See that’s something I’ve been thinking about lately. If younger filmmakers don’t watch older movies, then can their films be any good knowing their knowledge is limited. Like an analogy would be writers who only read books from 1985 to the present. Wouldn’t their work suffer? Not saying that they can’t direct movies or write but that there would be something missing. Like there wouldn’t be a Tarantino if he didn’t watch noir and crime films from the silent era to the 50’s alongside his contemporary cinema, right? Guillermo del Toro watching those black and white monster movies. Or am I just wrong? Of course, this is a new art form, a little over a 120 years old so we don’t really know what how much of a “period” influence it has had. I’m trying to think of young filmmakers like Ari Aster, Robert Eggers, Damien Chazelle, etc.
I was born in 1990 and I routinely watch films that are 50+ years old. The only films that are "too old" for me are silent films. It's just not a type of cinema that I like, but in spite of that I appreciate silent films' role and importance in cinema history. And I know that there are classics and quality films from the silent era of cinema.
See that’s something I’ve been thinking about lately. If younger filmmakers don’t watch older movies, then can their films be any good knowing their knowledge is limited. Like an analogy would be writers who only read books from 1985 to the present. Wouldn’t their work suffer? Not saying that they can’t direct movies or write but that there would be something missing. Like there wouldn’t be a Tarantino if he didn’t watch noir and crime films from the silent era to the 50’s alongside his contemporary cinema, right? Guillermo del Toro watching those black and white monster movies. Or am I just wrong? Of course, this is a new art form, a little over a hundred 120 years old so we don’t really know what how much of a “period” influence it has had. I’m trying to think of young filmmakers like Ari Aster, Robert Eggers, Damien Chazelle, etc.
Agree, but I think a big problem with contemporary film makers, especially from the 70's onwards, is the obsession with cinephilia itself.
The old masters that helped develop the grammar of film were often more influenced by other mediums.
I understand that this happens with all mediums eventually, but with film the problem is compounded by the problem you mentioned. i.e the (time) frame of reference becoming increasingly narrow.
This won't be a popular opinion around here, but I see this same limitation in even very good contemporary directors like PTA and Fincher. Just look at their best of lists, especially Fincher's.
I can understand why young people think that, but not so much older people. A big part of maturity is learning to take the long view of time. In fact, I'd argue that this is probably the key sign of mental maturity.
When my 20 year old cousin complains about a film that's 30 years old being 'too old' I understand where he is coming from, but I don't really get it from a person around my own age. i.e late 30's/early 40's.
Of course most film buffs have preferences, but I guess I'm 'snobby' in the sense that I can't take seriously any 'cinephile' that has a 20-30 year view of film. Even 40 years isn't enough in my opinion, but I totally get why the average person who doesn't care that much about film would rather watch a new or relatively recent film over an 'old' one.
I agree, but, ultimately, it's up to people to check out films from different eras. I don't use age as an excuse. I don't care if you're 60, 30, or 15, there are films from a variety of eras available at your disposal. I get so annoyed when people say something is too old. I grew up as a kid who lived in a local video store, just watching whatever I could get my hands on, so I don't identify with these motherf**kers who say something is from the wrong era. Just not my bag.
And then you have the other end of the spectrum where there are folks who wanna act like anything new that comes out isn't good just because it's new, or, it's mainstream and therefore it isn't good.
To find the great balance in life, that is the objective.
I was born in 1978 and I actually prefer pre-code movies (1929-1934) vs. the peak of the golden age of Hollywood films (1940s and 1950s), because it didn't have the Presentational acting style that seemed unnatural (at least to me). I can watch any film that took into account the method style of acting developed by Stanislavski and later modified by Strasberg (seen well in Brando's 1954 performance of On the Waterfront). I also like the super early cinema coming from Europe (1921's The Phantom Carriage) and the period of 1913–late 1920s that featured the illusion of temporal linearity and spatial continuity in film (with silent cinema). It's hard for me to watch actors perform in the Shakespearean classical acting style, and though a lot of actors/actresses (back before method acting was used) were doing that (with teleplay), it just wasn't as interesting to me. I have to credit Orson Welles as the man who revolutionized the art of film with his introduction of a different style of cinematic acting (starting with Citizen Kane).
Whether or not some people think the acting is "outdated" from the classical Hollywood era (whether its the great Cary Grant, the timeless Gary Cooper, or legendary Robert Mitchum), its not for me to judge, but I do prefer the groundbreaking and exciting method acting styles of more contemporary actors such as Daniel Day‑Lewis, Philip Seymour Hoffman, Robert De Niro, Billy Bob Thornton, Jim Carrey, Joaquin Phoenix, Marlon Brando, Jessica Chastain, Nicolas Cage, Stanley Tucci, Charlize Theron, Edward Norton, Al Pacino, Gary Oldman, Hilary Swank, Johnny Depp, Heath Ledger, Michael Caine, Sean Penn, Anne Hathaway, Kate Winslet, Christian Bale, Adrien Brody, Robin Williams, Jack Nicholson, etc.
Aside from the acting aspect (that is a major difference), its of course everything else (the directing, the cinematography, production design, types of visual effects, etc.) that to me is best captured in a perfect storm during the 1970s-1990s (which is my overall favorite era for cinema), before CGI invaded the movie industry and changed everything (for better, or in my opinion, for worse).
