Black Panther 4K UHD (2018)

[ROSS.T.G.]

Originally Posted by VonMagnum

I'm "amazed" how blown out most of your settings are that you see "blown out [to] shit" that isn't normally there when your brightness and contrast are set correctly instead of set to AUTO-SUNLIGHT that these TVs come preset to in order to sell sets at Best Buy.

Black Panther 3D looked perfectly fine on my projector. No visible noise. No "blown out shit". It's your TV and/or its settings. Period.

It didn’t look washed on the Epson? I had the 5030 (which wasn’t cheap) with painted black ceilings and side walls and it still looked washed out. I was constantly calibrating mine each month. It kept shifting towards blue which is why I had to calibrate so often. The 2 Epsons I had were like that. I couldn’t stand it and sold them.

[VonMagnum]

No issues here with the Epson so far. After a year, I made a small panel alignment tweak. That's it. The first jungle scenes were dark, but it didn't try to brighten them automatically (which would wash them out).

The Samsung 2018 QLED is another matter. As far as I can tell, it's impossible to 100% turn off automatic contrast enhancement. It's either low, medium or high. There is no "off" and boy do you notice in on things like credits. It gets dimmer and you can visibly see the fade. It's annoying on an otherwise awesome TV (close to OLED black levels now but 3x brighter on the other end for HDR).

I think there is another setting that makes dark scenes brighter,but I think that one can be turned off so the other setting is more like the automatic iris on the Epson, but that can be turned off on the Epson so contrast and brightness levels are constant instead of it changing them by the scene to get darker blacks.

[ROSS.T.G.]

Sorry but no way the Q8F has blacks anywhere near an OLED. It does have a very high contrast ratio but even the 2017 VIZIO P has better blacks and a higher contrast ratio with better local dimming. Sony’s also have better local dimming. The trade off is the Q8F is much brighter for HDR and has a phenomenally wide color gamut. It’s an excellent panel.

I’m aware of Epsons auto iris, it works well and doesn’t hinder gamma which is nice.

[VonMagnum]

I guess it depends on your definition of "near". Visibly, it's perhaps about 80% of the way there at worst 98% at best, depending on content. But no one wants to admit their OLED is a much dimmer and faster organic degrading, burn-in likely overpriced set whose only true redeeming quality over its competition is pretty much perfect black levels. No QLEDs suck and must continue to suck.

While I'd prefer true OLED black levels, I find the current gen QLEDs the better tradeoff for brightness/HDR, burn-in resistance and potential longevity. The previous black level difference was unacceptable for the price, but the current models are vastly improved over last year's models on higher end.

[ROSS.T.G.]

Ummm k...I don’t have a problem admitting OLED’s are dimmer because it’s true, they are, I knew that when I bought mine. I didn’t say the QLED sucked, I said they are great lol

I’m not a delusional person that tries to convince myself that they are bright or come close to a light canon, kind of like what you’re doing pretending the QLED’s black levels are close to OLED’s or the 3100 isn’t a piece of junk. I should know, because I’ve calibrated a friends ands it’s garbage for home theatre.

If I posted a comment saying my OLED was as bright as a high end panel I’d be called for lunacy.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Kaonashi

I was beginning to question my sanity whenever I popped the disc in this evening (I hadn’t seen the film yet) and noticed all the awful crush and posterisation. Watching in DV on an LG55B7 OLED and a Sony UBP X-700 UHD player, both of which are less than a week old.

I hadn’t seen any mention of it in the reviews, so it was a bit of a shock when the second UHD I ever watched was full of blocky gradients, especially on most of the characters’ hair. I noticed pretty much everything you brought up here and in subsequent comments.

I tried playing around with all the settings on my player and TV, turned brightness up but it didn’t alleviate any of the posterised shadows, turned it down to get a smoother gradient but the blacks were just dramatically crushed even more. So much detail lost compared to the caps on this site and the blu-ray itself on my same set-up.

I had to deal with plenty of banding on my previous TV due to its dreadful viewing angle, so it was certainly disappointing seeing this type of video fault rear its ugly head on a much upgraded setup, but fortunately this seems to be baked into the disc rather than a problem with several thousand pounds worth of equipment.

Noticed it most at about 00:54:59 when Everett Ross is out of focus in the “foreground” of the shot... there’s just a big black blob on the back of his clothes, with several other black blobs in that same scene.

The other scene where Forest Whitaker’s character is in the dark at around 01:01:34 there were these huge blobs in the background, they’re still there in the blu-ray (as I saw on this site)https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/scree...323&position=7 , but nowhere near as big.

