HDR Discussion Thread

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

A 60" KU6300. It's a total bust for UHD. While it has an "HDR mode" it's only 8-bit and 400nits so it sounds pretty pointless. Every pro-review makes it sound pretty pointless for HDR content, which is the main reason to go UHD. I never thought she would buy me a freakin' TV so I never said anything more specific than "I want to get a 4k TV soon." She saw a good deal on a "good brand" 4k TV and jumped on it.

It's a super cool gesture and gift, but I got a nice new 1080p TV a couple years ago specifically because I was going to wait until 4k sorted itself out a bit and get a high-functioning TV. This is a waste for that purpose. However it is also tempting to open it up tomorrow and make my 1200 blu-rays look a lot better. Then I can get a real HDR set in a couple more years.

I dunno. Conflicted.

Just say, "thank you, honey, for your thoughtfulness, but we need to make an exchange and here's why." Then get a Dolby Vision ready set.

[ray0414]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

A 60" KU6300. It's a total bust for UHD. While it has an "HDR mode" it's only 8-bit and 400nits so it sounds pretty pointless. Every pro-review makes it sound pretty pointless for HDR content, which is the main reason to go UHD. I never thought she would buy me a freakin' TV so I never said anything more specific than "I want to get a 4k TV soon." She saw a good deal on a "good brand" 4k TV and jumped on it.

It's a super cool gesture and gift, but I got a nice new 1080p TV a couple years ago specifically because I was going to wait until 4k sorted itself out a bit and get a high-functioning TV. This is a waste for that purpose. However it is also tempting to open it up tomorrow and make my 1200 blu-rays look a lot better. Then I can get a real HDR set in a couple more years.

I dunno. Conflicted.

Rtings retested and it does have a 10 bit panel. Has decent blacks too. I seen the ku6300 below a ku7500 and was surprised how much better the ku6300 looked, it has a glossier panel which makes it more vibrant.

This tv will also have youtube hdr, so you'll be able to look up some hdr right away and see how it looks.

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by ray0414

Rtings retested and it does have a 10 bit panel.

Oh really? I'll have to google that. That would be a push toward keeping it.

[ray0414]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

Oh really? I'll have to google that. That would be a push toward keeping it.

http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/ku6300


Not sure about that return window, but exchanging for a 60ks8000 and paying a few but more would net you WCG/quantum dots, 1000 additional nits, 120hz panel, moth eye anti glare.

[Penton-Man]

Regarding Tim and Andrew of BBC R&D and HLG…(audience questionnaire Don being from Sony Corporate), remember this old post reflecting back from my time at IBC 2015 - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...m#post12411408.

Anyway, heads-up as Tim and Andrew are coming to SMPTE educational webcast (no, one doesn’t have to travel all the way to Amsterdam like with IBC) next month….https://www.smpte.org/education/webc...nge-HLG-and-PQ

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

....I really don't know what to do.
Dammit!

I don’t envy your situation.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Regarding Tim and Andrew of BBC R&D and HLG…(audience questionnaire Don being from Sony Corporate), remember this old post reflecting back from my time at IBC 2015 - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...m#post12411408.

For big screen viewing convenience, direct link to the video clip of their past IBC presentation (a refresher to HLG, at the time)….https://tv.theiet.org/EmbedPlayer.html?id=6846

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by ray0414

Not sure about that return window, but exchanging for a 60ks8000 and paying a few but more would net you WCG/quantum dots, 1000 additional nits, 120hz panel, moth eye anti glare.

Indeed, and that was the original plan. Not at Christmas but sometime early next year. For me it is common sense. However telling her I am returning her present and spending $500 more (Best Buy current prices) would be an exercise in volcano diving. So I am trying to see if I can deal with this one.

[DanBa]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Finally, back to HLG (HDR) HFR...

PQ10 = HDR10 without static metadata
HLG10 = BBC/NHK HEVC HLG HDR



PQ10 = 24 / 25 / 30 / 50 / 60 fps HEVC main 10 level 5.1 HDR10 = legacy HDR10 without static metadata
HFR PQ10 = 100 / 120 fps HEVC main 10 level 5.2 HDR10 = HFR capable HDR10 without static metadata

HLG10 = 24 / 25 / 30 / 50 / 60 fps HEVC main 10 level 5.1 HLG HDR = HEVC HLG HDR
HFR HLG10 = 100 / 120 fps HEVC main 10 level 5.2 HLG HDR = HFR capable HEVC HLG HDR

https://www.dvb.org/standards#standardgroup_24




HLG deployment in North America:
http://satprnews.com/2016/12/19/trav...rth-america-2/

"LUXEMBOURG, 19 December 2016 -- SES S.A. (Euronext Paris and Luxembourg Stock Exchange: SESG) today announced that Travelxp 4K, an international travel channel, will make its Ultra HD debut next month on SES’s growing Ultra HD distribution platform serving cable operators and multichannel television platforms throughout North America.
Offering audiences compelling stories from faraway places, the world’s first 4K travel channel, Travelxp 4K, is set to launch on the SES-1 satellite, one of a trio of SES satellites (SES-1, SES-3, AMC-18) that are home to the region’s leading Ultra HD distribution platform.
The 4K channel follows the success of Travelxp HD, which offers 100% originally-produced premium travel and lifestyle programming distributed to over 50 million homes globally. Travelxp 4K will showcase global travel content with breathtaking images in 10 bit REC2020 color space with HLG (Hybrid Log Gamma) HDR (High Dynamic Range)."



