Prometheus (2012)

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by chip75

So a big question I haven't seen too often in this thread is:

Is Vickers

[Show spoiler]an Android or even a Replicant

?

[Show spoiler]Sir Ridley mentioned that there were maybe two artificial lifeforms on-board the Prometheus. The film does have a link to Blade Runner with the Tyrell reference as well. The way Charlize Theron plays Vickers there's a definite sub-text to her character. I quite like the idea that Weyland created a little-family for himself. With one knowing what he was and the other not knowing what she was. Just because he could, which gives a neat link to why the Engineers created us. They made us because they could.

Vickers was

[Show spoiler]human and she was crushed to death

. The reaon you haven't seen this mentioned is because it was definitively answered by Lindelof in an email exchange.

[ObiWanShinobi]

Originally Posted by chip75

So a big question I haven't seen too often in this thread is:

Is Vickers

[Show spoiler]an Android or even a Replicant

?

[Show spoiler]Sir Ridley mentioned that there were maybe two artificial lifeforms on-board the Prometheus. The film does have a link to Blade Runner with the Tyrell reference as well. The way Charlize Theron plays Vickers there's a definite sub-text to her character. I quite like the idea that Weyland created a little-family for himself. With one knowing what he was and the other not knowing what she was. Just because he could, which gives a neat link to why the Engineers created us. They made us because they could.

[Show spoiler]I STILL get the feeling Vickers could be an android of sorts. Different model perhaps? When she confronted David in the hallway, there was something about the way she pushed him against the wall that seemed overly forceful for a normal human being, mainly one of her size and muscular tone.

Something tells me shes an android that isn't aware shes an android. Perhaps she was programmed to be more of a free-thinker, a little more human like and because of it she became quite the business woman and skeptic of Weylands work...which in turn upset Weyland, so he created David. Who, at first glance, seems very loyal towards his "master", his work and needs

[ObiWanShinobi]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

Vickers was

[Show spoiler]human and she was crushed to death

. The reaon you haven't seen this mentioned is because it was definitively answered by Lindelof in an email exchange.

Oh, well nevermind then

[Chiyo_chichi]

Originally Posted by mrr1

So what? How about people who don't want to be spoiled, take a bit of personal responsibility and avoid discussions about a particular movie until they've seen the movie themselves?

That's far more practical than asking the rest of the world to walk on eggshells and add spoilers to everything so we don't accidentally ruin a movie for someone who is freely nosing around but doesn't want anything to be "ruined".

Maybe people are interested in a movie and want to learn more about it in a forum they're a part of. Maybe they saw a preview somewhere and want to learn more about it, get some feedback from real people. The movie itself, the transfer, all things related. I think it's much easier for you to be equally responsible and just highlight your text and click a spoiler button. It's not a big ordeal to go through.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by ObiWanShinobi

Oh, well nevermind then

Director always beats writer in a game of Trump Cards though!

So I'll leave it in as a maybe, as Ridley definitely says 'maybe....'

[42041]

Originally Posted by mrr1

So what? How about people who don't want to be spoiled, take a bit of personal responsibility and avoid discussions about a particular movie until they've seen the movie themselves?

That's far more practical than asking the rest of the world to walk on eggshells and add spoilers to everything so we don't accidentally ruin a movie for someone who is freely nosing around but doesn't want anything to be "ruined".

I don't wanna be a backseat mod but this is the blu-ray forum. There's a movie subforum specifically for discussing the movie and the plot and whatnot. I wish the mods would clamp down on plot discussions here, it's really annoying when you want to read up on the blu-ray release of a film you didn't catch in theaters (especially when there's reports it has major issues on some players) but have to go through pages and pages of posts discussing plot details, which is off-topic here. Really, putting a post in spoiler tags is walking on eggshells? I'd say it's basic common courtesy to other forum users, but of course that's way too much to ask of the internet.

[WorkShed]

Originally Posted by ObiWanShinobi

[Show spoiler]I STILL get the feeling Vickers could be an android of sorts. Different model perhaps? When she confronted David in the hallway, there was something about the way she pushed him against the wall that seemed overly forceful for a normal human being, mainly one of her size and muscular tone.

