Oh noes teh sky is falling!

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by gates70

Yup. Most people I know just want to see it and don't care how. They don't want to spend the money on something that can be had for free is what they say. They sure like watching movies in my HT when the occasion prevents itself though! They just wouldn't want to spend the money to build something like mine.

Yeah, everyone I know but me pirates everything that isn't on Netflix, Hulu or HBO Go. My family, my wife's family, our friends, my students, my co-workers, her co-workers. Hell my wife even makes it perfectly clear she would be pirating if it weren't for me stopping her. When I argue with these people that they are taking the experience without compensating the creators and investors they all just give me dumb looks and say "but it's free on the internet why pay for it?" They just don't get it and don't care to try and get it. They don't even understand why shows they pirated and loved get canceled for low ratings.

[gates70]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

Yeah, everyone I know but me pirates everything that isn't on Netflix, Hulu or HBO Go. My family, my wife's family, our friends, my students, my co-workers, her co-workers. Hell my wife even makes it perfectly clear she would be pirating if it weren't for me stopping her. When I argue with these people that they are taking the experience without compensating the creators and investors they all just give me dumb looks and say "but it's free on the internet why pay for it?" They just don't get it and don't care to try and get it. They don't even understand why shows they pirated and loved get canceled for low ratings.

It always drives me nuts when one of my friends or employees comes to me and says "hey, did you see 'x' movie that's out at the theatre ?"....me: "No, not yet, waiting for the Blu"....them: "Want to see it, I have it on my flash drive".

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by gates70

It always drives me nuts when one of my friends or employees comes to me and says "hey, did you see 'x' movie that's out at the theatre ?"....me: "No, not yet, waiting for the Blu"....them: "Want to see it, I have it on my flash drive".

It's just so culturally accepted at this point no one thinks twice. All my students talk about streaming movies out in theaters. I even went to my doctor's office a while back and the secretary was watching Civil War on his phone, asking me if I wanted the link. I told him I will wait for it to come out officially and he literally asked me what that meant, he had no idea he was even watching something unauthorized. When I tried explaining the legalities he said "well I just click and it plays, I dunno."

I really feel like most people are so simple on this topic they don't even understand you're buying more than a disc and packaging with a DVD or BD, you're buying access to the movie. I think common thought right now is that media is free on the internet and you buy a disc for extras or packaging (or better quality if you're the one in a million who cares). Thus, as the article says, most people are not buying digital movies because why would you?

[gates70]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

It's just so culturally accepted at this point no one thinks twice. All my students talk about streaming movies out in theaters. I even went to my doctor's office a while back and the secretary was watching Civil War on his phone, asking me if I wanted the link. I told him I will wait for it to come out officially and he literally asked me what that meant, he had no idea he was even watching something unauthorized. When I tried explaining the legalities he said "well I just click and it plays, I dunno."

I really feel like most people are so simple on this topic they don't even understand you're buying more than a disc and packaging with a DVD or BD, you're buying access to the movie. I think common thought right now is that media is free on the internet and you buy a disc for extras or packaging (or better quality if you're the one in a million who cares). Thus, as the article says, most people are not buying digital movies because why would you?

The other atrocity in your story is that he was watching it on his phone.

[wvuwhat]

Abandoned: Blockbuster

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by Rich1631

piracy is a huge cause to the fall of the home video market. I don't kno anybody who actually buys movies besides me. They all download stuff illegally.

Sorry but I'm not buying that. Do you honestly believe that if people weren't torrenting or downloading all the stuff they do that they would pay for it instead? Lol, people who download tons of movies/music/whatever are like hoarders - they take it because it's free and it's there. I've known coworkers who download everything they find - and that includes comics, movies, porn, and probably anything else you can think of. With 4-5TB hard drives it's easier than ever to fill them up with whatever you see and look through it at your convenience. People certainly would not be spending thousands or tens of thousands of dollars to buy them on disc if they weren't online for free. Who has that kind of money? There has been study after study that shows that not all downloads equal lost sales. In fact I would say most don't. People that download either A) don't have any desire to own the product on physical media, or B) can't afford it. Either way, those are not people who would be buying the product no mater what.

Also, several European studies have shown that often the biggest downloaders are also the biggest customers who buy the most media compared to people who don't download.

