Dolby Digital Plus and DTS-HD High Resolution Audio? - Blu-ray Forum

DRC72 · 03-08-2009, 03:50 PM

I have yet to find a BD encoded with these lossless codecs? I'm sure there are BDs out there with them, but Dolby True HD and DTS MA have taken center stage on Blu-ray. I'm just curious as to why Dolby and DTS bothered to develop these two codecs?

DRC72

MOONPHASE · 03-08-2009, 03:54 PM

Dragon Ball Z Broly Double Feature has DTS HD-HR audio on the English dub version and I saw a Japanese anime Blu-ray boxset called Air that uses the Dolby Digital Plus audio as 1 of the audio formats on it but other than that I agree

callas01 · 03-08-2009, 03:55 PM

i believe there are a couple of bd's with it, but I think HD dvds used it more.

BIslander · 03-08-2009, 04:02 PM

blu-raystats.com shows about 30 DTS-HD releases. There are no Blus with DD+. It was a primary codec used on HD DVD and there's some discussion that DD+ may be used for HD television broadcasts.

Sonny · 03-08-2009, 04:03 PM

DD+ was an HDDVD thing... DTS-HD HR is on a number of BD's & sounds very good.

Sonny · 03-08-2009, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIslander

blu-raystats.com shows about 30 DTS-HD releases. There are no Blus with DD+. It was a primary codec used on HD DVD and there's some discussion that DD+ may be used for HD television broadcasts.

I hope TV broadcasts start using DD+ & even better DTS-HD HR (wishfull thinking) then lossless one day. That would be sweet!!!

HOME THEATRE ADDICT! · 03-08-2009, 04:20 PM

I know The Condemned had a DTS-HD HR soundtrack, thought it sounded good. Like it was already said, DD+ was a HD-DVD thing. Never saw it on a blu ray yet.

rded · 03-08-2009, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRC72

I have yet to find a BD encoded with these lossless codecs? I'm sure there are BDs out there with them, but Dolby True HD and DTS MA have taken center stage on Blu-ray. I'm just curious as to why Dolby and DTS bothered to develop these two codecs?

DRC72

As other memebers have said, DD+ was an HD DVD thing but is essentailly the same as the DD on Blurays killobits-wise just different labelling that's all as both are @ 640kps. Queen live @ montreal has DTS HR. It sounds really good..

DRC72 · 03-08-2009, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rded

As other memebers have said, DD+ was an HD DVD thing but is essentailly the same as the DD on Blurays killobits-wise just different labelling that's all as both are @ 640kps. Queen live @ montreal has DTS HR. It sounds really good..

I see... So in actuality when I switch from Dolby True HD to a Dolby Digital soundtrack on a BD, that can be considered Dolby Digital Plus?

rded · 03-08-2009, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRC72

I see... So in actuality when I switch from Dolby True HD to a Dolby Digital soundtrack on a BD, that can be considered Dolby Digital Plus?

Well, yes. For example, the DD+ on the HDDVD and the DD on the BD version of Batman Begins are bit for bit Identical but just labeled differently: i.e. one of them has a + and the other one doesn't. But don't confuse that with the regular Dolby Digital found on the DVD version as both the HDDVD and BD versions still have a higher resolution.

Sir Terrence · 03-08-2009, 06:25 PM

The Blu-ray format doesn't need the plus in DD. HD-DVD needed it because of packet limitations in the format. Just like with DVD, HD-DVD only supported DD up to 448kbps. In order to get the bit rate higher, a meta data extension to the DD format was required to carry bit rates above 448kbps.

BIslander · 03-08-2009, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rded

As other memebers have said, DD+ was an HD DVD thing but is essentailly the same as the DD on Blurays killobits-wise just different labelling that's all as both are @ 640kps. Queen live @ montreal has DTS HR. It sounds really good..

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRC72

I see... So in actuality when I switch from Dolby True HD to a Dolby Digital soundtrack on a BD, that can be considered Dolby Digital Plus?

Quote:

Originally Posted by rded

Well, yes. For example, the DD+ on the HDDVD and the DD on the BD version of Batman Begins are bit for bit Identical but just labeled differently: i.e. one of them has a + and the other one doesn't. But don't confuse that with the regular Dolby Digital found on the DVD version as both the HDDVD and BD versions still have a higher resolution.

DD+ is not the same as DD 5.1 at 640kbps.

DD+ is a specific lossy format that supports eight channels with a 3mbps maximum bitrate on HD DVD and a 1.7mbps rate on BD. S/PDIF connections cannot be used for DD+. HDMI is required. DD 5.1 decoders cannot process DD+ bitstreams.

DD 5.1 has a maximum bitrate of 640kbps. However, the DVD spec limits it to 448kbps. HD DVD adopted the same 448kbps limit for legacy DD 5.1. DD+ was a mandatory format on HD DVD and it was the default track on most discs. When played back over S/PDIF connections, DD+ is transcoded to 640kbps DD 5.1. The same thing happens with TrueHD. (Actually, the first and second generation HD DVD players transcoded the Dolby formats to DTS.) So, sometimes it may appear that DD+ is DD 5.1 at 640kbps. But, that is not the case.

