Early Blu-rays that may have playback issues (Criterion, Well Go USA, etc.)

[Aragorn the Elfstone]

BTW, has anybody spotted any discs from other studios with the reported numbers? I've been checking a bunch of my 2009/2010 discs and haven't found any yet (nor any with signs of browning).

[Thebunk]

Originally Posted by pedromvu

Not sure if someone mentioned here but, how cool it would have been that this month's newsletter would have been a hint for an upgrade of this:

Criterion title

Have to give credit to ShellOilJunior from the Criterion forum

Easy now, this post may get deleted

[pedromvu]

Originally Posted by Thebunk

Easy now, this post may get deleted

BTW, has anybody spotted any discs from other studios with the reported numbers? I've been checking a bunch of my 2009/2010 discs and haven't found any yet (nor any with signs of browning).

I just checked a few of mine and haven't found any, while this probably wont apply to every release this is what i found with the SID codes:

Sony DADC (same as most Criterions)
Disney/Buena Vista, Kino, 20 Century Fox, Sony, Warner, New Line Cinema, Paramount, Cinedigm, Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer.

Other (but non Sonopress):
Magnolia, Palisades Tartan, Universal, Lionsgate

[Clark Kent]

As I've said before, the bronzing would only be a problem on BD-50s. Many niche Blu-ray distributors other than Criterion do everything possible to squeeze their releases on a BD-25 for cost savings.

[GIR]

Originally Posted by jscoggins

So is your BD unplayable or what?

Seriously I dont know or care. I consider blurays and dvds part of transportation/data transfer not playback methods.

[Partyslammer]

As requested, I have updated the calendar of BDs sorted and spanning the first to last release dates of Criterion titles reported to suffer playback errors. It can be seen in this post:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...5&postcount=65

Please continue to add or correct info by either posting here or PMing me privately.

[Dan8700]

Just a consideration: based on a list, people have inspected only a range of titles so far, mainly from The Man Who Fell To Earth to By Brakhage and Stagecoach, both released on May 25, 2010. But why stop here? In some way, based on reports too, we took for granted the titles right after that date were OK. Who said it? I remember only Brian81 reporting on some titles after said date. I was browsing the releases and if you pay attention to the latest announcement, you'll find out that some of these titles turned out to be the deadliest:

Summer Hours Blu-ray Apr 20, 2010
Ride with the Devil Apr 27, 2010
M May 11, 2010
Walkabout May 18, 2010
Stagecoach May 25, 2010
By Brakhage: An Anthology, Volumes One and Two May 25, 2010

So, why Mystery Train or Close Up, released just two weeks after that, should be free of this issue?
In short, before the whole "replacement thing" starts, I'd advise collectors to inspect and test some of the following titles. Especially those who purchased them at the time of release or some weeks after that; contemplating the June and July titles may suffice to determine the switch to the Sony plant, so that we can "close the case".

Mystery Train Jun 15, 2010
Red Desert Jun 22, 2010
Close-Up Jun 22, 2010
The Leopard Jun 29, 2010
Everlasting Moments Jun 29, 2010
The Red Shoes Jul 20, 2010
Black Narcissus Jul 20, 2010
The Secret of the Grain Jul 27, 2010

ps. just to be sure, I checked ALL my 2010 Criterions and they are Sony-pressed discs and perfectly fine, but I can't be of much help here: I started collecting CCs in 2011 (late 2011 maybe), so in all likelihood mine are second pressings.

[tenia]

Originally Posted by Thebunk

Re: Pro-B, I appreciate the early reviews and screenshots but the very defensive responses for this and the Eraserhead issues (all in less then a months time) just leaves me feeling very skeptical about his opinion about anything Criterion related going forward. Just my opinion.

Sophism.

The fact that he was asking these people to be rigourous in thier statements and conclusions has nothing to do with his abilities to properly review a Criterion disc.

