as well have 7.1 direct radiating speakers instead of the bi/dipoles, since you are looking for a 'spatial' environment.

but as i mentioned, thats just my 2 cents.

I agree, rather Direct for movies..