I have also read that the DD+ track on Batman Begins is encoded at 640kbps. That may be the case for that disc (and some others, most likely). But, it doesn't mean DD+ is merely a renamed 640kbps DD 5.1 encode. It is definitely a different format.

hardcorefrokid · 03-08-2009, 08:46 PM

Reservoir Dogs has DTS-HD.

UFAlien · 03-08-2009, 09:02 PM

First Blood is also DTS-HD HR, although II and III are DTS-HD MA.

Big Daddy · 03-08-2009, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRC72

I have yet to find a BD encoded with these lossless codecs? I'm sure there are BDs out there with them, but Dolby True HD and DTS MA have taken center stage on Blu-ray. I'm just curious as to why Dolby and DTS bothered to develop these two codecs?

DRC72

Dolby Digital Plus and DTS HD High Resolution are lossy. They are not lossless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIslander

DD+ is not the same as DD 5.1 at 640kbps.

DD+ is a specific lossy format that supports eight channels with a 3mbps maximum bitrate on HD DVD and a 1.7mbps rate on BD. S/PDIF connections cannot be used for DD+. HDMI is required.

Both Dolby Digital + and DTS HD HR can support 7.1 channels and up to 6 Mbps. You can also use multi-channel analog RCA cables.

According to Dolby Labs: "Dolby Digital Plus can support more than eight audio channels. HD DVD and Blu-ray Disc standards currently limit their maximum number of audio channels to eight."

From the top of my head, two other films that had Dolby Digital Ex and DTS HD HR were "Stargate" and "Stir of Echoes".

For additional information, read A Guide to Home Theater Audio Codecs.

03-08-2009, 03:50 PM	#1
DRC72 Senior Member Member since:Dec 2008 Location:Connecticut USA	Dolby Digital Plus and DTS-HD High Resolution Audio? I have yet to find a BD encoded with these lossless codecs? I'm sure there are BDs out there with them, but Dolby True HD and DTS MA have taken center stage on Blu-ray. I'm just curious as to why Dolby and DTS bothered to develop these two codecs? DRC72 Last edited by DRC72; 03-08-2009 at 03:53 PM.

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03-08-2009, 03:54 PM	#2
MOONPHASE Blu-ray Duke Top contributor Member since:Jun 2007 Location:California 4K collection:8 Blu-ray collection:520 DVD collection:820 Blu-ray reviews:18 Trading Score:29	Dragon Ball Z Broly Double Feature has DTS HD-HR audio on the English dub version and I saw a Japanese anime Blu-ray boxset called Air that uses the Dolby Digital Plus audio as 1 of the audio formats on it but other than that I agree

03-08-2009, 03:55 PM	#3
callas01 Blu-ray Prince Top contributor Member since:Jun 2008 Location:Riverside, CA Home Theater Gallery:42 Blu-ray collection:230 DVD collection:47	i believe there are a couple of bd's with it, but I think HD dvds used it more.

03-08-2009, 04:02 PM	#4
BIslander Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Sep 2008 Location:Bainbridge Island, WA	blu-raystats.com shows about 30 DTS-HD releases. There are no Blus with DD+. It was a primary codec used on HD DVD and there's some discussion that DD+ may be used for HD television broadcasts.

03-08-2009, 04:03 PM	#5
Sonny Blu-ray Ninja Member since:Aug 2007 Home Theater Gallery:8 Blu-ray reviews:6 Trading Score:1	DD+ was an HDDVD thing... DTS-HD HR is on a number of BD's & sounds very good.

03-08-2009, 04:20 PM	#7
HOME THEATRE ADDICT! Expert Member Member since:May 2008 Location:Ohio	I know The Condemned had a DTS-HD HR soundtrack, thought it sounded good. Like it was already said, DD+ was a HD-DVD thing. Never saw it on a blu ray yet.

03-08-2009, 06:25 PM	#11
Sir Terrence Sound Insider/M.P.S.E. Member since:Dec 2006	The Blu-ray format doesn't need the plus in DD. HD-DVD needed it because of packet limitations in the format. Just like with DVD, HD-DVD only supported DD up to 448kbps. In order to get the bit rate higher, a meta data extension to the DD format was required to carry bit rates above 448kbps.

03-08-2009, 08:46 PM	#13
hardcorefrokid Power Member Member since:Sep 2008 Location:Southern California Blu-ray collection:97 Blu-ray reviews: 16	Reservoir Dogs has DTS-HD.

03-08-2009, 09:02 PM	#14
UFAlien Blu-ray Guru Top contributor Member since:Oct 2008 4K collection:128 Blu-ray collection:475 Blu-ray reviews: 14 Trading Score:29	First Blood is also DTS-HD HR, although II and III are DTS-HD MA.

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