Basically, you're calling him a biased reviewer, which is certainly most unfair. I'm not always agreeing with him (though it's more often than not), but he has always struck me as the most knowledgeable blu-ray.com reviewer.


While this Criterion plant issue certainly is a massive one (maybe involving 1000s of faulty discs over numerous releases), some people have been too quick trying to find a pattern based on incorrect reflexions, like "brown discs = unreadable discs" which is so far not factual at all and should instead be "brown discs = possibility of being unreadable later but no one's sure". On the other end, people have reported faulty discs looking perfectly fine.

What Pro-B did was simply asking people not to propagate approximative theories.



However, even if there has been some pitchforkers here, I'm happy to say that this is a nice thread with people simply gathering data about SIDs and visual aspect of the discs and playback issues or damaged sectors. THAT'S factual, and it's very good to read.

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by tenia

Sophism.

The fact that he was asking these people to be rigourous in thier statements and conclusions has nothing to do with his abilities to properly review a Criterion disc.

Basically, you're calling him a biased reviewer, which is certainly most unfair. I'm not always agreeing with him (though it's more often than not), but he has always struck me as the most knowledgeable blu-ray.com reviewer.


While this Criterion plant issue certainly is a massive one (maybe involving 1000s of faulty discs over numerous releases), some people have been too quick trying to find a pattern based on incorrect reflexions, like "brown discs = unreadable discs" which is so far not factual at all and should instead be "brown discs = possibility of being unreadable later but no one's sure". On the other end, people have reported faulty discs looking perfectly fine.

What Pro-B did was simply asking people not to propagate approximative theories.


However, if there has been some pitchforkers here, I'm happy to say that this is a nice thread with people simply gathering data about SIDs and visual aspect of the discs and playback issues or damaged sectors. THAT'S factual, and it's very good to read.



Anyway, back to topic : checked yesterday Stagecoach. It looked freaking brown under my kitchen light compared to other Criterion discs, but actually it is looking fine. I tested it on my BD-ROM and it playback fine. I also checked through VSO Inspector and the surface test is 100% fine. I didn't do the file check test, because at 0.34x, it would have taken much too long for me...

So far, it seems all my discs are fine, with a concern regarding Days of Heaven and Walkabout, which weren't playbacking properly on my BD-ROM 2 weeks ago, but they could have been simply dusty/dorty/whatever since a simple cloth cleaning made them now playbacking properly.

I'll check however Days of Heaven through CD-DVD Speed, because it did give me about 8% of problematic sectors so it's weird it's now properly playbacking.

[crazyBLUE]

Now there are a couple individuals in this thread that are trying to turn this into a personal discussion. This needs to stop Please

Mod Note ~ the discussion should refocus back on topic, not on personalities:

Thanks

[tenia]

Back to topic : I checked yesterday Stagecoach. It looked freaking brown under my kitchen light compared to other Criterion discs, but actually it is looking fine. I tested it on my BD-ROM and it playback fine. I also checked through VSO Inspector and the surface test is 100% fine. I didn't do the file check test, because at 0.34x, it would have taken much too long for me...

So far, it seems all my discs are fine, with a concern regarding Days of Heaven and Walkabout, which weren't playbacking properly on my BD-ROM 2 weeks ago, but they could have been simply dusty/dorty/whatever since a simple cloth cleaning made them now playbacking properly.

I'll check however Days of Heaven through CD-DVD Speed, because it did give me about 8% of problematic sectors so it's weird (but good ) it's now properly playbacking.

[d514]

Originally Posted by Clark Kent

As I've said before, the bronzing would only be a problem on BD-50s. Many niche Blu-ray distributors other than Criterion do everything possible to squeeze their releases on a BD-25 for cost savings.

Yes, this is probably true. The high number of HD DVD failures were all double layer discs (HD30) as far as I remember. But since HD DVD could only fit 15GB on a layer most of them were double layer. But I have a few Warner HD15 discs which are still fine.