I was born in 1990 and I routinely watch films that are 50+ years old. The only films that are "too old" for me are silent films. It's just not a type of cinema that I like, but in spite of that I appreciate silent films' role and importance in cinema history. And I know that there are classics and quality films from the silent era of cinema.
I'd like to say that I'm really into silent cinema, but the reality is that I tend to mostly gravitate towards the 'name' films, or the name directors. I'm not particularly adventurous outside of that.
Having said that, there are at least two or so handfuls of film from the silent era that rank among my all time favs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mja345
I agree, but, ultimately, it's up to people to check out films from different eras. I don't use age as an excuse. I don't care if you're 60, 30, or 15, there are films from a variety of eras available at your disposal. I get so annoyed when people say something is too old. I grew up as a kid who lived in a local video store, just watching whatever I could get my hands on, so I don't identify with these motherf**kers who say something is from the wrong era. Just not my bag.
Sure, but we all come to cinema from different times and stages in our lives. I don't identify with people like that either because I used to watch older films when I was in my teens and early 20's too, but I'd be lying if I said that I found Ozu as compelling as a 20 year old university student studying cinema as I did when I revisited his films in my late 20's/early 30's.
Last edited by malakaheso; 02-24-2019 at 08:57 AM.
What an actress. Her film career began with Alain Resnais' masterpiece Hiroshima mon amour, and it continued for just short of six decades. Her most awarded performance was 2012's Amour.
I am definitely watching Hiroshima mon amour tonight.
She was sensational in Georges Franju's Thérèse Desqueyroux.
Yet another film to go on the list. Oh man, if they don't come up with some sort of miracle cure for everything in the next couple/few decades, this list will go mostly unseen.
What an actress. Her film career began with Alain Resnais' masterpiece Hiroshima mon amour, and it continued for just short of six decades. Her most awarded performance was 2012's Amour.
I am definitely watching Hiroshima mon amour tonight.
don't know how she didn't win for amour. might have to pick this up at the next flash sale.
It's so hard to keep track of what coming out when there are so many other things to
think about. Perhaps I missed the news, but did Criterion say when they would be
releasing California Split?
I looked at my blu ray statistics and I'm pretty balanced in all decades. Down in the 1910s and 1920s but that is not my fault because if Criterion would come out with every Garbo film that would quickly pull that 1920s percentile right on up.
I'm thinking if a Von Sternberg/Dietrich set was possible, we can absolutely get a Garbo Silents set or something. One for Lon Chaney's MGM/Goldwyn films would be great, too.
I'm thinking if a Von Sternberg/Dietrich set was possible, we can absolutely get a Garbo Silents set or something. One for Lon Chaney's MGM/Goldwyn films would be great, too.
I would like to see Criterion upgrade von Sternberg's silent films box to blu-ray
and add the two films that were missing. Additionally, I wouldn't mind if Criterion
gathered together Dietrich's German films before The Blue Angel (1930) into
a box-set.
There aren't enough films out of Wiemar Republic on blu-ray.
I've never seen any of Ingar Bergman's films before. Is Seventh Seal a decent one to start with?
Yes, definitely. One of his most accessible films, which happens to be one of his very best. Definitely a good start, and hopefully you like it enough to explore more of his films later.
Agree, but I think a big problem with contemporary film makers, especially from the 70's onwards, is the obsession with cinephilia itself.
The old masters that helped develop the grammar of film were often more influenced by other mediums.
I understand that this happens with all mediums eventually, but with film the problem is compounded by the problem you mentioned. i.e the (time) frame of reference becoming increasingly narrow.
This won't be a popular opinion around here, but I see this same limitation in even very good contemporary directors like PTA and Fincher. Just look at their best of lists, especially Fincher's.
PTA has actually said in interviews he feels more influenced by classical cinema, specifically naming Max Ophuls, than by the seventies "greats", and it shows in his 2010s films. Perhaps his tastes have matured in the last 10-15 years. Who knows?
I see Hollywood history like this, modern movies are everything after Cary Grant retired and the "Golden Age" is everything before Cary Grant retired.
Just watched Charade for the first time on blu ray tonight.
Funniest part of the movie to me was Cary Grant explaining to Audrey Hepburn how he was in his dad's umbrella frames business. But then was led away from umbrella frames.
Great movie and great cast and great director.
The funniest moment of Charade to me is when Audrey Hepburn blurts this out with so much gusto: "But what does this have to do with the CIO?!"
I've never seen any of Ingar Bergman's films before. Is Seventh Seal a decent one to start with?
That question literally made me laugh out oud. And it has nothing to do with the question you posed. It's just such a ... question. It's like asking, "I've never seen any Hitchcock film, is Vertigo a good one to start with?"
I honestly don't know where to start with Bergman. The Seventh Seal is brilliant and rips apart most of his filmography. But he made a lot of lighter, more comedic films like Summer With Monika which definitely have a different tilt. As I said, The Seventh Seal is a work of genius, but I'm not sure I would start with that. OTOH, great film, so tough to say.
I will say this: The Seventh Seal was the first Bergman I saw.
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