The scene where the Oakland apartment is returned to when killmonger is buried in the sand was also packed full of beautiful, blocky transitions to black. It’s as if any near-black tones were completely absent from the colour palette.

My enjoyment was also hindered by what appeared to be an issue with how my player handled the metadata for Dolby vision, where any time there was a cut to a different shot there was this jarring spike in brightness which felt like a flicker. Turning it on and off seemed to do the trick.

At least I can have peace of mind knowing my new TV ain’t broken.

We can both be insane together at least. As with DNR, EE and whatever else I think everyone's got their different tolerances for stuff like this. To my eyes, as it would appear with yours, the black crush is not subtle. Again, it's NOT so much the lowering of black level itself that winds me up, it's achieving it in such a janky, ham-fisted way that's literally just clipping black past a certain code level (causing artefacts in areas that already HAD deep blacks) and it looks so ****ing amateurish.

Same with Incredibles, same with Guardians 2, same with Ultron apparently, areas that roll off subtly to black on the Blu (like the dark corners of rooms) now have this hard transition slapped over them on UHD like someone filled it in with a goddamn sharpie, along with a cluster of coloured noise around it. It's just so ugly, and what's so annoying to me is there's no need for it. Deeper blacks can be created in a variety of ways in the grading suite, these idiots are just clipping them which is the absolute crudest method possible. Ditto for similarly affected Universal titles like Apollo 13, Straight Outta Compton and Van Helsing.

Sure, there comes the occasional UHD where the crush doesn't look too bad (Incredible Hulk) precisely because the blacks were so flat on the original that the material has enough legroom to be able to withstand such hefty clipping, but when you've already got decent blacks then the clipping leaves behind the aforementioned ugliness, not unlike the Sony black crush seen on some Blus in recent years. I'm not saying this is an outright error as with those Sony discs, but it has a similar effect nonetheless (bearing in mind that plenty of people never noticed anything wrong with those discs) and no sir, I don't like it.

[Jay Mammoth]

OLEDs are overpriced? No those QLEDs are overpriced for a TV that isn’t even as great as an OLED.

[ROSS.T.G.]

Originally Posted by Jay Mammoth

OLEDs are overpriced? No those QLEDs are overpriced for a TV that isn’t even as great as an OLED.

Yeah but our OLED’s only last 100,000 hours

[Jay Mammoth]

Originally Posted by ROSS.T.G.

Yeah but our OLED’s only last 100,000 hours

Lol right? It will only last me 11 years if I have the TV on 24/7.

[VonMagnum]

Originally Posted by ROSS.T.G.

Ummm k...I don’t have a problem admitting OLED’s are dimmer because it’s true, they are, I knew that when I bought mine. I didn’t say the QLED sucked, I said they are great lol

I’m not a delusional person that tries to convince myself that they are bright or come close to a light canon, kind of like what you’re doing pretending the QLED’s black levels are close to OLED’s

It's painfully obvious you've never seen a Q8F or you would know the black levels are night and day better than last year's models and I'd say 80% as dark is a good estimate and not one easily contradicted by anything other than BS bravado which you now appear to be stooping to in order to save face. In a lit room, good luck telling it from an OLED without something like a camera. I didn't say there wasn't any difference any more than you seem to think I said you didn't like them. I'm saying they're now close enough that I'd take the other advantages over the now much smaller differences in black levels (brighter output and far less chance of burn-in and on sale it was $500 less than the same size LG branded OLED, even more compared to the Sony; I also despise LG firmware from using someone's 2018 regular LCD; WiFi lockups and HDMI detection issues among other things that I've never seen on a Samsung). You've somehow turned that into all or nothing and blowing it all out of proportion.

(see https://www.techradar.com/news/5-rea...-future-of-tvs if you don't buy my opinion)

or the 3100 isn’t a piece of junk. I should know, because I’ve calibrated a friends ands it’s garbage for home theatre.

I can't imagine you've seen the old CRT projectors from the 1990s or there about that used to be state of the art. No, it's not an $8000 Sony 4K unit that still isn't an OLED or a QLED in image quality, but that's a far cry from garbage, especially given the current lack of 3D in TVs. For me, its a temporary holdover until I find a suitable 4K/3D unit that doesn't cost as much as a used car and yet still puts out less light than the Epson.

Unless you have an 80"+ OLED, I'd say there's no amount of perfect picture (even with 4K and HDR) that can compete with a larger screen for sheer involvement. Calling a 55" or 65" set "a home theater" is a bit like calling a house cat a lion. I don't confuse my QLED with my 92" screen, let alone those with a 200" screen. It's a TV. It's a really nice TV, but a TV just the same.