Something tells me shes an android that isn't aware shes an android. Perhaps she was programmed to be more of a free-thinker, a little more human like and because of it she became quite the business woman and skeptic of Weylands work...which in turn upset Weyland, so he created David. Who, at first glance, seems very loyal towards his "master", his work and needs

[Show spoiler]It would be really interesting if Vickers was a replicant that didn't know she was a replicant. I know that Scott is merging the two universes, so it is within the realm of possibility. Maybe she was a gift to Weyland from Tyrell corporation during the merger phase. Weyland probably was too busy to even start his own family and Tyrell created a longer-living replicant before the uprising.

Therefore, Weyland took Vickers under his wing as his daughter, but when he created his own android son, David, he shunned Vickers. It would be an interesting sibling rivalry.

Again, this is my own speculation.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by 42041

I don't wanna be a backseat mod but this is the blu-ray forum. There's a movie subforum specifically for discussing the movie and the plot and whatnot. I wish the mods would clamp down on plot discussions here, it's really annoying when you want to read up on the blu-ray release of a film you didn't catch in theaters (especially when there's reports it has major issues on some players) but have to go through pages and pages of posts discussing plot details, which is off-topic here. Really, putting a post in spoiler tags is walking on eggshells? I'd say it's basic common courtesy to other forum users, but of course that's way too much to ask of the internet.

While I sympathize with you as I've avoided several of the most popular threads in the UK, the blu-ray discussion should include everything from release date, packaging, audio, video, special features, price and the film itself. While I'm not fond of spoilers but am usually immune due to my awful memory, if there was a fault at a particular scene in a discs transfer you're going to get spoilers eventually unless it's all time-codes discussed. I'm more or less okay with other guys discussing the movie in it's blu-ray thread after the release but spoilers should be used if it's going to ruin the movie for someone who hasn't seen it. Or at least mention your post is about the plot in your post title.

It's also amazing how much traffic this films been getting (the Alien Anthology set was very popular), it's not often a block-buster film brings up so many unanswered questions or theories!

[BouCoupDinkyDau]

Originally Posted by s2mikey

C'mon, Lobster - didnt you harp on the spoonfed thing earlier here too? Look, we get that you really, really, really love Prometheus and find it to be the best movie ever. Thats fine, to each their own. It appears you've just joined here too, maybe just to defend the film which is also fine. But, its time to tuck the "spoonfeed/you didnt get it" card away for a while. The issues that are being brought up are quite tangible and certainly debateable. Some issues bother people more than others and some people are willing to overlook them. Thats all good with me too.

His first post to me was a similar heavy-handed attack. I blocked him.

My impression of him is he goes after anyone with any view opposed to his own, using the whole "spoonfeeding" bit as his justification:

"You don't see things the way I do. You are wrong have to be spoon fed."

[johnstrk]

Originally Posted by chip75

So a big question I haven't seen too often in this thread is:

Is Vickers

[Show spoiler]an Android or even a Replicant

?

[Show spoiler]Sir Ridley mentioned that there were maybe two artificial lifeforms on-board the Prometheus. The film does have a link to Blade Runner with the Tyrell reference as well. The way Charlize Theron plays Vickers there's a definite sub-text to her character. I quite like the idea that Weyland created a little-family for himself. With one knowing what he was and the other not knowing what she was. Just because he could, which gives a neat link to why the Engineers created us. They made us because they could.

I keep wondering that too. Only Captain Janek knows for sure

Maybe she's a skin job!

[ToEhrIsHuman]

Originally Posted by WorkShed

[Show spoiler]It would be really interesting if Vickers was a replicant that didn't know she was a replicant. I know that Scott is merging the two universes, so it is within the realm of possibility. Maybe she was a gift to Weyland from Tyrell corporation during the merger phase. Weyland probably was too busy to even start his own family and Tyrell created a longer-living replicant before the uprising.

Therefore, Weyland took Vickers under his wing as his daughter, but when he created his own android son, David, he shunned Vickers. It would be an interesting sibling rivalry.

Again, this is my own speculation.

I've been thinking more or less the same thing...