HLG deployment in Japan:
https://twitter.com/uhd4k/status/762783054570065924
http://www.digitaltvnews.net/?p=27806

"SKY PerfecTV! to begin world’s first 4K HDR broadcast in October
4K HDR broadcasts have a wider dynamic range, particularly in the expression of the contrast between light and dark imagery, and enable even more true-to-life depictions. For its 4K HDR broadcasts, SKY Perfect JSAT adopted the Hybrid Log-Gamma (HLG) standard, which was co-developed by the public broadcasters NHK (Japan Broadcasting Corporation) and BBC (British Broadcasting Corporation). Moreover, while there is a variety of HDR techniques, HLG was developed as the most suitable format for broadcasting and HLG became an international standard in July this year. In response to the October commencement of 4K HDR broadcasts, a software update for Toshiba’s 4K Regza Z20X series is scheduled to become available for download from late August. The products of other companies are also scheduled to sequentially become 4K HDR-capable from this autumn."

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by DanBa

HFR

Although not photographed by any reporter at the past IFA (because it was not available to them), a snippet of the results of the scientific testing here showing the value of HFR (over that of lower native frame rate (50Hz) as well as a professional grade motion interpolation solution).
The test material consisted of several clips shown to over 30 independent observers to examine under controlled viewing conditions (background luminance, screen to eye distance, etc.).

The imagery displayed to the public at IFA on the TV frame grabbed on the left in your picture….

Originally Posted by DanBa

was sourced from imagery acquired by the EBU at a track and field event in Switzerland, 2nd picture from the left

[Penton-Man]

^ ‘BBC4’ test content was from a track and field event at a venue in the UK

[Penton-Man]

I love how things come together by thee end of a year(2nd paragraph) …..
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...t#post12672305

--> https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...r#post13027083

[Moe Szyslak]

My TV (65" Samsung UN65KS8000) apparently has "HDR 1000" technology. Pardon my ignorance, but can anyone explain whether or not this is a good HDR rating?

Thanks!

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by Moe Szyslak

My TV (65" Samsung UN65KS8000) apparently has "HDR 1000" technology. Pardon my ignorance, but can anyone explain whether or not this is a good HDR rating?

Thanks!

It means Samsung claims this set hits 1,000 peak lumens in HDR mode. UHD Premium Certified.

[StingingVelvet]

HDR definitely works on my Samsung cheapo, but it's also definitely dark. One assumes that is the small peak lumen number of 450 messing with it, though Rtings says the dark levels on the Samsung are good, so one assumes it would be dark anyway. Anyway, messing with the contrast boosting on the UHD player's tools menu makes it look a lot better, but accurate? Hmmm.

Also I did all my testing with Star Trek Into Darkness, got that looks pretty great, but then put in Deadpool and it looked terrible, totally blown out contrast. Fun fun.

[bruceames]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Yo, Bruce, when you started this thread, not quite the contributions you’d expected, eh? (photos from grading suites, SEI messages, nuances of HLG before it became a fashionable journalistic acronym, Robert's employment history, etc. Here, I’ll give you one as you like this sort of stuff…..
http://www.mesalliance.org/2016/12/2...lenges-remain/ as most of dem Ultra HD Blu-rays are HDR.

No, I had no idea, but I certainly like how it turned out.

[StingingVelvet]

Alright guys, all these tweaks and picture modes mess with the intended look. Boosting contrast in the player tools blows out contrast. Boosting brightness in the player settings softens the blacks. Turning on dynamic contrast messes with gamma and whatever else, causing an off picture. If you're using any of these methods to boost HDR it means you're not seeing an accurate picture. I know that doesn't bother everyone but it definitely bothers me.

I'll play a few more days looking for the magic recipe I can deal with, but overall I think weak HDR is worse than none. I'll probably return my Samsung player for one that can turn off HDR and see if I can groove with that like Geoff does.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by bruceames

No, I had no idea, but I certainly like how it turned out.

Well although not being a member here as far back as ’07, I know you’ve been involved in physical home media since thee olden days, so as we head into ’17, a reminiscent look back to a decade ago….

Sony Blu-ray Interview with Rich Marty & Don Eklund - YouTube

Note: Rich has since moved on to Dolby Laboratories…..https://www.linkedin.com/in/richmarty

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

upper far right frame grab pic is from HFR imagery shot at the World Equestrian Games.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

...so as we head into ’17

And so not to play studio V.P. favorites, addendum to the original post from 12-22-2016…
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...y#post13023759

Although no longer at ^ Disney , Annie , who is a new member of an exclusive Council (http://www.oscars.org/news/academys-...er-annie-chang) and who was the Vice President of Post-Production Technology for The Walt Disney Studios and is now at Marvel, left behind a fine mastering team at the mouse house.