It's worse yet if you are getting anomalies with lower resolutions on your 4K set. 480p looks more tolerable on my 92" screen at 1080p upscaled than the 55" QLED upscaled to 4K. Most of my ~1000 film library are 1080p or less still. I've got maybe 65 4K movies. I'd still rather watch them on the 3100 than the QLED for sheer involvement. I'm more impressed by the black levels and HDR than 4K itself. At 55" it's diminishing returns, even 5 feet away.

If I posted a comment saying my OLED was as bright as a high end panel I’d be called for lunacy.

Too late. Saying a Q8F is nowhere *NEAR* OLED is either inexperience, dishonesty or lunacy. It used to be that way last year, but it's a lot closer now.

[ROSS.T.G.]

Originally Posted by VonMagnum

It's painfully obvious you've never seen a Q8F or you would know the black levels are night and day better than last year's models and I'd say 80% as dark is a good estimate and not one easily contradicted by anything other than BS bravado which you now appear to be stooping to in order to save face. In a lit room, good luck telling it from an OLED without something like a camera. I didn't say there wasn't any difference any more than you seem to think I said you didn't like them. I'm saying they're now close enough that I'd take the other advantages over the now much smaller differences in black levels (brighter output and far less chance of burn-in and on sale it was $500 less than the same size LG branded OLED, even more compared to the Sony; I also despise LG firmware from using someone's 2018 regular LCD; WiFi lockups and HDMI detection issues among other things that I've never seen on a Samsung). You've somehow turned that into all or nothing and blowing it all out of proportion.

(see https://www.techradar.com/news/5-rea...-future-of-tvs if you don't buy my opinion)



I can't imagine you've seen the old CRT projectors from the 1990s or there about that used to be state of the art. No, it's not an $8000 Sony 4K unit that still isn't an OLED or a QLED in image quality, but that's a far cry from garbage, especially given the current lack of 3D in TVs. For me, its a temporary holdover until I find a suitable 4K/3D unit that doesn't cost as much as a used car and yet still puts out less light than the Epson.

Unless you have an 80"+ OLED, I'd say there's no amount of perfect picture (even with 4K and HDR) that can compete with a larger screen for sheer involvement. Calling a 55" or 65" set "a home theater" is a bit like calling a house cat a lion. I don't confuse my QLED with my 92" screen, let alone those with a 200" screen. It's a TV. It's a really nice TV, but a TV just the same.

It's worse yet if you are getting anomalies with lower resolutions on your 4K set. 480p looks more tolerable on my 92" screen at 1080p upscaled than the 55" QLED upscaled to 4K. Most of my ~1000 film library are 1080p or less still. I've got maybe 65 4K movies. I'd still rather watch them on the 3100 than the QLED for sheer involvement. I'm more impressed by the black levels and HDR than 4K itself. At 55" it's diminishing returns, even 5 feet away.



Too late. Saying a Q8F is nowhere *NEAR* OLED is either inexperience, dishonesty or lunacy. It used to be that way last year, but it's a lot closer now.

I have seen the Q8F and the grey bars are obvious in a dark room. My brother in law has one. Any LCD worth a damn has good black levels in a bright room, that’s common sense. That’s not a dig on LCD either, I like them and own a few. The high end Sony’s are ridiculously good and so is the high end Samsung’s.

And yet again you assume too much. I’m not some youngster who’s only owned 2 displays. Yes I’ve seen “old” CRT projectors and I have seen the 3100 Epson. I've calibrated one. The Epson 3100 calibrates okay I’ll admit with relatively low dE in its greyscale but **** me they shift more than any projector I’ve seen and calibrated. CMS on it like most Epson projectors is pretty much useless. Sure you can get saturation somewhat dialed in but it’s brightness and hue are awful leaving color washed out. And speaking of washed out gamma just looks off on the 3100. I guess it’s okay for watching the Food Network with the lights on since it’s very bright but I wouldn’t watch a movie on it or call it cinematic. If I want that experience I’ll bring my DVD player to my office and plug it into my Epson there.

I’ll take my tiny OLED any day of the week.

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by VonMagnum

I'm "amazed" how blown out most of your settings are that you see "blown out [to] shit" that isn't normally there when your brightness and contrast are set correctly instead of set to AUTO-SUNLIGHT that these TVs come preset to in order to sell sets at Best Buy.