Piracy is a complicated issue and I suspect there are lots of reasons why people do it. It would help the situation if people would stop spreading FUD and look at the situation logically. I think there are many reasons why media sales are dropping in recent years, and I don't think piracy is the sole contributor, or even the biggest contributor. Lack of product in retail stores, the availability of streaming, disinterest in re-buying movies for a 2nd/3rd/4th/5th time, buying in the used market - and I'm sure many more that all contribute to dropping sales.

I ran into an old friend/co-worker last year, and I asked him if he still collects films. He used to buy tons of DVDs, many blind-buys just walking into Best Buy. He was always a stickler for quality, and had a great surround setup with a Sony Wega TV. I asked him if he has a big blu-ray collection now. He replied that he doesn't really buy movies any more. It was getting more and more costly for him, and these days he just streams everything from Netflix and Amazon. He said sure the quality isn't as good as blu-ray but it's good enough for him to enjoy the films and with life, marriage, etc. he's just moved onto more important things in life than collecting films he may only watch once.

That's just one example but I think it's interesting because he always had easy access to torrents and co-workers would always bring in newly-downloaded movies and TV shows. Yet he always bought his DVDs (he sometimes watched the torrented stuff but he always bought anything he liked enough to own). When he was telling me he doesn't buy movies any more, it wasn't because he downloads instead - it's because he streams - legally. I suspect that's a far bigger reason people aren't buying movies as much these days. It's easy and convenient and that's what people want. Sadly quality takes a back seat to many people.

Like I said, it's a complicated issue, but to blame dropping sales figures on piracy alone is ridiculous. BTW, I used to copy tons of VHS tapes back when I was a teenager in the 80's, just like almost everyone else I knew back then. I also taped songs off the radio. Did that kill VHS sales or destroy the music industry? Remember, the movie industry went to court to block the retail sale of VHS recorders, claiming that it would destroy the movie industry. How did that work out? So yeah, I don't believe the numbers they throw around farther than I can throw them.

[Truewitt]

Piracy isn't really an issue. The issue is that people are not going to pay for something they can eventually watch the same way when it goes to one of the streaming services. "Why would I pay $20 for a movie I can watch for free on Netflix?" is the attitude.

[bigshot]

Originally Posted by mar3o

Sorry but I'm not buying that. Do you honestly believe that if people weren't torrenting or downloading all the stuff they do that they would pay for it instead?

I can only speak for myself... I've spent more money on media (music, movies, etc.) in my lifetime than I have on my house and every car I've ever owned combined. Hundreds of thousands of dollars. Nowadays I mostly buy used, with the exception of blu-rays.

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by Truewitt

Piracy isn't really an issue. The issue is that people are not going to pay for something they can eventually watch the same way when it goes to one of the streaming services. "Why would I pay $20 for a movie I can watch for free on Netflix?" is the attitude.

Precisely. Netflix and Amazon are far more responsible for declining sales than "piracy".

[dadaluholla]

Originally Posted by bigshot

I can only speak for myself... I've spent more money on media (music, movies, etc.) in my lifetime than I have on my house and every car I've ever owned combined. Hundreds of thousands of dollars.

That's not really something to brag about

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by bigshot

I can only speak for myself... I've spent more money on media (music, movies, etc.) in my lifetime than I have on my house and every car I've ever owned combined. Hundreds of thousands of dollars. Nowadays I mostly buy used, with the exception of blu-rays.

That's overkill, but you kind of made my point - it can become an incredibly expensive hobby, and most people who download/torrent/hoard don't have that kind of money. So their downloads would not be magically turned into cash for Hollywood if only they could stamp out piracy - it won't make any difference. You can't squeeze blood from a stone. Most people are unable or unwilling to afford a big movie collection these days, especially when you can have an all-you-can-eat buffet of legal streaming for so little cost per month. They don't care that they won't have access to their films later if Netflix drops them - for most people, movies are just something to watch casually - if it's not there, they'll watch something else.

[bigshot]

Originally Posted by dadaluholla

That's not really something to brag about

You haven't seen my theater!

One other thing that has had a huge impact on sales of physical media is eBay and Amazon. It used to be that I would go to Tower Records once a week and browse for new releases. There seemed to be an ocean of legacy titles there to choose from. I would drop a big chunk of money every week.

Now, it seems that aside from blu-ray, there is very little in the way of new legacy titles being released. Warner Archive is the only place I buy new DVDs any more, and all of the back catalog DVDs and CDs I am interested in are on Amazon or eBay for just a few bucks used. I have Netflix and Hulu, but I mostly use them for new releases that I want to see but don't need to own.

