Oh noes teh sky is falling!

[42041]

Originally Posted by NzYme

Once I buy it...I OWN IT. There's no policy change that's going to affect my purchase.

Not necessarily. It would be very easy to implement various DRM schemes to limit what you can legally do with your discs (and conversely, offer DRM-free movie downloads, though no studio would ever go for that). Game developers have already started clamping down on resale, where a second-hand owner may have to pay a fee to be able to play the game online.

[JasonHensley]

Originally Posted by 42041

Not necessarily. It would be very easy to implement various DRM schemes to limit what you can legally do with your discs (and conversely, offer DRM-free movie downloads, though no studio would ever go for that). Game developers have already started clamping down on resale, where a second-hand owner may have to pay a fee to be able to play the game online.

It's like digital fans are condoning their actions of not supporting physical media by proclaiming what studios could possibly do with physical media in the future. Meanwhile, in the here and now, supporting digital means you're supporting the end of paying retail price for something you physically own and have control over by paying full retail price for something digital that studios don't want you to own or have any control over.

[deltatauhobbit]

Originally Posted by 42041

Not necessarily. It would be very easy to implement various DRM schemes to limit what you can legally do with your discs (and conversely, offer DRM-free movie downloads, though no studio would ever go for that). Game developers have already started clamping down on resale, where a second-hand owner may have to pay a fee to be able to play the game online.

That makes me glad I'm a single player off-line gamer. Main reason why I haven't picked up titles like Destiny or Titanfall, after all, when they shut down the servers, you'll never be able to enjoy it again. I still see MAG on the shelves at Best Buy, really, the servers have been shut down for years so it's useless. I like to revisit older games once I've forgotten them enough to be a bit more shiny and new to me, playing online that's not really possible since I'd get pwned easily for being out of practice (if people would still play the ancient games I enjoy).

I've bought used games where the online pass is no longer good, doesn't bother me though as long as I can still enjoy the campaign. If movies start going down that path ("I'm sorry, you've already played this disc on 3 other devices, please buy another copy"), then I'm going full on pirate, AAAAARRRRRRR!!!! Fortunately, I think that will never happen to disc based media, but I can see that happening with digital copies.

[42041]

Originally Posted by JasonHensley

It's like digital fans are condoning their actions of not supporting physical media by proclaiming what studios could possibly do with physical media in the future. Meanwhile, in the here and now, supporting digital means you're supporting the end of paying retail price for something you physically own and have control over by paying full retail price for something digital that studios don't want you to own or have any control over.

To think "supporting" physical media or not is going to change a thing is naive. We're not steering the ship here. The studios will do what's in their financial interests, which are determined by an enormous market where your opinions and support are a loogie in an ocean. All you can really do is watch it happen.
Of course, the good news is that physical media will probably be a hardy niche for the forseeable future, but I suspect it will increasingly fade from mainstream relevance.

[popcorntreect]

Unpopular opinion: I think darkknightman has been on point on every argument. He's merely saying what perhaps everyone outside of the media-collecting world is thinking.

Also, I'd say Wal-Mart's probably done more damage to the country than anyone on the ballot in that voting booth so... gotta go with the booth.

[JasonHensley]

Originally Posted by 42041

To think "supporting" physical media or not is going to change a thing is naive. We're not steering the ship here. The studios will do what's in their financial interests, which are determined by an enormous market where your opinions and support are a loogie in an ocean. All you can really do is watch it happen.

Consumers do, in fact, steer the ship to a large degree. You seem to be a big defender of digital while always trying to find problems or could be problems with physical media. You and other people are already telling studios you don't care about ownership or control whenever you purchase something digital.

[JasonHensley]

Originally Posted by popcorntreect

Unpopular opinion: I think darkknightman has been on point on every argument. He's merely saying what perhaps everyone outside of the media-collecting world is thinking.

Also, I'd say Wal-Mart's probably done more damage to the country than anyone on the ballot in that voting booth so... gotta go with the booth.

He's spot on about what? That buying physical movies is akin to hoarding while amassing a digital collection isn't? Or that stable power is rarer than a stable internet connection?