Black Panther 3D looked perfectly fine on my projector. No visible noise. No "blown out shit". It's your TV and/or its settings. Period.

Assuming you're talking to me with the little quotes. You watched the 3D disc, which I can't comment on, but the 2D Blu-ray does indeed look "blown out to shit" in that opening jungle fight. Why? Because the limited range of Blu-ray requires them to raise the overall brightness to resolve detail. This is a very common issue with standard blu-ray which becomes as obvious as a neon sign once you get used to UHD.

My TV settings are appropriate (2.2 gamma, Warm2, etc.) and you're silly for assuming otherwise.

[HDTV1080P]

A family member rented this movie on Blu-ray and I ended up watching all the extra features on the 1080P Blu-ray disc.


It is awesome to have movies like Black Panther in the 4K Ultra HD Blu-ray format with Dolby Vision HDR and 11.1 Dolby ATMOS surround sound, however it would be ideal if Disney would have released Black Panther in Blu-ray 3D in the United States. It appears this movie only received a Blu-ray 3D release in other areas of the world.


I was amazed that this Black Panther movie with around a 200 million dollar budget did over 1.347 billion dollars at the box office. This is the highest grossing Marvel comics super hero movie every. Most likely this movie well be made into a trilogy.

[VonMagnum]

Originally Posted by ROSS.T.G.

I have seen the Q8F and the grey bars are obvious in a dark room.

Grey bars....

It has limited bloom around very small areas with the new lighting system. There are no "bars", more like very small patches. It's pitch black in a dark room with nothing on the screen because no panels are lit.

And yet again you assume too much. I’m not some youngster who’s only owned 2 displays.

I assume based on your comments that are obviously designed to insult my equipment because you think I insulted yours. I get tired of playing games with people on the Internet. I make a statement of opinion and everyone and their brother who bought the opposing product jumps out and whines that my choices suck and theirs are worth their weight in gold. I've seen it thousands of times on every topic in every forum.

Either your idea of what constitutes a "good" display is based on purely calibration screens or I must assume you are legally blind. I had a 720p Panasonic 11 years before this projector and compared to the old CRT days, even it looked damn good (and the "good" CRTs in the mid-90s could easily cost $25K+ with a scan doubler; I remember watching scenes from Star Wars on one from laserdisc when I was shopping for my Carver ribbons speakers). It was well rated in its price range when it came out. The Epson blows it away in every respect except perhaps screen door, where I can sometimes see a hint. No, black levels don't compare to QLED, let alone OLED, but they aren't everything in life. The panels can be perfectly aligned just for starters and put back into alignment. That alone is worth its weight in gold by comparison. Single chip DLPs (that some love) are dark and have rainbow effects. Most 4K projectors (other than Sony) have almost no range for lens shift which my room needs due to the layout. I could have bought the pseudo 4K higher model, but it really wasn't rated that much better. Other than Sony, I'm not aware of any other lens shift models out there. I wanted 3D and so I got a good price alternative until such time as a better lens shift option (that doesn't cost $8K) comes out.

Yes I’ve seen “old” CRT projectors and I have seen the 3100 Epson. I've calibrated one. The Epson 3100 calibrates okay I’ll admit with relatively low dE in its greyscale but **** me they shift more than any projector I’ve seen and calibrated. CMS on it like most Epson projectors is pretty much useless. Sure you can get saturation somewhat dialed in but it’s brightness and hue are awful leaving color washed out. And speaking of washed out gamma just
looks off on the 3100. I guess it’s okay for watching the Food Network with the lights on since it’s very bright but I wouldn’t watch a movie on it or call it cinematic. If I want that experience I’ll bring my DVD player to my office and plug it into my Epson there.

I'm sorry, but I just read a bunch of absolute horse shit. There are NO "washed out colors" here. You must not know WTF you're doing. Or perhaps you're used to oversaturated settings now seeing as how most of the HDR stuff I've seen goes ape shit bonkers with the color levels to 'impress' people compared to 2K, but it doesn't look like real life. It looks more like Agfa or Ektar film. A more or less 'standard' picture there often looks closer to "Vivid" on a LCD or plasma screen. Some people eat that crap up, but I don't think I've ever seen some of those shades of red in real life on cars that I see just watching Seinfeld's Comedians In Cars Getting Coffee on the QLED. Better than real life, for sure, but not what I'd call reality.

The 2K picture looks great here. I've got a QLED to compare. No, it's not that level of picture, but washed out? Only good for the food network? WTF? It's like I'm living in the Twilight Zone or something. But hey, I'll know who NOT to call if I want my projector calibrated.