[Show spoiler]Vickers could be an android unaware she is an android. She could be a personal work of Weyland (who may not have any real offspring of his own), whilst David is just the newest model off the company assembly line. I would definitely be stoked in the sequel if they show Vickers rising up out of the cinders where she was shoved down by the juggernaught, leaving an imprint. She would then come to the realization (since she wasn't dead) that she wasn't indeed human. I'd like to see her then struggle off after David and Shaw, ending up as a stowaway on the juggernaught they fly off in. Consider a sequel where the three main characters are two androids (who don't exactly get along) and one human who is more than a little suspect of each of them.

[Bill Clay]

[Show spoiler]One of the best things in the movie was tension between Weyland and his daughter. There's no reason to ruin that by turning her into a Terminator.

[besi]

Originally Posted by ObiWanShinobi

Milburn....is a HERO? FFFWHAT?!? LOL.

[Show spoiler]If its for approaching the Hammerpede thats not what I would call heroic.

I remember hearing about a story of a guy who told his friend he could jump over/run over the hood of a car coming at him, Jackie Chan style er something, and ended up getting hit by the car and killed....I guess he's a "HERO" too, eh?

I just call him Deep Throat
he had the biggest BJ in the galaxy

[ObiWanShinobi]

Originally Posted by ToEhrIsHuman

I've been thinking more or less the same thing...

[Show spoiler]Vickers could be an android unaware she is an android. She could be a personal work of Weyland (who may not have any real offspring of his own), whilst David is just the newest model off the company assembly line. I would definitely be stoked in the sequel if they show Vickers rising up out of the cinders where she was shoved down by the juggernaught, leaving an imprint. She would then come to the realization (since she wasn't dead) that she wasn't indeed human. I'd like to see her then struggle off after David and Shaw, ending up as a stowaway on the juggernaught they fly off in. Consider a sequel where the three main characters are two androids (who don't exactly get along) and one human who is more than a little suspect of each of them.

Word .

[Show spoiler]I could imagine her standing from the rubble, helmet broken and her freaking out thinking shes about to die only to realize shes alive...maybe even have her raise her arm and notice part of it missing and to her horror seeing a white substance bleed out. I could only imagine how this would frustrate and piss her off thinking she was human the entire time.

IMO the story could go in so many interesting directions if this were true and if she happen to make it on the same juggernaut as Shaw and David. The idea of someone like Vickers only showing slight hints of humanity in the film coming to the realization she IS NOT human and throwing it ALL away to become some sort of villain is intriguing.

[BouCoupDinkyDau]

Originally Posted by ObiWanShinobi

Word .

[Show spoiler]I could imagine her standing from the rubble, helmet broken and her freaking out thinking shes about to die only to realize shes alive...maybe even have her raise her arm and notice part of it missing and to her horror seeing a white substance bleed out. I could only imagine how this would frustrate and piss her off thinking she was human the entire time.

IMO the story could go in so many interesting directions if this were true and if she happen to make it on the same juggernaut as Shaw and David. The idea of someone like Vickers only showing slight hints of humanity in the film coming to the realization she IS NOT human and throwing it ALL away to become some sort of villain is intriguing.

Ridley apparently played around with the idea at some point, and even teased at it prior to the film's release, but in the end, they said

[Show spoiler]she is human.

But who knows? The official cannon on that hasn't been firmly established in the actual film, so Ridley and his team can still play around with the idea in the sequel if they wanted too. Kinda how Lucas was unsure of Vader's relationship to Luke at first.

[Mooch360]

Originally Posted by DreamVillain

Anyone else having a problem with claiming their digital copy?

I go to claim the digital copy for iTunes and it says that may code is invalid. Anyone know who I can contact about this or a resolution to this problem?

Mine didn't work either. I emailed foxdigitalcopy@foxcustomercare.com. We shall see if I hear back from them....

[Badas]

Anyone notice this when they were using the touch?



Looks like an Alien temple.

Ta Dono

[Roy Batty]

Originally Posted by Bill Clay

[Show spoiler]One of the best things in the movie was tension between Weyland and his daughter. There's no reason to ruin that by turning her into a Terminator.