[mredman]

Originally Posted by 42041

To think "supporting" physical media or not is going to change a thing is naive. We're not steering the ship here. The studios will do what's in their financial interests, which are determined by an enormous market where your opinions and support are a loogie in an ocean. All you can really do is watch it happen.

Nope. It will never happen. Besides studios earn billions around the Globe on physical media Like Blu-Ray. Noway in hell are they gonna throw away such a cash cow. Also i just saw Furious 7 commercial and it was music to my ears when the guy in the commercial said "own it on Blu-Ray"

[42041]

Originally Posted by JasonHensley

Consumers do, in fact, steer the ship to a large degree. You seem to be a big defender of digital while always trying to find problems or could be problems with physical media. You and other people are already telling studios you don't care about ownership or control whenever you purchase something digital.

Yes, in aggregate. What matters is the overall home video zeitgeist, which in recent years has been shifting away from physical media in big, measurable ways. These little indignant internet crowds of marginalized consumers don't add up to much in the grand scheme of things.

It might surprise you that I spend way more money on physical media than the $8/month I pay Netflix, and almost anyone I know in real life (it's been remarkable how everyone I know has simply stopped buying movies). Like I said, I value quality, and Netflix isn't there yet. But it doesn't take much foresight to see that's not going to save the physical release from nichedom much longer - and I don't care to worry much about things way out of my control.

[eiknarf]

But if blu-ray, DVD, or physical media for that matter, is dying, then why is another physical media format coming out?

[JasonHensley]

Originally Posted by 42041

Yes, in aggregate. What matters is the overall home video zeitgeist, which in recent years has been shifting away from physical media in big, measurable ways. These little indignant internet crowds of marginalized consumers don't add up to much in the grand scheme of things.

It might surprise you that I spend way more money on physical media than the $8/month I pay Netflix, and almost anyone I know in real life (it's been remarkable how everyone I know has simply stopped buying movies). Like I said, I value quality, and Netflix isn't there yet. But it doesn't take much foresight to see that's not going to save the physical release from nichedom much longer - and I don't care to worry much about things way out of my control.

My argument has never been against Netflix. I look at Netflix as basically a cable competitor. I'm talking about the people who are paying retail price for digital movies that they have no ownership or control over and actually want the market to fully go in that direction because, apparently, putting a disc in a tray is a strenuous activity.

[Chiefy]

Originally Posted by eiknarf

But if blu-ray, DVD, or physical media for that matter, is dying, then why is another physical media format coming out?

DVD decryption was broken a long time ago, and so were Blu-rays. New format will bring new, stronger decryption to try to halt piracy all over again. Has it been confirmed that we won't need to "phone home" to play back UHD Blu-rays?

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by popcorntreect

I was sorely disappointed when blu-rays debuted and they had the same crappy cover art as their dvd counterparts. I remember being surprised that this was a new format that, at the time, was being hyped and advertised pretty significantly and yet the studios expressed no willingness to make their product standout from dvds. I still loathe the blue cases. At least slipcovers doing a convincing job of hiding their ugliness. Criterion was a godsend with their transparent cases but it's been disappointing that no studio other than Twilight Time (finally) ever mimicked them. I think the studios have done a poor job of distinguishing blu-ray from dvd. Packaging may be superficial but it adds to the whole product and I think the studios really dropped the ball.

OK, done ranting.

Your argument here doesn't make much sense IMO. You say that you feel that the studios have done a poor job of distinguishing Blu-Ray from DVD, all while chastising the very thing that most easily and obviously sets them apart... the blue colored cases with the Blu-Ray logo front and center on the top of the case.

It's fine if you personally happen to not like them. I'm not criticizing your personal packaging astetic preferences. But the idea that the clear cases like Criterion uses would have done a better job of separating Blu-Ray from DVD is absurd. Aside from the height difference, there's really nothing about those cases that really make them stand out as being Blu-Rays. Honestly out of most types of Blu-Ray packaging, the Criterion style cases are amongst the worst at distinuishing themselves from DVD.

If a DVD and Blu-Ray in a standard blue case were side by side with the same artwork on both covers, it is pretty obvious which one is Blu-Ray. Now apply that same experiment, but replace the blue BD case with a Criterion stye BD case (but still having the same artwork as the DVD). Joe-average who at best has minimal knowledge about these things is far more likely to not tell the difference in the latter scenario.