Reading some users reviews (don't know I trust the editor), the biggest complaint I see aren't these supposed washed out colors, but fan noise (https://www.projectorcentral.com/epson-3100-review.htm) which I can agree with on any setting other than ECO. Otherwise, these poor dumb sods actually seem to like the 3100. What a bunch of cretins, eh?

At this point, I'm wasting my time so I'm calling a spade a spade here. I can't have a conversation with someone trying so hard to insult my intelligence but failing at it so miserably.

I’ll take my tiny OLED any day of the week.

Hey, you enjoy watching movies on that small TV. I personally didn't spend $8K on a home theater with 11.1 (plus Matrixed speakers) Atmos/X/Auro3D just to watch it on a small 55" sized screen, especially from the 2nd or 3rd row in my theater room where it would look more like 30".

4K is practically meaningless on small screens unless you enjoy sitting 4 feet away from them. 8-10 feet is about my limit before my eyes want to start complaining after a short while.

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

Assuming you're talking to me with the little quotes. You watched the 3D disc, which I can't comment on, but the 2D Blu-ray does indeed look "blown out to shit" in that opening jungle fight. Why? Because the limited range of Blu-ray requires them to raise the overall brightness to resolve detail. This is a very common issue with standard blu-ray which becomes as obvious as a neon sign once you get used to UHD.

My TV settings are appropriate (2.2 gamma, Warm2, etc.) and you're silly for assuming otherwise.

I don't know what you think "appropriate" is, but if you're seeing "blocky" type compression artifacts in the black levels, I can only assume your screen is WAY too bright for 2K sources. I don't see ANY "blocky" type compression artifacts in the black levels in that opening jungle scene here AT ALL. NONE. Not unless I crank up the contrast and brightness to the point where black is no longer black anymore.

4K HDR sets typically have completely different color settings and ranges for 4K HDR and so just because it looks great with the UHD disc, that doesn't mean it's set appropriately for the 2K one. Any black level noise artifacts should be well below the visible point. Or do you think professionals are really putting out discs that are just totally blitzed and someone didn't notice? Somehow, I'd guess the problem is not their end product, but the people watching it having bad settings for 2K. Yes, I'm "silly" like that.

You know what. You guys enjoy your 4K sets and nit-pick over black crush and "blown to shit" horrible horrible discs that professionals put out that are clearly wrong wrong wrong and post memes making fun of me and all the other shit you guys like to do because you have absolutely no couth. It's really more fun than I can stand. I mean I could actually be doing something else right now that doesn't involve you guys, like actually enjoying a movie. Honestly, if I spent all my time nit-picking the picture to death, I think I'd prefer to find a better hobby.

[Mobe1969]

I wonder if some projector users have it on bt709 rather than 2020? I've done it accidentally before on my Sony before noticing, and that is the effect - washed out.

[RockyIII]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

This is the highest grossing Marvel comics super hero movie every. .

I thought Avengers IW was the highest grossing Marvel comics superhero movie ever

[RockyIII]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

This is the highest grossing Marvel comics super hero movie every. .

I thought Avengers IW was the highest grossing Marvel comics superhero movie ever

[Geoff D]

highest grossing domestic Marvel earner. Nowhere near the highest grossing worldwide Marvel earner...which would be IW

[pottyaboutpotter1]

Originally Posted by RockyIII

I thought Avengers IW was the highest grossing Marvel comics superhero movie ever

Infinity War is the highest grossing MCU film worldwide at over $2 billion. Domestically (US only) Black Panther is the highest at $700 million. Black Panther is also the highest grossing solo MCU film internationally (read: highest grossing non-Avengers MCU film) at $1.3 billion worldwide, overtaking the previous record holder Iron Man 3 which earned $1.2 billion worldwide.

If you’re only looking at domestic gross or are not counting Avengers films then Black Panther is the highest grossing MCU film.

[RockyIII]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

highest grossing domestic Marvel earner. Nowhere near the highest grossing worldwide Marvel earner...which would be IW

Originally Posted by pottyaboutpotter1

Infinity War is the highest grossing MCU film worldwide at over $2 billion. Domestically (US only) Black Panther is the highest at $700 million. Black Panther is also the highest grossing solo MCU film internationally (read: highest grossing non-Avengers MCU film) at $1.3 billion worldwide, overtaking the previous record holder Iron Man 3 which earned $1.2 billion worldwide.

If you’re only looking at domestic gross or are not counting Avengers films then Black Panther is the highest grossing MCU film.

That would make sense