[Show spoiler]Well, some would say that Sir Ridley did exactly that already -to ruin the film, I mean- by turning Deckard into a replicant himself in BLADE RUNNER. Certainly, it can be argued that his story is much more powerful if it's about a human getting to feel for the replicants.

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by ObiWanShinobi

Oh, well nevermind then

My intention wasn't to embarrass you, only to inform.

Originally Posted by chip75

Director always beats writer in a game of Trump Cards though!

So I'll leave it in as a maybe, as Ridley definitely says 'maybe....'

Originally Posted by johnstrk

I keep wondering that too. Only Captain Janek knows for sure

Maybe she's a skin job!

Originally Posted by ToEhrIsHuman

I've been thinking more or less the same thing...

[Show spoiler]Vickers could be an android unaware she is an android. She could be a personal work of Weyland (who may not have any real offspring of his own), whilst David is just the newest model off the company assembly line. I would definitely be stoked in the sequel if they show Vickers rising up out of the cinders where she was shoved down by the juggernaught, leaving an imprint. She would then come to the realization (since she wasn't dead) that she wasn't indeed human. I'd like to see her then struggle off after David and Shaw, ending up as a stowaway on the juggernaught they fly off in. Consider a sequel where the three main characters are two androids (who don't exactly get along) and one human who is more than a little suspect of each of them.

Originally Posted by ObiWanShinobi

Word .

[Show spoiler]I could imagine her standing from the rubble, helmet broken and her freaking out thinking shes about to die only to realize shes alive...maybe even have her raise her arm and notice part of it missing and to her horror seeing a white substance bleed out. I could only imagine how this would frustrate and piss her off thinking she was human the entire time.

IMO the story could go in so many interesting directions if this were true and if she happen to make it on the same juggernaut as Shaw and David. The idea of someone like Vickers only showing slight hints of humanity in the film coming to the realization she IS NOT human and throwing it ALL away to become some sort of villain is intriguing.

If you watch de Lauzirika's Furious Gods and listen to the Scott commentary, you will hear Scott say that showing Vickers as

[Show spoiler]aloof and robotic was done to mislead the viewer

In addition, if you look at Ridley's sketches and notes in the Ridleygrams on the special features disc, he clearly shows Vickers

[Show spoiler]crushed to death. The words 'crushed' and 'dead' are in the notes.

Here is Lindelof's email:

From: Damon Lindelof
To: Josh Horowitz
Sent June 10, 2012, 7:26 p.m.

[Show spoiler]J,

Thanks for going a second time, but it is clear those cute zoo animals have soundly defeated us. Maybe the next time I try to convince Noomi Rapace to wear a rainbow-colored afro wig, she'll listen to me.

Vickers. Yes, she does look like David. Yes, this was intentional. What better way to piss off your daughter than to build the male equivalent of her? But enough about daddy issues (seriously, Lindelof, we get it!), allow me to answer your question. Is she a robot?

She is not.

But did Vickers somehow survive being smushed by the gigantic rolling horseshoe that was the derelict ship? Could her scantily-clad push-up training have saved her in that final moment of crushitude? And more importantly, WHY DIDN'T SHE JUST RUN ZIG-ZAGGY OR SIDEWAYS TO AVOID IT?!?

I don't have the answers to these questions, Josh. I'm just the writer.

Your Pal,

D

So, you have the answer from the writer and the director. And, as Lindelof said "I'm just the writer" Ridley Scott directed the writers as well as the actors and every other element of the production.

That said, I would like to see Theron

[Show spoiler]appear in Paradise, the Prometheus sequel. A novel way to do that would be to have a female version of David 8 in her image; Meredith 8 perhaps.

With both Weyland and Vickers dead, who will emerge from the board of directors to control the company? Will they send a followup mission to LV-223? The company has acquired the Engineers manual and they have other FTL ships. Perhaps a Meredith 8 is aboard on the followup mission to LV-223.

[Duffy12]

Originally Posted by BouCoupDinkyDau

Kinda how Lucas was unsure of Vader's relationship to Luke at first.

Or how he was unsure of Luke's relationship with his sister, or how he was unsure of Chewbacca's relationship with 3PO, orrrrr....oh never mind.

.