[tenia]

Originally Posted by Dan8700

So, why Mystery Train or Close Up, released just two weeks after that, should be free of this issue?

It seems that Criterion has been using or is using multiple pressing plants (I guess it's to ensure flexibility depending on each plant workload at a given time).

If Mystery Train and Close Up (and other titles) have never been pressed in a suspicious plant (see SIDs discussion), then, even if they were released within the suspicious time frame, then, they can very well be 100% free of the issue.

It might also be that Criterion has completely switched to an other non-problematic plant between these releases.

This is also why some titles can be reported as fine by some and problematic by others.

You have to think in terms of batches, not releases or release dates.

[LPMA]

Originally Posted by iScottie

Howards End freezes from approximately 01:52:00 until 02:02:00.

I had to watch the section that I missed on Dailymotion. It is a shame as the film is quite good.

That's exactly when mine freezes too.

Originally Posted by jscoggins

You see something new every day, I guess. Unplayable/corrupt but clean?

A few years ago I attempted to back-up discs that were badly scratched that would skip. While they were unreadable in my DVD player, I was able to create a backup with a software that went sector to sector. So I guess it's possible.

[man_westooth]

Something like this happened about ten years ago with Classical CDs for a number of labels that were all pressed by PDO (Phillips) in the UK. The solution at that time was that the pressing plant involved put together a master list of affected discs with input from customers, and re-pressed them on demand for people who contacted them and sent in their old discs (just the CDs themselves, not the cases). Maybe a solution like this could be done for the current Criterion situation.

[Joe Dalek]

Originally Posted by Thebunk

Yup. I am actually surprised there have been not more people over the top against Criterion in this thread. If anything I thought it has been very constructive.

Criterion has a fantastic customer service record. They always put things right and most of us know this. It's the He-Hate-Me types who take personal offense to production errors, blether about lack of transparency without allowing time for investigation, and expect resolutions in one business day who need to calm the down.

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by Partyslammer

As requested, I have updated the calendar of BDs sorted and spanning the first to last release dates of Criterion titles reported to suffer playback errors. It can be seen in this post:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...5&postcount=65

Please continue to add or correct info by either posting here or PMing me privately.

You have In the Realm of the Senses highlighted, but no one has reported it being unplayable AFAIK. Did I miss a post?

[nickersonw]

Originally Posted by jscoggins

You have In the Realm of the Senses highlighted, but no one has reported it being unplayable AFAIK. Did I miss a post?

The only mention I see of any problems with In the Realm of the Senses is that one copy was bronzed but still played. Both that poster and you deemed it not ready to go on the defective list:

Originally Posted by Brad1963

I probably should not have posted In the Realm of the Senses, yes it has a bronze color but it does play. This forum seems to have become a runaway train. It should not be counted as defective at this time.

Originally Posted by jscoggins

And I have not added it to the OP.

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by nickersonw

The only mention I see of any problems with In the Realm of the Senses is that one copy was bronzed but still played. Both that poster and you deemed it not ready to go on the defective list:

Danke schoen!

[Blu Titan]

Hey guys ,

I changed the title of the thread for a couple of reasons:

While a particular disc might play for someone, that does not indicate that the disc is unplayable for all or most. Also, the prior thread title promotes (I believe unintentionally) a "chicken little" effect and what we need is honest discusssion. Nobody asked me to change the title, I believe the revised title is more appropiate.

I read every single post in this thread last night and there's really good info but it appears some might be trying to escalate the discussion by proposing the idea that if one member has a problem with a title that disc is "bad" for all...that is nonsense.

Personally, I am concerned...heck yes. I am a collector and I do not Criterion or anyone else jack. They owe me as I have paid a lot of money for their titles. I have not check my discs other than visually inspecting "M" and it shows some signs of the bronzing effect. IMO, this is NOT something normal and it is a cause for concern.

Lets try to discuss facts and not make unreasonable assumptions. I will check my discs and report my findings...we should all share information, opinions but lets remember that opinions are not facts.