Between used and streaming, most of my bases are covered. I was much more of a consumer of media in the past. Today, I still am, but only for blu-rays of classic films to upgrade my existing DVD copies. I'm not married to physical media. In fact, I prefer Plex or Kodi's Netflix style interface to walls of discs covering the shelves. If I could conveniently download movies on my home server, I would gladly abandon shiny silver discs altogether. But I have two requirements... The downloads need to be equivalent quality to the physical disc and no DRM.

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by balthazar_bee

And the weird thing is that it's such a golden age for physical media. There's practically a deluge of awesome catalog titles being released. Just hope it's sustainable.

I agree that there are tons of awesome releases coming out. So many I can't buy them all. But how many are in the stores? Almost none of them. When people browse through the aisles at Best Buy and Wal-Mart and target, they get the impression that blu-ray is a dying format that never really took off. I think if people could see the vast amount of excellent releases out there, especially older 80's films and classics, I think blu-ray might have fared better. Instead, the blu-ray selection is pathetic in most retail stores, leading people to believe that blu-ray is not well supported by the studios.

[dadaluholla]

Originally Posted by bigshot

You haven't seen my theater!

True. That would probably be worth it then [emoji1360]

In my own situation, after years and years of buying so much media (DVDs, blu-rays, games, books, CDs), I just really regret it all now. I'd much rather have that extra cash back to put into things like my home or car.

I don't buy much of anything anymore. If there's a movie I really want to see, we go to the theater. If not I'll catch it on a streaming service or something whenever it's added

[bigshot]

Blu-ray is basically a dying format. Very few of my friends buy them. I think blu-ray is just a temporary ancillary market for the studios until they build a workable model for streaming. Netflix and Amazon Prime are the pioneers there, but I foresee more than that. I think that the studios are systematically transferring their libraries to HD preparing for the eventual cloud based system that they will own and control for themselves.

One big problem with blu-ray is the expectation of quality. I see people complaining in this forum regularly about minor artifacting and mastering errors or a short missing scene that got clipped out without anyone noticing. This stuff must drive the studios nuts, because the devil is in the details. Netflix has none of those expectations. The studios don't want to spend time polishing one single movie to perfection. They want to crank it all out and not worry about the details.

[eiknarf]

There's just so tooooo many ways to watch or buy movies now, that everything has thinned.
When there was just DVD and just BRICK AND MORTAR STORES, the DVD section was natural PACKED!!! Right?
That's not the case now. You can buy DVD or Blu-ray or 4K Blu at hundreds of online locations. And if you dont want a physical disc, you have the dozens of streaming diskless ways of watching.

[bigshot]

Originally Posted by dadaluholla

In my own situation, after years and years of buying so much media (DVDs, blu-rays, games, books, CDs), I just really regret it all now. I'd much rather have that extra cash back to put into things like my home or car.

There is a theory that the degree in interest in music and movies is directly inverse to the frequency of being laid. I still have passion for music and movies, so that should tell you something.

[mar3o]

I meant to share this on the forum a couple weeks ago but forgot. This is the perfect thread to share it.

I was getting my haircut a couple weekends ago and my haircutter was talking about horror movies with me. The last time he cut my hair he suggested a couple films so we started talking about other titles. Keep in mind he appears to be in his early 20's. He brought up that he just pre-ordered "Waxwork" on blu-ray from Lionsgate on their new "Vestron" blu-ray label. I was amazed he mentioned that because I was just talking about the pre-order with my girlfriend that morning. He said he's been upgrading his movie collection into blu-rays lately and he just typed this one into Amazon not expecting to actually see it come up, when to his surprise the pre-order came up. He said he buys lots of blu-rays and especially horror films. He told me he loves the quality and loves having his collection on his shelf.

So I'm not convinced that people buying blu-ray movies are as rare as some in here would lead you to believe. Clearly a lot less people are buying blu-rays than DVD back in the day, but I think buying blu-rays isn't the freakish thing some people think it is in here. The odds that my haircutter would bring up the same exact 80's horror title that I was just talking about that morning sounds pretty slim, yet it happened.

[50strat54]

Do you notice that DVD is the generic term for films on disc? When an actor goes on a talk show he generally never says bluray but " the DVD is coming out soon with this bonus feature." It's almost never bluray, it's usually DVD.

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by 50strat54

Do you notice that DVD is the generic term for films on disc? When an actor goes on a talk show he generally never says bluray but " the DVD is coming out soon with this bonus feature." It's almost never bluray, it's usually DVD.

Force of habit. Another decade it will change to something else.