Even the slipcover argument is kind of silly (even though I do like slipcovers). It was one thing back when most slipcovers still had the BD logo front and center on the top of the packaging. Now with maybe the exception of Disney, most studios, if it is a combo pack, just put something like "Blu-Ray+DVD+Digital HD" in very plain looking text. It's not 'difficult' to distinguish it from just the DVD release, but IMO it is still less obvious. And then when a movie is just the BD disc (no DVD or DC included), and it has a slip, such text is usually missing entirely.


I'm sure the studios and other interested parties could have done more to educate the public and let them know the difference. But to say that the typical BD case doesn't distinuish itself well enough is downright silly.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

Your blu ray is contingent on your electricity working. Do you worry about your power grid going down? The chance of losing electricity is much higher than losing your internet. If there is a problem with my connection I am sure I can find something else to do. When I talk about the stress that comes with owning things, this post is a prime example. And again,a physical media owner speaking about those who enjoy streaming in a condescending tone.

I personally have had my internet go down (comparatively) far more often than I've had the power go out. There was a point where like clock work, every two to three months there would be an issue that took a couple/few days to get resolved. I can't specifically recall the last time my power went out. It has happened, but on average it couldn't be more than once a year, typically during some kind of storm. And in those instances, it's typically down for a few hours at most.

I'm not opposed to using Netflix and the like when it makes sense for me, but it will never replace physical media for me.

The problem with any streaming/download service is that you are dependent on:
-your internet working at a reasonable speed for your streaming/downloading 'needs'
-the companies/services that you rent/buy from to continually be in business and never go under to allow you to re-stream/redownload content when wanted/needed.
-The studios to allow access to tiles to be maintained (they can pretty much pull access at anytime if they want to).
-Electricity to power your HT equipment AND your internet modem.


Out of all of those things, the only one that is needec to be able to watch a Blu-Ray is electricity to run the equipment.

If a store that I buy a Blu-Ray fom goes out of business, I still have my Blu-Ray. All the other concerns don't exist.

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by thegrunter

Oh, that's rich.

I just love entitled consumer stories. Endlessly hilarious.

It was their advertising, how is that "entitled customer"

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

Why do you think hoarding is just about disorganization and junk? Try getting rid of all of your blu rays. Can you do it? Will it cause you stress? Is your collection huge in number?

What if you had to get rid of your ENTIRE digital collection? Could you do it? Would it cause you stress to know that you would no longer hae access to ANY of that content?

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by Clark Kent

All businesses that sell easily digitized intellectual property want to remove the analog loophole of physical ownership. It underlies much of the corporate agenda for music and movies. Completely controlled content in the digital domain has always been the primary end goal.

The difference is music is DRM-free from iTunes and Amazon Music. After purchase, I can burn it to a CD or anything else. You actually OWN the digital music. Movies and TV shows have DRM, so you don't actually own them.

[JasonHensley]

Originally Posted by Scarface32

It was their advertising, how is that "entitled customer"

You downloaded a free app and received 2 free books. I wouldn't call any company evil that gave you several free things. You're really exaggerating how bad they treated you and coming off entitled.

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by JasonHensley

You downloaded a free app and received 2 free books. I wouldn't call any company evil that gave you several free things. You're really exaggerating how bad they treated you and coming off entitled.

False advertising is illegal. Weather or not you get something "for free" (remember, I had to spend bandwidth to download, thus not 100% free).

If it says in the advertising 5 books, and you only get 2, that's false advertising.

I'm sorry that you'd rather roll over and let corporations kick you, but I believe in the justice system and what they did was illegal. It was false advertising.

[darkknightman]

Originally Posted by JasonHensley

He's spot on about what? That buying physical movies is akin to hoarding while amassing a digital collection isn't? Or that stable power is rarer than a stable internet connection?

Wow. Talk about completely misrepresenting my views. I already clarified that collecting can reach levels of hoarding, not that all collecting is hoarding. And I only stated that I personally have had more issues with electricity outages than internet.