If it was filmed/mastered in 2k, I refuse to watch it in UHD

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by noirjunkie

Microsoft tried something similar to this (but not exactly the same) with XBox One games, and we all know how that turned out. I don't see this being a viable business model for a format that already has high introductory price points and upgrade fatigue working against it.

And whose consumer focus will be niche movie enthusiasts who want offline discs. They would literally be crapping on their whole consumer base.

[Geoff D]

If the movie gets a 4K rebuild a la The Martian then I ain't gots no problem with that. And noted cinematographer Roger Deakins has said that he saw a substantial difference between 2K and 4K finishes even when the source was 'only' 2.8K from the ARRI Alexa, bearing in mind that 2.8K has double the pixels of 2K so a 4K finish will still have some benefit even if the source is not EXACTLY 4K resolution (hell, you'll only resolve 4K from 35mm with the very best glass and a slow stock drenched with light, whereas real world conditions eat into that measurable resolution something chronic).

This is separate from end-to-end 2K upscales which I'm as wary about as the rest of y'all, but as we've only heard from Finn @ Fox so far regarding their stance towards UHD rebuilds I'm happy to keep my powder dry until we get confirmation from other studios.

[Drewbee87]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

If the movie gets a 4K rebuild a la The Martian then I ain't gots no problem with that. And noted cinematographer Roger Deakins has said that he saw a substantial difference between 2K and 4K finishes even when the source was 'only' 2.8K from the ARRI Alexa, bearing in mind that 2.8K has double the pixels of 2K so a 4K finish will still have some benefit even if the source is not EXACTLY 4K resolution (hell, you'll only resolve 4K from 35mm with the very best glass and a slow stock drenched with light, whereas real world conditions eat into that measurable resolution something chronic).

This is separate from end-to-end 2K upscales which I'm as wary about as the rest of y'all, but as we've only heard from Finn @ Fox so far regarding their stance towards UHD rebuilds I'm happy to keep my powder dry until we get confirmation from other studios.

This is why I keep wondering why so many are freaking out over 4K transfers having 2K footage in them. If every studio is going to go back to the raw files, the 2.8K footage will be, what, 2880x1620?

[Geoff D]

That's kinda another point entirely Andrew: that some movies which say 4K on the tin and which were originally mastered & distributed as such theatrically were actually shot on a 2.8K camera (e.g. Skyfall, In Time, both Mockingjays) which is its own can o' worms if people want something else to moan about.

[chip75]

We may never see sample results from say, 2K masters at their highest specs (with the benefits of UHD BDs extra range) on UHD BDs versus 2K masters upconverted to 4K with all the gizmos added but I think it would be better to keep things as original as possible. The upconverts are just going to be needlessly compressed to Faux-K.

I'm not sure if UHD BDs can handle an in-between resolution between 1080p and UHD? If it's 2.8K then all the better!

[Geoff D]

There's no intermediary resolution in the spec. There's 1920x1080 and 3840x2160, that's it.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by chip75

We may never see sample results from say, 2K masters at their highest specs (with the benefits of UHD BDs extra range) on UHD BDs versus 2K masters upconverted to 4K with all the gizmos added but I think it would be better to keep things as original as possible. The upconverts are just going to be needlessly compressed to Faux-K.

I'm not sure if UHD BDs can handle an in-between resolution between 1080p and UHD? If it's 2.8K then all the better!

You say "needlessly compressed" to 4K but to my eyes the UHD download of Terminator Genisys from (what I presume was) a 2K upscale had more appreciable detail than the Blu-ray, either because of filtering done to the regular Blu-ray or because there really was more detail thanks to the higher resolution colour component of the 2160p image compared to the 1080p version. (This wasn't some fancy 10-bit wide colour gamut HDR version either, it was 8-bit 709 SDR just like the regular Blu, but it will still have chroma that's 4x the resolution of the 1080p version.)

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

You say "needlessly compressed" to 4K but to my eyes the UHD download of Terminator Genisys from (what I presume was) a 2K upscale had more appreciable detail than the Blu-ray, either because of filtering done to the regular Blu-ray or because there really was more detail thanks to the higher resolution colour component of the 2160p image compared to the 1080p version. (This wasn't some fancy 10-bit wide colour gamut HDR version either, it was 8-bit 709 SDR just like the regular Blu, but it will still have chroma that's 4x the resolution of the 1080p version.)

If there's gains to be had then they're worth it, but I'm sure we'll see some head-scratchers released on UHD BD. It really needs to pick its fights when it comes to titles and how they're treated.

I think we're going to see a whole new level of screenshot analysis on the horizon, people will want to see comparisons of 2K master files, BDs and upconverted UHD BDs to see what's what.

[Drewbee87]

Until studios render VFX at 4K & film with only 4K or higher camera's(or film on actual film that can be scanned), hardly any of these UHD Blu-rays will be true 4K. They'll continue to be a mix of 2K, 2.8K, 35mm 4K scans & native 4K, 6K, 8K footage all with a final resolution of 3840x2160. So everyone just accept it and move on!

[Geoff D]

Oh, I've said the same thing chip: however they do it, UHD Blu is going to have to impress right out of the gate.

[BillieCassin]

Originally Posted by Drewbee87

Until studios render VFX at 4K & film with only 4K or higher camera's(or film on actual film that can be scanned)

So made me think - I would support 4K all the way if that meant they would go back to film, LOL. Wouldn't it be a hoot if the last decade or so ended up being the theatrical equivalent to the 70's/80's black hole of television shot on videotape? It already happened to Lucas...

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by BillieCassin

So made me think - I would support 4K all the way if that meant they would go back to film, LOL. Wouldn't it be a hoot if the last decade or so ended up being the theatrical equivalent to the 70's/80's black hole of television shot on videotape? It already happened to Lucas...

But when they're already rebuilding movies for 4K I'm hopeful that we won't be in that "black hole" for long...

[Alan A]

Films in theaters are graded P3/DCP which is superior to rec709 as used in Blu-Ray so UHD Blu-Ray with HDR using the P3/DCP can in fact as you say be retro-fitted rather easily. IMHO HDR is the best feature to come to Home Theater since HD. 99% of TV's sold 50" and larger will be 4K and the premium models having HDR try and find a 1080P tv in 2017

[#Darren]

Originally Posted by Alan A

try and find a 1080P tv in 2017

I think we all know that...

it will just be interesting to see how much 4k content we have in 2017.